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Old 08-01-2005, 03:39 PM   #1
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Check out this research !

I have spent most of the last two days completing research regarding s/w tanks. I got the whole libarys section on marines lol, and refered to my own books, internet and magazines and well I have some what started to really plan out this tank.

I visited a lfs and is owned by a married couple. They have owned it for 30 years. 8O . I began talking to the owner about his marines and he said dont allways listen to books etc ........
He has had them for 30 years and hardly any problems most of his tanks are only 10 gals they can sometimes consist of approximatly 5 common clowns or some even a yellow tang. To be honast his tanks look great.
I then asked him regarding equiptment and he told me he does not no longer use protein skimmers. He said they are not really needed.
He advised me to get a undergravel filter with two upplift tubes running of airstone/ pump. He also said to have a powerhead just for your rocks. He said rocks such as tuffa and ocenic are ideal.
he said for the gravel/sand to choose my self. I personally like coral sand, silver sand and coral gravel. That looks great! 8). He told me to get a hyrdometer and a marine white lamp light (25W) - (750 mm).
I would also keep my internal filter running as it was origionally a jewul freshwater tank. But I will dispose of these filter sponges and get some new ones.

So inconclusion it looks like I may have this ......
~ / This tank is mainly going to be fish only, however there may be one or two anemone's if these are succesfully I will add more coral life \ ~

36,12,18 inches 29 gals(UK) 33 gals (US)
Marine White lamp light
Internal filter.
Undergravel filter.
Tufa rock, oceanic rock (Maybe LR)
Most likely coral sand and gravel. (only about 1.5 inches thick)
Powerhead if I get live rock.
Hydrometer.
Heater
Thermometer
Test Kits
Salt
Declorinator

Well This is it so far, after alot of research,

Please reply soon.
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Old 08-01-2005, 04:01 PM   #2
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Personally, I'd go with live rock instead of an undergravel filter. If you get 1.5 - 2 pounds of lr per gallon, it will do the same job (except better) as your undergravel filter. I would also go with sand instead of cc, but that's just me.

I'm sure these people know what they are doing, but if they have a yellow tang in a 10 gallon tank, I wouldn't hold them in too high a regard. Tangs really need room to swim and could get to about 7-8 inches.

Anyway, if it were me - I'd skip the UG filter and go with live rock and sand and get a skimmer. You'll probably have a healthier and better looking tank - IMO.

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Old 08-01-2005, 04:04 PM   #3
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I'd skip the UG filter and go with live rock and sand and get a skimmer. You'll probably have a healthier and better looking tank - IMO.
Seconded.

You sure that 10g at the LFS isn't tied into the other tanks (shared water?)
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Old 08-01-2005, 04:37 PM   #4
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I am sure saying that the tangs was really small i was not aware that they grew that big his must of been a juvi. To be honast I prefer undergravel rather than live rock. However I will want a bit of it. So that parts solved now what about not having a protein skimmer ?
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Old 08-01-2005, 04:37 PM   #5
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First I suspect this LFS is refering to his for sale tanks. Of course in the short term a half dozen clowns and even yellow tangs could live within a small 10 gal tank but in the long run this is not going to be ideal for a display tank.

UGF dont work well with sand substrate as it clogs the slits in the under gravel plate and thus the required water circulation no longer exists. The marine lamp that was described while is fine for illuminating the tank for a fish only setup it is not intense enough to support anenomies or other inverabrates for the long term.
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Old 08-01-2005, 04:42 PM   #6
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Thanx for help Fishfreek, So what light would you suggest. i would prefer one of the same size i.e. (750mm) for the undergravel filter I was going to have a layer of crushed coral and then the sand I wanted so there was less chance of it affecting the UGF.
I would like to keep anenomies as I later want to breed clowns ( not till many years of experience though). LOL.

Please reply,
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Old 08-01-2005, 04:48 PM   #7
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And no protein skimmer
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Old 08-01-2005, 04:50 PM   #8
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UGFs BAD!!
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Old 08-01-2005, 04:51 PM   #9
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If you put the CC under the sand in time your CC will be on top and your sand will seep to the bottom and clog your undergravel. Skip the UG filter like everyone says and go with a HOB type filter or canister filter bothare much better in a SW setup!

Skimmers - I'm a realtive NooB, but for the most part have done a lot of research myself ... this is one area in this hobby that is divided! Some will say it's absolutely necessary while others will not.

I have a 29gal tank ... 53lbs of LR, 4" DSB, 2 MaxiJet 900 PH's, and am running the Eclipse system 3 filtration and light system. My tank is thriving, well for a FOWLR tank anyway!

If I ahd to do it all over again ... I think the only thing I would change is the lighting! I would go MH for sure!
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Old 08-01-2005, 09:56 PM   #10
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If you have your heart set on an UGF, I would suggest not using sand at all.

People have successful tanks with ugf's. They've been used for years, so I'm sure you'll be fine. I had a 55 gallon up for a couple years with an ugf and a HOB filter and it was very stable. I was away from the hobby for a few years and when I came back I discovered live rock and I'd never go back.

But, coming from someone who has run both types think of these things.

1. The slits get clogged in UGF - especially if using sand. I used crushed coral and I had clogging issues. Once the filter is in, it's very difficult to take out (since its under everything in your tank.
2. You'll have to clean your crushed coral when doing water changes, not really required with a sand bed.
3. You won't need ANY OTHER filtration if you go with live rock / protein skimmer. That's all you'll need. Forget about the HOB filter and canister filter - its not needed. You'll need powerheads, but you'll need them to actually power your ugf anyway.
4. Live rock looks great and comes with tons of life that will flourish in your tank (star fish, shrimp, crabs, urchins, etc) and will also contain pods which are a natural food source for your fish. YOU'd be able to get away with say 25lbs of live rock and 20lbs of base rock or even tufa rock, which is a very affordable, attractive filtration system
5. Don't forget maintenance for your filter. You'll need to replace the media in your HOB filter regularly - nothing to replace with lr / skimmer.

Not trying to come across as argumentative, I'm not saying that this way is right and your way is wrong - I'm finding out that nothing in this hobby is black and white - but, consider these things before making a final decision. Basically, in my experience, maintenance with lr/skimmer set-up is much, much easier - and, in the long run, possibly less expensive. At the very least, decide what fish you want to keep - they may require hiding places and rock work. It'd be a shame to set-up an ugf and an expensive canister filter and then have to buy 30-40lbs of live rock anyway.

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