African Cichlids in community tank.... ticking time bomb???

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Iris135

Aquarium Advice Regular
Joined
Feb 27, 2013
Messages
58
Location
Texas
Hello everyone! This is my first post on this website and I am new to the hobby. We have had our tank for about 4 months now. I am just looking for some opinions and advice on our setup.

We have a 29 gallon coffee table tank. It has 2 Tetra Whisper 40i filters on it. The tank is artificially planted because there is no overhead light. The tank is actually lit from underneath; the light shines through translucent rocks and gravel (which is causing algae problems, but that is a whole new thread). There is a large piece of driftwood and many hiding places. We do water changes twice a week. The tank was stocked with 1 opaline gourami, 1 red tail shark, 5 tiger barbs and 6 zebra dannios.

My fiancé and I went to a local pet store just to look around. We explained our tank set-up to the attendant and she recommended that we try cichlids. She said the she had a couple in her 55- gallon community tank with giant dannios and some other fish and they co-existed just fine. I was quite skeptical, but we left the store with 1 electric yellow cichlid (2 inches long) and 1 “assorted African” cichlid (about 2.5 – 3 inches long). I have no idea what type of cichlid it is, I will try to post a picture of it later.

After adding the cichlids, I wholeheartedly expected the tank to be destroyed in the morning. However, it has been over 6 weeks since the cichlids have been added, and everything is going fine. All of the fish are visible and active. The first day we added the cichlids, the gourami was quite aggressive towards them and all the other fish as well. Now, he only chases the larger cichlid from time to time.

I just have questions about the set-up of our tank… Does anyone else have experience with cichlids in a community tank? Is the rather large number of fish curbing aggressive behavior? Could the gourami be keeping the cichlids in check? (He is the largest fish and clearly king of the tank.) Will the cichlids become more aggressive when they reach a certain size? In the back of my mind, I am still expecting a random massacre, but my fiancé thinks they will be just fine. I have read that electric yellow cichlids are among the least aggressive of its African counterparts. I do suspect that we may have to remove the larger cichlid at some point as it grows.

Thanks for your advice! :)
 
I don't think that stock is gonna pan out in the long run. Do you know type of cichlids they are?

In any event. I think the tank is pretty well stocked and you'll probably benefit from upgraded the filtration oh... And your fish will benefit as well.

Some cichlids get up to 4"-6" some even bigger. Your tank isn't equipment to handle all that. African cichlids will get very aggressive once reaching maturity.

Ok re read your post again. So that's 16 fish in a 29 gallon? The cichlids you have sound like Africans they can be aggressive.
 
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African cichlids are tricky when it comes to community tanks, especially when you aren't sure the species of the "assorted African cichlid". My advice to you, and the advice I give to all my customers with this kind of situation is watch the fins of the other fish. If the cichlids are going to turn aggressive, and they probably will unfortunately, the first think they got for is fins. Predatory fish, particularly the smaller ones that can't one bite their prey, have adapted to faster more agile fish by going for the fins first. Think about it like this: if you want to disable a moving car the first thing you have to do is get it to stop moving, or at least slow it down to where you can take control of the vehicle. That's what cichlids do, they take away the speed and agility of the prey fish. Your tank could run for months without having any problems, and there is a small chance that it will never have any problems, however, African cichlids become more and more aggressive with size, particularly to species that look similar or behave similarly. If I were you, I'd keep a sharp eye out for any sign of fin damage on any of the fish. If you start seeing damage, it's time to take them out before you start losing fish. Good luck, I hope everything works out for you and your tank.
 
Why not avoid the situation all together and bring them back? Not to mention most will tell you there require different water parameters.
 
African cichlids are tricky when it comes to community tanks, especially when you aren't sure the species of the "assorted African cichlid". My advice to you, and the advice I give to all my customers with this kind of situation is watch the fins of the other fish. If the cichlids are going to turn aggressive, and they probably will unfortunately, the first think they got for is fins. Predatory fish, particularly the smaller ones that can't one bite their prey, have adapted to faster more agile fish by going for the fins first. Think about it like this: if you want to disable a moving car the first thing you have to do is get it to stop moving, or at least slow it down to where you can take control of the vehicle. That's what cichlids do, they take away the speed and agility of the prey fish. Your tank could run for months without having any problems, and there is a small chance that it will never have any problems, however, African cichlids become more and more aggressive with size, particularly to species that look similar or behave similarly. If I were you, I'd keep a sharp eye out for any sign of fin damage on any of the fish. If you start seeing damage, it's time to take them out before you start losing fish. Good luck, I hope everything works out for you and your tank.

Why just tell your clients to return the fish so they could avoid a possible blood bath. I tried giant danios and tiger barbs. They were toasts in a weeks time! Not a good idea especially in such a small tank.
 
Not to mention a red tail "shark" can get 4" and should be in at least a 55 gallon.

Yellow lab as well... 4" and should be in at least a 55 gallon.

Just my opinion but your set up for disaster. Not your fault and I'm blaming you at all. It's poor information on the let stores part.

I'm glad your here to the help!! Welcome!
 
Oh this is right up my alley.. I've just recently learned that a mixed community didn't work for me. I had all the mixes going, South American, Asian, African you name it. I had them all living together in my 65 gal. It ran smooth sailing (I even thought at one point HA! I've proved them wrong!!) Then I started noticing some HUGE changes in behaviors. My fish started fighting for dominance. I thought its ok thats normal.. Until other fish started "taking the boss on" it seemed like every other day there was turmoil in my tank. It got to the point where it didn't even look like I had ANY fish in there because everyone was hiding all the time. My advice to you.. decide which of the fish you like best and follow your research. Some mixes work and others don't IME mixing Africans DOESN'T.
 
Why just tell your clients to return the fish so they could avoid a possible blood bath. I tried giant danios and tiger barbs. They were toasts in a weeks time! Not a good idea especially in such a small tank.

I agree, but after spending years in the industry you begin to understand that sometimes customers are dead set on what they want and could care less what advice you have to say. You can lead a horse to water, but you can't make him drink.
 
I agree, but after spending years in the industry you begin to understand that sometimes customers are dead set on what they want and could care less what advice you have to say. You can lead a horse to water, but you can't make him drink.

Very true... I agree there and have echoed those words too many times. Must be frustrating at times no? I probably frustrated you lol. I'm sure you've heard it all.
 
Thanks everyone! Like I said, I was skeptical about the advice from the local pet store. We plan to get a 55 gallon in the future and will likely move the cichlids there if we get it set up in enough time. I watch the tank everyday for signs of aggression. As soon as a see any behavior problems or signs of fin damage, the cichlids will have to go. I put in the parameters of our tank on aqadvisor.com and it said that our set up is ok for the amount of fish we have.
 
Thanks everyone! Like I said, I was skeptical about the advice from the local pet store. We plan to get a 55 gallon in the future and will likely move the cichlids there if we get it set up in enough time. I watch the tank everyday for signs of aggression. As soon as a see any behavior problems or signs of fin damage, the cichlids will have to go. I put in the parameters of our tank on aqadvisor.com and it said that our set up is ok for the amount of fish we have.

I would use that site aquadvisor lightly IMO not the greatest site to use.
 
IMO
You need to re home the cichlids and the shark. You can maybe get a way with a apisto or ram and maybe a bristlenose pleco. I'd have to say your pretty stocked now.

The reason why African cichlids need to be in a 55+ is because of aggression and size. The bigger the footprint a tank has the better for them. It can be done in smaller tanks but the fish are harder to find in those cases. Yellow labs are one of the most peaceful out of mbuna cichlids and may be why it's been ok for now. But it's hard saying how it's going to end
 
IMO
You need to re home the cichlids and the shark. You can maybe get a way with a apisto or ram and maybe a bristlenose pleco. I'd have to say your pretty stocked now.

The reason why African cichlids need to be in a 55+ is because of aggression and size. The bigger the footprint a tank has the better for them. It can be done in smaller tanks but the fish are harder to find in those cases. Yellow labs are one of the most peaceful out of mbuna cichlids and may be why it's been ok for now. But it's hard saying how it's going to end

I don't plan on adding more fish, even after removing the cichlids. I know that eventually the shark will get too large for the tank. We tried 3 bristlenose plecos, one after another, and they all died. Not sure why, I tested the water and it was fine and there is a large piece of wood for them. I'm also considering removing one of the schools of fish to another tank, can't decide whick one though.
 
Actually, the AqAdvisor doesn't list a 29 gallon coffee table tank. It gives you an option between a 29 high or a 29 biocube, so I used the second one.

Before I got to your cichlids - which can't be identified for certain from what you've said, although I expect your electric yellow cichlid is a Labidochromis caeruleus - the AqAdvisor said you were 90% stocked, and gave the warning about the mature size of the shark.

When I added the yellow lab, I got the following warning:
Warning: Yellow Lab is not recommended for your tank - it may eventually outgrow your tank space, potentially reaching up to 4.5 inches.
Warning: At least 5 x Yellow Lab are recommended in a group.
Warning: Yellow Lab is not recommended to be with Opaline Gourami - mbuna species should not be mixed with other groups.
Warning: Yellow Lab is not recommended to be with Red Tailed Black Shark - mbuna species should not be mixed with other groups.
Warning: Yellow Lab is not recommended to be with Tiger Barb - mbuna species should not be mixed with other groups.
Warning: Yellow Lab is not recommended to be with Zebra Danio - mbuna species should not be mixed with other groups.
Note: You have selected mbuna species. These species in general, need to be overstocked to control aggression (over 100% stocking level). Make sure your filtration is sufficient and keep up with water changes.


The AqAdvisor noted that the tank was 101% stocked after adding the yellow lab.

It's not possible to adequately identify the "mixed African cichlid," but that would only add to the bioload in the tank, and most likely, would result in more aggression.

I think the AqAdvisor actually is telling you this is not the right combination of fish, and I'd agree.
 
Actually, the AqAdvisor doesn't list a 29 gallon coffee table tank. It gives you an option between a 29 high or a 29 biocube, so I used the second one.

Before I got to your cichlids - which can't be identified for certain from what you've said, although I expect your electric yellow cichlid is a Labidochromis caeruleus - the AqAdvisor said you were 90% stocked, and gave the warning about the mature size of the shark.

When I added the yellow lab, I got the following warning:
Warning: Yellow Lab is not recommended for your tank - it may eventually outgrow your tank space, potentially reaching up to 4.5 inches.
Warning: At least 5 x Yellow Lab are recommended in a group.
Warning: Yellow Lab is not recommended to be with Opaline Gourami - mbuna species should not be mixed with other groups.
Warning: Yellow Lab is not recommended to be with Red Tailed Black Shark - mbuna species should not be mixed with other groups.
Warning: Yellow Lab is not recommended to be with Tiger Barb - mbuna species should not be mixed with other groups.
Warning: Yellow Lab is not recommended to be with Zebra Danio - mbuna species should not be mixed with other groups.
Note: You have selected mbuna species. These species in general, need to be overstocked to control aggression (over 100% stocking level). Make sure your filtration is sufficient and keep up with water changes.

The AqAdvisor noted that the tank was 101% stocked after adding the yellow lab.

It's not possible to adequately identify the "mixed African cichlid," but that would only add to the bioload in the tank, and most likely, would result in more aggression.

I think the AqAdvisor actually is telling you this is not the right combination of fish, and I'd agree.

Let me rephrase.... I used aqadvisor before adding the cichlids. I just put in the dimensions of the tank. I input the fish we had, and used possible scenerios of adding more and it did not indicate any problems. We only purchased the cichlids after being ill advised at the pet store, we had never considered it before. We have since found a locally owned LFS that specializes in cichlids. We plan on visiting this weekend to see if they will take ours.
 
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