"Peaceful" Cichlid Community

[LoganInAK]

So I'm a new member to the forum, but I've been using this forum and many others for research for quite awhile now. I recently purchased a 50g tank (my first acrylic) and I want to do something I haven't done yet. I want cichlids, but I'm not quite ready to give up all that tank space (also my first tank bigger than a 30g) for one JD pair, or just a couple medium sized aggressive cichlids. So I was thinking some smaller, typically peacefull cichlids, like a Ram, electric blue acara, a keyhole Cichlid, apisto, and one angel, with some dither fish, like two small schools of cardinals and rummy nose, or just one or the other with a larger amount, and some cories. And maybe one male guppy with a few females to provide some snacks for the cichlids. I know the cichlids I listed will do well in the form of one angel with a ram, or angel and acara, or keyhole and apisto and so on, so I'm just assuming they'll all get along together with a few territory disputes every now and then. The tank will be very heavily planted with lots of driftwood and other hardscapes, and I will be running more than double the recommended filtration. I'm fairly confident this setup will work, but I wanted some input from other enthusiasts, and maybe I'll get lucky and somebody's already tried this before and can let me know how it went.

 

[LayzorBeams]

So I'm a new member to the forum, but I've been using this forum and many others for research for quite awhile now. I recently purchased a 50g tank (my first acrylic) and I want to do something I haven't done yet. I want cichlids, but I'm not quite ready to give up all that tank space (also my first tank bigger than a 30g) for one JD pair, or just a couple medium sized aggressive cichlids. So I was thinking some smaller, typically peacefull cichlids, like a Ram, electric blue acara, a keyhole Cichlid, apisto, and one angel, with some dither fish, like two small schools of cardinals and rummy nose, or just one or the other with a larger amount, and some cories. And maybe one male guppy with a few females to provide some snacks for the cichlids. I know the cichlids I listed will do well in the form of one angel with a ram, or angel and acara, or keyhole and apisto and so on, so I'm just assuming they'll all get along together with a few territory disputes every now and then. The tank will be very heavily planted with lots of driftwood and other hardscapes, and I will be running more than double the recommended filtration. I'm fairly confident this setup will work, but I wanted some input from other enthusiasts, and maybe I'll get lucky and somebody's already tried this before and can let me know how it went.

Ok, first notes here:

Hi, welcome! Cool to see a bigger tank huh?

Ok, i will get to the fish.

You throw in the word "peaceful" pretty inaccurately here. Peaceful is a term that i wouldn't put with all of those fish as a group like you have them.

For example, if i was to compare a JD and an Oscar and an Acara, the Acara is peaceful, out of those three. But in a mix of Rams, Acaras, and Angels, the Acara is quite a bit more aggressive, as well as being much more capable of inflicting injury, than the Rams or Angels.

Keyhole, Apisto, Ram, and Angel are species that can be put together with a pretty decent chance at working out. The Acara, though, is different. It will SURELY stress the Keyholes out of eating, and maybe the Rams. They are nippy too, and more than likely will shred the Angels fins. Ive had an almost fully grown Angel be brought to the brink of death overnight by a 2.5" Acara.

So, this leaves you with 2 main categories here. The gentler, smaller Cichlids, like Rams and Angels, or the larger and more aggressive fish, like the Acara or JD.

Now, lets say you want to go with the gentler side, so you can have a few more fish with less risk. In a 50 gallon, you could maybe do a breeding trio of some type of Apisto, OR a pair (possibly two) of Rams, OR a few Keyholes. And then a nice Angel as a centerpiece. This could be surrounded by some Deison Barbs, Rummynose Tetras, a Bristlenose Pleco, and a big school of Cories.

That has a few advantages and a few things against it. It will be plant friendly, so if you want to go that route you can. Less bioload is also a plus. Probably the best thing is that you have thousands of options here,literally. More fish, resulting in color and activity. However, you lack the predator aggression and the distinct personality of the Jack Dempseys or other larger Cichlids.

Now, maybe you want to go with a pair if bigger fish. Your options grow slimmer. You cant really have schooling fish, due to them probably becoming midnight snacks. Catfsih are probably out, because lots of the bigger Cichlids tend to hang out near the bottom. Especially if they breed, aggression to anything else near them is very prevalent. So, you can either choose to do maybe 2-4 smaller, slightly less problematic fish, or a wet-pet, or a pair. For a pair, JDs are nice. They have wonderful color, and personality. They will fill up the tank as they get bigger. If you want a wet-pet, a JD or maybe a Green Texas, H. Carpintis, could work. You will really get to know the fish, they often has very unique attitudes and quirks. Its worth it if you want to have a real pet instead of a mindless animal. For a mixed tank, a group of fish like Firemouths, Rainbow Cichlids, or Convicts would work. If youre interested in this, let me know and i will elaborate further.

With the larger fish, you gain personality, but you will have limited options and high bioload. But believe me, personality is a wonderful thing after you spend money and time working on this every week.

So, let me know what you're interested in and i will elaborate further.


If money cant buy happiness, that why do I need a job? I mean, I should be getting these fish free, since I don't have to pay for happy...

 

[LayzorBeams]

Whew... That was an essay and a half.


If money cant buy happiness, that why do I need a job? I mean, I should be getting these fish free, since I don't have to pay for happy...

 

[Gillie]

Acara is a very broad term, it covers everything from the more laid back laetacara and keyholes to green terrors. I'm just pointing that out because I have seen keyholes labeled acara.

The determining factor is going to be the footprint of the tank.

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[LayzorBeams]

Acara is a very broad term, it covers everything from the more laid back laetacara and keyholes to green terrors. I'm just pointing that out because I have seen keyholes labeled acara.

The determining factor is going to be the footprint of the tank.

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I would assume he meant Blue Acara or Port Acara, and i guess it does depend of the footprint... But i would advice against mixing them with Rams or Keyholes or Angels at all...

But yes, could you let us know of the dimensions?


If money cant buy happiness, that why do I need a job? I mean, I should be getting these fish free, since I don't have to pay for happy...

 

[LoganInAK]

Whew... That was an essay and a half.

Thank you very much Layzor, you gave me the exact answer I was hoping for. I think I am going to go with the community. And the acara is out for now. The only reason it was in the list was because I heard that the electric blues tend to be more tolerant. This tank isn't going to be set up for at least a month, until I find time to build the filtration, plumbing, and paint the back of the tank. And I'm giving my girlfriend the majority vote for what goes into the tank, so she might change her mind and want to go for a more aggressive community, or even just a pair of a larger species. My lfs has four albino fire mouths, and I loved my firemouths when I had them, so maybe I could base a tank around them?

 

[RedDevil83]

Electric yellows are actually peaceful in a way but very hyper. Throw in a small pleco and there ya go.

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[RedDevil83]

I have to agree the acara are very aggressive actually IMO

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[LoganInAK]

I would assume he meant Blue Acara or Port Acara, and i guess it does depend of the footprint... But i would advice against mixing them with Rams or Keyholes or Angels at all...

But yes, could you let us know of the dimensions?


If money cant buy happiness, that why do I need a job? I mean, I should be getting these fish free, since I don't have to pay for happy...

The dimensions are
Width 12.5
Length 48
Height 19.5

 

[LayzorBeams]

Thank you very much Layzor, you gave me the exact answer I was hoping for. I think I am going to go with the community. And the acara is out for now. The only reason it was in the list was because I heard that the electric blues tend to be more tolerant. This tank isn't going to be set up for at least a month, until I find time to build the filtration, plumbing, and paint the back of the tank. And I'm giving my girlfriend the majority vote for what goes into the tank, so she might change her mind and want to go for a more aggressive community, or even just a pair of a larger species. My lfs has four albino fire mouths, and I loved my firemouths when I had them, so maybe I could base a tank around them?

Cool!

So they community is a great place to go, especially if you want color and activity.

Personally, i would try out a planted tank with the following:

1x Black Veil Angel
1x Trio of Cockatoo Apistos (breeding)
5x Denison Barb
15x either Rummynose or Silvertip Tetra
12x Cory of your choice
1x BN Pleco

Thats a pretty solid tank right there. That would be my choice for a community tank but you have many more options, there are a lot of fish you can switch around here.

For the aggressive side, with your Firemouths, you could do:

1x Pair of FMs (breeding)
12-16x of some type of Tetra or Barb
1x Synodontis Catfish or 3x Pictus Cat

Firemouth are territorial but not too aggressive. They are really pretty as well, although I've not ever seen Albino ones. They usually allow for some of the larger more peaceful Catfish, like Synodontis, to live with them. They are also usually fine with smaller dithers, like some types of Barbs (Denison Barbs would be amazing here, but expensive... 8-10 of them would be super colorful and active) or Tetras, like BA or Lemon Tetras. A group male Swordtails usually works, as they are from the same area naturally and if all males, they wont breed.

So yeah, now its down to you to decide on a category and pick out some fish! If you have any questions about fish or combinations feel free to ask!! You seem to know a good deal about what you're doing, and I'm excited to find out what you'll pick in the end.



If money cant buy happiness, that why do I need a job? I mean, I should be getting these fish free, since I don't have to pay for happy...

 

[TMRC Exotics]

Cool!

So they community is a great place to go, especially if you want color and activity.

Personally, i would try out a planted tank with the following:

1x Black Veil Angel
1x Trio of Cockatoo Apistos (breeding)
5x Denison Barb
15x either Rummynose or Silvertip Tetra
12x Cory of your choice
1x BN Pleco

Thats a pretty solid tank right there. That would be my choice for a community tank but you have many more options, there are a lot of fish you can switch around here.

For the aggressive side, with your Firemouths, you could do:

1x Pair of FMs (breeding)
12-16x of some type of Tetra or Barb
1x Synodontis Catfish or 3x Pictus Cat

Firemouth are territorial but not too aggressive. They are really pretty as well, although I've not ever seen Albino ones. They usually allow for some of the larger more peaceful Catfish, like Synodontis, to live with them. They are also usually fine with smaller dithers, like some types of Barbs (Denison Barbs would be amazing here, but expensive... 8-10 of them would be super colorful and active) or Tetras, like BA or Lemon Tetras. A group male Swordtails usually works, as they are from the same area naturally and if all males, they wont breed.

So yeah, now its down to you to decide on a category and pick out some fish! If you have any questions about fish or combinations feel free to ask!! You seem to know a good deal about what you're doing, and I'm excited to find out what you'll pick in the end.



If money cant buy happiness, that why do I need a job? I mean, I should be getting these fish free, since I don't have to pay for happy...

Wow, that first stocking list would be very expensive. Some unnecessary too, why 12 cories plus a pleco? Strange suggestions.

2nd stocking list, I would not put an African syno in a central firemouth tank, again its just unnecessary/Doesn't belong. The pictus could eat the schoolers too. A lot of these two stocks look better on paper than in practice. Keep it simple is a great recipe for success.

OP: the firemouth are not that aggressive and will tolerate some schoolers for your community feel if you wish. I currently house a Firemouth with two severums, 4 clown barbs and 7 cherry barbs with no aggression issues what so ever.

 

[Gillie]

Here's a simple and rather inexpensive idea,
2x angels
3x apisto 1m/2f
8-10 corydoras
20 lemon tetras
1 farlowella or sturisoma

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[LoganInAK]

So these are the lists I have come up with so far. Like I said, I won't even begin cycling for another month, and then another month for fish, so the lists are very open to change.
1x RTBS
2x Albino Firemouths
8x Denison Barbs
10x cories
4x ottos



1x angel
3x apistos
20x rummy nose
12x cories
4x ottos
5x Denison barbs

 

[LoganInAK]

Wow, that first stocking list would be very expensive. Some unnecessary too, why 12 cories plus a pleco? Strange suggestions.

2nd stocking list, I would not put an African syno in a central firemouth tank, again its just unnecessary/Doesn't belong. The pictus could eat the schoolers too. A lot of these two stocks look better on paper than in practice. Keep it simple is a great recipe for success.

OP: the firemouth are not that aggressive and will tolerate some schoolers for your community feel if you wish. I currently house a Firemouth with two severums, 4 clown barbs and 7 cherry barbs with no aggression issues what so ever.

I have had two firemouths in a community before and they did fine. My buddy has them currently with two parrots, 8 red eye tetras, a common pleco, RTBS, and a syno, and there is no aggression at all.

 

[TMRC Exotics]

I have had two firemouths in a community before and they did fine. My buddy has them currently with two parrots, 8 red eye tetras, a common pleco, RTBS, and a syno, and there is no aggression at all.

Yeah that's what I was saying. I'm not sure if you were agreeing with me or read my post wrong. My firemouth does well with cherry barbs he could easily fit in his mouth.
I wouldn't do the pleco strictly for waste production and potential adult size.

 

[LoganInAK]

Oh I was agreeing with you! Haha and the fish were for an aquaponics project for a greenhouse class last year, so the pleco was for once purchased for its ability to produce waste. And my buddy got attached to it, so it's his problem now. I am making sure he is providing for it properly.

 

[LayzorBeams]

Wow, that first stocking list would be very expensive. Some unnecessary too, why 12 cories plus a pleco? Strange suggestions.

2nd stocking list, I would not put an African syno in a central firemouth tank, again its just unnecessary/Doesn't belong. The pictus could eat the schoolers too. A lot of these two stocks look better on paper than in practice. Keep it simple is a great recipe for success.

OP: the firemouth are not that aggressive and will tolerate some schoolers for your community feel if you wish. I currently house a Firemouth with two severums, 4 clown barbs and 7 cherry barbs with no aggression issues what so ever.

Im not saying all of these fish are needed, but lots of people like them. Expensive, yes... But i was just listing off an example, he can change it if he wants... Its what i would do and thats what i said in the way i presented it.

The Syno isnt from that region, however you would be pressed to find a commonly available species of catfish that is the right size and aggression level for the tank. Syno are perfect except for the fact that are African. And yes, Pictus may eat juvy schoolers but larger Tetras/Barbs should be fine.

I can agree it not the stocking most would go with but it would be a good looking tank, which is more often than not an important factor... Simple isnt always what people want.


If money cant buy happiness, that why do I need a job? I mean, I should be getting these fish free, since I don't have to pay for happy...

 

[TMRC Exotics]

Im not saying all of these fish are needed, but lots of people like them. Expensive, yes... But i was just listing off an example, he can change it if he wants... Its what i would do and thats what i said in the way i presented it.

The Syno isnt from that region, however you would be pressed to find a commonly available species of catfish that is the right size and aggression level for the tank. Syno are perfect except for the fact that are African. And yes, Pictus may eat juvy schoolers but larger Tetras/Barbs should be fine.

I can agree it not the stocking most would go with but it would be a good looking tank, which is more often than not an important factor... Simple isnt always what people want.


If money cant buy happiness, that why do I need a job? I mean, I should be getting these fish free, since I don't have to pay for happy...

Agreed simple isn't what people always want, but people generally don't want to see their fish eaten. I will agree that most catfish don't fit the bill for this tank but that doesn't mean one is needed. There is no need for a catfish or "bottom feeder" for this tank. Why not avoid the hassle all together and not add a fish eater. I can say for a fact I've been doing this longer, I would recommend no bottom feeder before I jeopardize my stock with a fish that might munch on them. Why waste the time or take that chance, even with non predatory cats, why compensate for the bio load?

 

[RedDevil83]

Maybe some people like variety?

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[TMRC Exotics]

Maybe some people like variety?

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Theres lots of variety in just the species that exist in a given eco system on a given continent. Its never hard to create a stocking list of diverse fish with a given type or region.