African Cichlids

[Konrade]

Okay, I am a sw person and I have a 10 gallon fw with some danios. I really want cichlids, don't know too much about them, but I like firmeouths, frontosas, and texas cichlids. Frontosa's get huge, I know and I am planning a 55 gallon tank. Probably cross it out. I'm a real newbie with cichlids, but Im sure I can handle it. Here are some thing s I know.
African cichlids-tanganyika, malawi, mbuna??hard water, love veggies,pretty much species only
S.american-soft water, smaller? not too much else.

I'm not too sure what the cichlids I listed above would be put under or where they are from. Can you guys give some ingo on compatibility and tank designs? If I go with Africans, what kind do you suggest? Slate and rock and I would like the gravel better for the africans, but should I go with sand instead for buffering? Any info GREATLY appreciated.

[Konrade]

Also, eating habits???

[Fishyfanatic]

If you go with Africans, you'll probably be looking at Mbuna's. The Haps are going to become too big for a 55 [acronym:1567d6c7d3="Gallon"]gal[/acronym:1567d6c7d3] tank. Most Mbuna's can be kept in a 55 to 75 [acronym:1567d6c7d3="Gallon"]gal[/acronym:1567d6c7d3] tank. That's not to say that they all can, but most will. They prefer lots of rock work and sand. The sand is not for the buffering but more for the preference of the fish. They love to dig and sand is easier for them to move. Plus, don't purchase sand that claims to buffer water. If you naturally have a higher pH (7.4 on up) you won't need any additives. Crushed coral in the canister will also naturally increase the pH without having to see it in the tank. Its best to have substrate that doesn't have jaggid edges. Normal pool filter sand works great for these guys. Plenty of hiding places are a must since they are aggressive. I can't offer any info on the S.A. Cichlids since I don't own any, but I hope this helps.

[rich311k]

Depends on the S. american. There is a large variety. Firemouths are semi aggresive. 55 would be fine. Texas get big and mean. They need a lot of room.

[esaone]

Slate and rock and I would like the gravel better for the africans, but should I go with sand instead for buffering?

If you go w/ Africans you should use crushed coral or a product called Eco-Complete for substrate. Both of these would be way easier than sand for you. Also if you are looking at fish, go w/ Mbuna because they don’t get huge and you could stock a bunch. I can’t really suggest any particular group or species because you didn’t say if you want a species or group tank.

Also if you want to do an SA tank I would recomend A single Green Terror. They are great and from what I've been told buy several experts you can keep them in a 55.

[Fishyfanatic]

I wouldn't use the crushed coral as a substrate. Instead put it in the filter. The sand will be easier for the fish to move. Nothing sharp should be as a substrate. They will rub their bodies on the substrate occasionally and sharp pieces will cut them. Plus, heavier sands like pool filter sand won't get sucked into the filter like the lighter [acronym:96682344b5="Local Fish Store"]lfs[/acronym:96682344b5] sand. If you don't have the filter yet, a canister is going to be your best bet. Africans are very messy and will require a good filtration.

[poppab02]

You can start here
http://www.cichlid-forum.com/article...cutter_55g.php
It gives a list of cookie cutter setups for a 55 gallon
I've used alot of different substrates on cichlids and I'm convinced that sand is the way to go. I simply use playsand from the local hardware store. It's extremely cheap and works well. There have been a ton of topics on this in the website so just do a search on playsand. It's pretty easy to do and is cheap and good for the fish.

Here's some very general information
Africans----Seperated into Lake Malawi and Lake Tanganyika African Cichlids
I know very little about Tanganyika Cichlids, besides a few staple types they aren't readily available in most [acronym:c071fefebf="Local Fish Store"]lfs[/acronym:c071fefebf] [acronym:c071fefebf="In My Experience"]ime[/acronym:c071fefebf]. I'll let somebody who knows more on them fill you in on them
Lake Malawi cichlids are divided into Haps, Mbuna, and Peacocks.
Haps and Peacocks are generally a bit larger and carnivores, they like live or frozen food as a major part of their diet.
Mbuna are generally a bit smaller and herbivores, therefore they love veggies. Most of the "african cichlids" you see in a store are mbuna. Also they are generally cheaper than other african cichlids.
Don't mix africans between divisions. Don't put Haps with Mbuna, or Mbuna with Peacocks and so on. It's just not good for the fish.
Generally, Africans like higher [acronym:c071fefebf="power head or Measure of the concentration of hydrogen ions, depending on context"]ph[/acronym:c071fefebf] and harder water. Also, generally you are going to be able to keep more africans in a smaller amount of space than New World aka American Cichlids.

American Cichlids
Generally larger and need soft water and lower [acronym:c071fefebf="power head or Measure of the concentration of hydrogen ions, depending on context"]ph[/acronym:c071fefebf]. Alot of the American cihlids available in stores grow to monstrous sizes. There are a ton of varieties from discus to Oscars so I won't waste my time going through all the varieties.

Basically, you are going to have to narrow it down. I recommend going with whatever your water you use on tanks naturally is. If it's hard, go with africans. If its soft, go with American cichlids.

Also, plan on investing serious money into filtration. all cichlids are messy and can really foul up an underfiltrated tank in no time.

[Konrade]

I am not sure what the [acronym:b7660263b2="power head or Measure of the concentration of hydrogen ions, depending on context"]ph[/acronym:b7660263b2] on my tap water is, i need to test it. So, Africans around [acronym:b7660263b2="power head or Measure of the concentration of hydrogen ions, depending on context"]ph[/acronym:b7660263b2] of 8 and use sand or other substrate? I like new worlds, and I like a variety of fish. I don't know too much about the different kinds of fw fish at all, so all help is appreciated. I like malawi the most and peacocks probably the best, so their is no chance of mixing them?? Also, I really want needlefish in there, ands they like a lower [acronym:b7660263b2="power head or Measure of the concentration of hydrogen ions, depending on context"]ph[/acronym:b7660263b2], would they be compatible with S.A cichlids as long as the cichlids are big enough not to get eaten? Stocking list:
2 needlefish
2 firemouths
2 angels
not sure what else.. have too think about it. Does it sound good? I'm so used to the sw stoocking rules, it feels REALLY good to be able to keep more fish

[rich311k]

Angels and firemouths might not mix that well. Firemouths are much more aggresive. I had to remove one from an angel tank because he was harassing my angels constantly. I dont know what a needlefish is.

[Fishyfanatic]

You can mix Peacocks and Mbunas but you will need a large tank and you can't overcrowd. I currently have Haps, Peacocks, and Mbunas living together very well. But we also have a larger tank and each fish has a hiding spot, plus a few extras. Africans prefer a sand substrate, so you'll be good going that route. They don't have to have a pH of 8, but it would be good. Some say that you need it to breed, but mine are breeding like rabbits in 7.6 with soft water.

Needlefish definately won't mix with the Africans. I'm not sure on their compatibility with S.A. since I've never kept them before.