garlic.. do you inject this into the food

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craig_will2513

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garlic.. do you inject this into the food.. and what type of garlic. i have powdered garlic coul i make this into a mixture and inject it into the food
 
garlic.. do you inject this into the food.. and what type of garlic. i have powdered garlic coul i make this into a mixture and inject it into the food

they sell the liquid garlic solution and you soak the food in it. It also helps ward off some parasites
 
I don't think it does any good for parasites...
Basically it just stimulates the fishes appetite ...
 
FTMMWS said:
I don't think it does any good for parasites...
Basically it just stimulates the fishes appetite ...

What it does is boost the immune system of the fish to prevent parasites like ick
 
No, it doesn't boost the immune system. There is no evidence to back this up. That is just another regurgitated idea.

Allicin, a chemical in garlic, has been shown to actively kill parasites. However, it is not present in everything garlic. The garlic has to be pressed for two other chemical to combine into the allicin. Freshly pressed garlic is what has effective amounts of allicin in it.

The store bought stuff does not seem to have the same properties, at least not that I have ever seen. The store bought stuff really is just a great and very effective appetite stimulant.

New Life Spectrum Thera+A has a lot more garlic than their other formulas and I have seen cases where it treated parasites.
 
That article again...of course. I will state my response to that, again:

One of the articles actually states right in the abstract that allicin (extract from garlic) actually killed ich.

Here are his refrences and my responses to them:

Colorni, Angelo, Rami Avtalion, Wayne Knibb, Evelyn Berger, Barbara Colorni, & Bracha Timan. 1998. "Histopathology of sea bass (Dicentrarchus labrax) experimentally infected with Mycobacterium marinum and treated with streptomycin and garlic (Allium sativum) extract." Aquaculture 160(1998)1-17.
-This study only shows that Mycobacterium marinum is not cured by allicin. This does not apply to garlic’s anti-parasitic properties since this is a bacteria.

Ashdown, Denise & Gary Violetta. 2004. "Using Garlic as an Appetite Stimulant in Sand Tiger Sharks (Carcharias taurus)." Drum & Croaker, January 2004, Volume 35, pages 59-63.
-This study discusses garlic’s use as an appetite stimulant, which doesn’t speak to its anti-parasitic properties.

Buchmann, [FONT=&quot]K., P. B. Jensen, & [FONT=&quot]K[/FONT]. D. Kruse. 2003. "Effects of Sodium Percarbonate and Garlic Extract on Ichthyophthirius multifiliis Theronts and Tomocysts: In Vitro Experiments." North American Journal of Aquaculture, Volume 65, Number 1, pages 21-24, 2003.[/FONT]
Abstract excerpt:
“Garlic extract had no effect in low amounts (30 [FONT=&quot]mg/L), but at high concentrations (117 and 570 [FONT=&quot]mg[/FONT]/L) it killed the tomocysts within 24 h.”[/FONT]
-This article shows that garlic can actually kill Ich tomocysts, although more garlic is required to be effective compared to malachite green.

Colorni, Angelo & Peter Burgess. 1997. "Cryptocaryon irritans Brown 1951, the cause of 'white spot disease' in marine fish: an update." Aquarium Sciences and Conservation, volume 1, pages 217-238.
-This article’s abstract and introduction did not mention garlic.

Fairfield, Terry. 1996. "Garlic & Your Aquarium: A Preliminary report on Allium sativum and fishkeeping." Aquarium Fish Magazine, January 1996, pages 79-83.
-This is not primary scientific research, and therefore scientifically cannot be considered as proof/disproof or support/lack of support of anything.


And here are the articles I cited in my article that was published in Aquarium Fish International Magazine, about how garlic has been scientifically demonstrated to actively kill parasites.

Ankri, S., and D. Mirelman. 2001. “Antimicrobial properties of allicin from garlic.” Microbes and Infection, 1(2):125-129.

Boxaspen, K., and J.C. Holm. 1992. “New biocides used against sea lice compared to organo-phosphorous compounds.” Aquaculture and the Environment: Reviews of the International Conference Aquaculture Europe ‘91, Dublin, Ireland, June 10-12, 1991. European Aquaculture Society Special Publ. pp. 393-402

Coppi, A., et al. 2006. “Antimalarial Activity of Allicin, a Biologically Active Compound from Garlic Cloves.” Antimicrobial Agents and Chemotherapy, 50:1731-1737.

D.L.N., 1998. “Allicin, one of the active principles of garlic, inhibits the growth of protozoan parasites.” Chemtech, 4:45.

Holden, C. 1997. “Fighting Parasites With Garlic.” Science, 278(5338):581.

Soko, C. K., and D.E. Barker. 2004. “Efficacy of crushed garlic and lemon juice as bio-product treatments for Ichthyophthirius multifiliis (‘ich’) infections among juvenile Nile tilapia, Oreochromis niloticus.” Aquaculture Associaton of Canada Special Publication, 9:108-110.
 
I guess for me ,its all about the actual affect it has overall..Seems its only thought to treat the fish,right?(if it really does or not is irrelevant)..It does nothing to the ich living and breeding in the sand bed and LR...So to me its pointless to pump a fish full of garlic when it shows signs of it and think your doing any good in the battle with ich in your tank...
We all know ich has many stages of life and for it to truly be killed off there are only 2 proven methods,,well 3 if you count leaving a tank fallow..
 
But the ich on the fish is the only stage that causes harm, and is the stage that garlic can kill if fed to a fish. As pointed out in one study cited in the first article, allicin can kill ich.

I have talked to a couple people who fed NLS and had ich develop in a tang. They switched to the Thera+A formula and it went away. Maybe it went away on its own or some other coincidental reason, but there seems to be more evidence than nothing.

In the end it isn't harmful and there is evidence to suggest it could be very beneficial. Rather than arguing the idea based on poorly supported articles, we should accept the possibility and try it more often. It definitely won't hurt anything or make the ich worse, but could potentially cure it. Until we start to do this we won't know for sure either way and it is just pointless debates based on theory and little support.
 
I think its best to just keep it out of our systems altogether rather than treat the fish over and over and over again because the ich returned ..Which it will unless you use the 3 proven methods to kill it for good
 
FTMMWS said:
I would have a hard time believing this

But allicin, that is present in freshly pressed garlic, cures ick when added onto food that the fish eat. If it doesn't boost the fishs immune system, then it has to actively kill the parasite, so adding it directly into the water would have the same affect. I'm just trying to piece together everything that is being presented in this thread and going one step further.
 
Maybe in the stage of life its on the fish ,,but i doubt it would get to it deep in the sand bed or in the LR,,,i guess you could start doing WC's with straight Allicin till your water was pure only that...maybe then i guess,,IDK, i still think its a big money making scheme yet to be 100% proven to rid your tank of ich..
Plus i read that allicin breaks down so rapidly that the stuff bought in stores is useless..only way to ensure pure fresh allicin is to squeeze fresh cloves every time,,..Seems like a lot of work for something that can be so easily avoided
 
As stated you would have to put so much garlic in the water it is not an option, it needs to be fed to the fish.

Obviously prevention is better than any cure, no matter which cure you prefer. But if it is there, gallons of prevention are worthless.

It is not proven yet because so many people argue so hard against it that others won't try it. I don't see why people argue against it so hard when it has the potential to be an effective and safe way to treat marine white spot in a reef.

What are the 'only 3 proven methods'?
 
Starve it (a fallow tank), Hyposalinity and copper..
No arguments that i know of with any of these..
I don't see why we need to prove another method to deal with it when there are these tried and true ways already
 
Because none of those are reef safe.

Marine white spot happens in reefs too, and with so few to no effective methods to treat it, we need to find one.

IME illness is NOT caused by pathogens alone. It is caused by stress that weakens their immune system and then allows any pathogens that are present the chance to cause illness. I have seen it over and over and over again, fresh and salt. Fish get sick, but all the other fish in the tank are fine and it never spreads even though they are all exposed.

Starvation and hyposalinity are both stressful on the fish and the pathogen (the point is to stress the pathogen more than the fish, in time). With garlic the fish are still happy while you kill the white spot.
 
Leaving a tank fallow is safe (except for the ich),,which is what a lot of people end up doing because ich has wiped it out and they kept trying all those useless meds..
Hyposalinity is actually very calming to fish and helps them breath better and exert less energy...
I'm willing to concede to the fact pure allicin can help kill ich while its on the fish,but don't believe it does anything to it in all its other stages of life.How could it?..I don't think they will ever find something that will kill ich and is reef safe ..If its going to kill ich its going to kill inverts of any kind.
 
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