Thoughts on blood parrot cichlids?

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stoneydee

Aquarium Advice Freak
Joined
Nov 20, 2003
Messages
244
Location
Arkansas USA
Anyone have them? Are they really the products of someone's evil mind trying to manipulate/create a new fish? I've read so many viewpoints and opinions on them- pro and con - I'm undecided. Problem is, I have an empty (cycled) 37 gallon tank, and trying to decide what to put in it. . .
 
I don't support artificial hybrids like the blood parrot and the flowerhorn because they are designed completely with human aesthetics in mind. "Look-- these two fish look great, but with a little experimenting we can make one that looks like them but BETTER." It demeans the natural state of the parent fish and suggests that human-made substitutes are better than having an aquarist search to find something natural that suits them. Parrots in particular are also popular victims for injections and dyeing. Such animals are viewed as weird and unnatural much like people at a freakshow, which is part of what increases their allure to some.

Then again, a similar argument could be made against people who take one species of fish and breed it out so that they get characteristics that are appealing to the human eye but do not really do anything for the fish or take the shortcut of genetically engineering them that way (bettas and GloFish, anyone?). However, taking things from the wild and tinkering around with them seems to be a part of humanity.

/end rambling.
 
Blood parrots are unquestionably mutants. Where their genes come from is up for debate; I've heard a number of different SA cichlid combinations as well as a mutation of a single species.

My issue with them is not they are hybrids or mutations. My issue with them is 2 fold:

Usually they are so deformed they cannot close their mouths. Some are also missing tail fins. I have problems with breeding and selling fish with compromised abilities to survive.

They are usually dyed. That one needs no explanation IMHO.

There is a TRUE parrot cichlid, but it is totally unrelated to the blood parrot.
 
I have two parrots and absolutely love them both. They are both juvenile and have not fully taken on their adult colors. Both started out brown with black stripes and one has already almost completely turned dark yellow/orange. The other one is beginning to turn a brilliant red. Note; both not dyed (a practice that I hate). They are both extremely healthy and seem very happy. No problems swimming or eating.

As to being mutants; so what??? I've had several muties in my fishkeeping carreer. I had an electric blue cichlid with a bent spinal cord, a red zebra with no tail whatsoever :) , and two Brichardi's without mouthparts (only a hole in front). All seemed to do quite fine with their abnormalities and lived long lives (except for the brichardis who died during a move).
I think blood parrots are fine. If they had any deformity that made their lives unpleasant I would feel differently.
Just my opinion; hope it's not taken badly.
New to Forum,
-Mark :)
 
I have two parrots and absolutely love them both. They are both juvenile and have not fully taken on their adult colors. Both started out brown with black stripes and one has already almost completely turned dark yellow/orange. The other one is beginning to turn a brilliant red. Note; both not dyed (a practice that I hate). They are both extremely healthy and seem very happy. No problems swimming or eating.

As to being mutants; so what??? I've had several muties in my fishkeeping carreer. I had an electric blue cichlid with a bent spinal cord, a red zebra with no tail whatsoever :) , and two Brichardi's without mouthparts (only a hole in front). All seemed to do quite fine with their abnormalities and lived long lives (except for the brichardis who died during a move).
I think blood parrots are fine. If they had any deformity that made their lives unpleasant I would feel differently.
Just my opinion; hope it's not taken badly.
New to Forum,
-Mark :)
 
The only "problem" I see with buying mutants is it supports the idea that this is okay. The LFS has no reason to stop stocking these fish.
 
I can understand the concern about genetic engineering - however, I keep fancy goldfish - fantails, ryukins, moors and orandas. I don't keep the celestial gazers, tough, their eyes just bug me. My point is, I'll never see this form of carp in my local river. . .
 
"mutant" parrots, "mutant" goldfish, &qu

Good point Dee. All of those wild looking goldfish are a result of genetic mutation. Fanciers who like the new look, breed for that deformity. I know that my parrots swim, eat, and see much better than many of the fancy goldfish I've come across. I'm not saying two wrongs make a right, but just keep things in perspective. Many of the varieties of fish available are only in existance because of selective breeding. As long as the result is a health, happy, fish, I really don't see any reason to consider it a problem.
Let's keep the message going that dying fish, however, is harmful and is a practice that should be stopped. Unquestionably.
-Mark
 
my LFS said that they are dipped into an acid so all their scales come off then dipped into a dye. too cruel. i used to want one so bad. but not anymore.
 
That is true Dayna. However, you would be surprised to find out which blood parrots are not dyed. They can naturally be the most brilliant red and orange you can imagine. You can be sure by getting them when they are juvenile and they are still brown with black stripes. Of course you don't know for sure what color they will end up, but that's really not important to me. I love them for their great personalities.
-Mark
 
The difference between species with accidental deformities and parrots is that parrots are bred specifically to enhance such deformities for the purpose of appeasing the human eye. These deformities do absolutely nothing for the fish.
 
Hey Hypostomus,
You could say the same thing about Pug dogs, Persian cats, etc. It's always a selective breeding process that produces these "odd" looking pets. Maybe we have different opinions as to whether it is appropriate or not, but my guideline is always will the result of this selective breeding have a happy, healthy life. If the answer is yes, then I am o.k. with it. '
I have kept fish for many years and see no evidence that my parrots are suffering in any way. Remember though, that I do not approve of dyeing them at all. I think half the fun of blood parrots is getting to be surprised by what color they will turn.
Just another opinion.
-Mark
 
AS a persian breeder who gave up the biz becuase my ethics could not stomach what is done with the poor beasts; I can heartily AGREE..

with Hypo

Boy, you sure hit my "pet" peeve button with those remarks.
Healthy..HA! You have nooo idea how many hidden deformities there are. Long life? A persian cat used to be the gnarly old threadbare matted 18+ year old animal grandma tells you to leave be..not the geriatric living on meds by age 13 animal! If it was pampered! Indoor/outdoor a newer Persian has about a 5-8 year lifespan depending on neutering. And that is the more vital pet quality animal they sell for 300 bucks at retail stores! Not delicat show animals. Sometimes while they are growing many die when the nose pulls up because the shreds of there nasal cartiliges slices the eye or even pierces the brain. Ear deformaties, liver diseases, bone malformtions. Many of those breed types in dog and cat have had eyes pop out for the sake of BOB! The original wide eyed short nose persian was considered lovely...and the european perisans still do have better health and longer faces. Though they are trying fast to catch to the american ideal so they too can sell the animals at inflated prices! But all of todays persians are from bloodlines with terrible mutations that cropped up mostly in Florida ,that they somehow squeezed into the standard and then made the standard. but even that wasn't enough..now there is excessive inbreeding to set these desirable "beauty traits".
You have to pull teeth while they grow, bind them to make sure that malformed soft bones stay straighter as they grow, and they can walk to keep muscle tone. Mine were top show out of Marhei lines. And nasal surgery, special diets. I had one bloodline that was dying out becuase they had bred in a Y chromosone heart. It took me 8 dead cats to breed it out (you keep em quiet and calm until you breed em..and they almost always die within the week). I usually had about 63 animals on the premise at any given time because I was trying to get my gene pool straightened out. Having concious and doing it right was expensive and time consuming.. I could have been a show winner in NY every year with just 5 of my animals..if I kept inbreeding them. the poor things were already their own brother, sister and mother!

I find making an animal defective for the sake of beauty is no laughing matter. As long as it's healthy? And what measuring stick is being used for that definition? Being able to stay alive?

You may bring up oriental animal breeds with their lionesque features..but those animals were CAREFULLY breed over centuries too! And after all the careful work they did, there have been several shortcuts taken lately that nearly destroyed many of those breeds for a long time. You used to have to really screw up to kill your goldfish..they could suffer through all types of errors and still end up so big it was pond time. Betta imbellis used to be so disctintive as their own b.specie that you could keep over 20 in a 30 gallon. Ha , they are so intercrossed and released with betta splendens now you can't chance two in a tank!Sheperds..a dog that could run next to a galloping horse(Roy Rogers Bullit, Rinty) for a taping session and was the childrens guradian are now prone to hip dysplasia and other debilitating health defects. They are often untrustworthy, aggressive, ,nervous, and same with collies, another sheep dog. They stretched the faces out til the eyes slanted and made the animal fraglile and nervous. People are now working to reverse the damage done by the careless for the sake of a look and having it cheap.
Boy, you sure hit my button with those remarks.
TWO WRONGS DO NOT MAKE RIGHT. And never will!
One can say they find them lovely and that they do not care how they came to be..that is what floats your boat.
But don't try to justify it with the examples like how the inner circle of show breeders have set features so extreme in they destroy the animals whole breed with their dahm-med shortcuts and carelessness without even tipping a hat to the facts of biology. Or care for the fact they are a living thing. Inbreeding sets good with bad. Man made animals and sports should not be allowed to breed back into a natural population. And deciding to like a mutation and keep it and purposely making one are two different schools of thought.
Though I was originally popping in to just say I thought they were abad practice. ......with some of what I have read I will say my more personal view which is that I think the blood parrot is an abomination and ugly to boot. The colors are spectacular, but they look deformed and they are unnatural.
And my greatest beef against them is that they are opening a door into a terrible trend that once it winds its way into the fish fancy..most aquaurium bred species are doomed. Because what are the offspring marked as that look like one parent or the other? You think they destroy them all? or that they are creeping unknown into aquariums everywhere to muddy the species distinction of their parent donors. Knowing retail and the fact they are secretive on exactly how they got them; I say the latter!! :evil: Thats "the harm in it..." And that attitude is why there are STILL "painted" fish available.
*wipes the foam flecks from lips* <rides high horse frorm the soap box it was balanced on and dismounts>
Okay, I am done barking now. And for your part MandM their colors are striking. And they exhibit the pet behavior thgat makes cichlids popular
I feel strongly against overmanipulation of animals kept as our companions. And will always naysay against it. Fish even more because they have few legal protections. I need coffee now!
 
*starts laughing*

Hit a nerve there Xmas? Not that I could tell *grin* Although I do agree; the only purebred animal I have owned (besides my angels) was a crosseyed apple head siamese that was given to us. The fish are the only animals I have never gotten from a humane society.

Back to the subject at hand tho. My issues with the blood parrots remain. Yes, not all blood parrots are dyed, and they can still come up with some beautiful colors; I don't think they NEED to be dyed but they are, and sold as jellybeans *sigh*

And the physical mutations I feel do impair their quality of life. The missing tails (I also have a problem with the discus who are bred without tails too), and especially the mouth. Besides expending much more energy moving around without a tail, many bloodparrots wind up with major feeding issues as adults, for as they get older the mouth deformities worsen and many cannot close their mouths. To me, thats just cruel.
 
I really appreciate the input everyone has given. Regardless of which side of the issue you're on, everyone on this website speaks from the heart, and that's what I count on when I ask for an opinion. :D
 
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