I'm at the end...Cyano

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Brad

Aquarium Advice FINatic
Joined
Jan 22, 2004
Messages
754
Location
British Columbia
Cyano is beating me. It is slowing killing my tank. According to my ability to measure water quality, I've improved my measures to the finest they've ever been.

I feed only a little bit of food every 2 days. Besides, there's no phosphate or nitrate detectable that might point to overfeeding. All water is RO/DI. I do weekly clean up including water change. I grow a little macro algae and harvest a little bit each week.

I changed my MH. More light = more cyano.

After months of fighting (I'm pretty patient), I tried Boyd's chemi-clean, but it has had no impact and I'm afraid to try again for fear of totally crashing the system. (Anyone with personal experience with this product?)

I have read everything there is to read about cyano control/prevention and have been doing everything suggested...for months...and it has just slowly spread to the point that it is beginning to choke out a few soft corals.

I don't even know why I'm writing this because I'm certain no one is going to tell me anything that I haven't read a thousand times already...I'm putting 5 or 6 hours a week into battling cyano and I can't take it anymore. :cry:
 
My friend had a setup similar to yours and had bad cyano. He switched to an Aqua C Remora Pro skimmer and it really did help out...That coupled with increased water flow to the areas (he had a problem on the sand only) really ended it.

Sorry you're having so much trouble with it, but I know what you mean. We all pretty much have problems w/it at some point.
 
After writing the above, I went and vacuumed the *&^! out of my DSB. I'm sure there are a lot of very upset sand critters, but desperate times....

While I have been skimming the cyano off the sand, and taking a bit of sand with it...I have NOT been deeply vacuuming the sand bed (until now).

I guess we'll see.
 
i had a bad case of it last year and phosban creaned it up in a 2 or 3 day period this year i have it in 2 out of 3 tanks and cant kick it the only tank with no skimmer is clean go figure wich makes be believe its a overfeeding problem but cut back feedings arenot helpin either i had a bottle of red slime remover i resorted to just to get it cut down to a managable state but im to scared to use enough to work its only on my sand in high flow areas

dam sound like im goin cyno crazy too

if i knew how to post a pic we could have a cyno battle and see who has it worse
 
Brad,

Get some Chemi clean, While I don;t normally recommend chemicals I used this in my 150 that the whole bottom was nasty with redish black cyno, I only treated once and it cleared it up. I still haven't found the cause for it myself and it's been 3 weeks and it hasn't come back.
 
After giving the sand bed a good vaccuum, the cyano returned stronger in 24 hours...stronger than before. Maybe that is a clue.
 
Just curious, how old is the tank? What salt mix do you use? I've noticed many people w/ cyano issues lately :? I have a bit of a problem now w/ cyano, never did for the first 1.5 years...
 
What is your main food source? Brand/type? I also see no mention of a skimmer?

Cheers
Steve
 
I get a little cyano every now and again. I have a sand sifting star that keeps the sand turned over though. As for growth anywhere else, it was mentioned on a post here some time ago that cyano is related to silicates. You mentioned the use of RO/DI..when was the last time you actually replaced the membrane and DI filter? The DI filter is only good for roughly 6 moths tops. Most likely less if you've run a lot of water through it. If you are at wits end it may be wise to look under rocks and see if you have something dead somewhere in the system though I would really expect to see po3/po4 issues with something dead in the tank. I will say that couple folks have reported excellent results with the Two Little Fishes PhosBan reactor. I have had mine installed (properly) for about 4 days. po4 is 0. I do not have a silicate test kit so I cannot vouch that it would indeed help you *if* you are experiencing some type of Si problem. However, if your about to lose the system, a $35 reactor and a 90G / hr pump seems like a small 'last ditch' expense..

Best of luck to you.
 
I've been going through this same struggle. The tide seems to have finally turned for me though. It looks to be improving. I've been feeding a very tiny amount once a week. Since starting that about 6 weeks ago, I think things have started to turn around. It's not gone, but at least it's not covering my sand bed in a matter of days anymore.
 
I used Red Slime Remover.

The first time I used it, the cyano came back. I dosed again a couple months later and it hasn't come back since. (knock on wood). It's been maybe 5 months since I did that.

Unfortunately, the cyano went away and the hair algae took over.
 
The tank has been running as a reef for about 15 months now. Skimmer is a Prism Pro. I know...everyone hates the Prism Pro, but it certainly skims enough that I have to clean it out weekly, so I think it is working pretty well.

I mix my foods, but feed mostly assorted frozen stuff once every 2 days. I had been feeding DTs as well, but I've cut that out now. I think that many of my filter feeders are dying now either because of the cyano or lack of food.

I've tested the various frozen foods for phosphates and some are worse than others. Regardless, there is no detectable phosphate in the tank.

I've always used Kent salt. No particular reason. I've tested fresh salt mix and not found any phosphates. Nevertheless, I sometimes think that the cyano seems to return faster if I INCREASE the size of a water exchange.

SPS corals all look great. In fact, they are doing really, really well. My mushroom leather isn't happy though, and my star polyps haven't opened in weeks.

SpG is at 1.023 (hydrometre measurement...so you have to adjust that one based on 80 degrees...might be 1.024 or so...), Nitrate - 0; Phosphate - 0; Ca - 380; Alk - 2.86mEq; Ph - 8.3 (approx - test kit);

My Magnesium is low (1050ppm). I've tried adding some Seachem Mg, but I think I would have to add the entire bottle to make a difference. I can't see Mg being the problem though.

Kalk is delivered 24/7 through a dosing pump.

Where I'm at now is I am aggressively vaccuuming my sand bed and replacing 5% water daily. I've done that 3 days in a row now.
 
What about your water source? Are you using RO/DI water? I had some some luck after changing out the DI filter in my RO unit. It was practilly brand new but I chnaged it anyway. Cyano went away.

I feel for you. I hate that stuff.
 
Brad said:
The tank has been running as a reef for about 15 months now. Skimmer is a Prism Pro. I know...everyone hates the Prism Pro, but it certainly skims enough that I have to clean it out weekly, so I think it is working pretty well.
No arguement from me, I have the Pro deluxe :wink:

I've tested the various frozen foods for phosphates and some are worse than others. Regardless, there is no detectable phosphate in the tank.
This is what often misleads people, the lack of detectable PO4. The cyano is consuming it as fast as it enters the system. Also keep in mind, test kits cannot read organic forms of PO4, only inorganic. The simple fact is, cyano is dependant on phosphates to survive. No PO4, no cyano. Nitrogens play a role as well but not with the same dependancey as phosphates.

I've always used Kent salt. No particular reason. I've tested fresh salt mix and not found any phosphates. Nevertheless, I sometimes think that the cyano seems to return faster if I INCREASE the size of a water exchange.
It's not the salt itself but what all salt contains, I've used Kent salt for over 10 years without issue. The elements added each time will somewhat contribute to cyano growth. If you do not use RO/DI as ellisz pointed out, that will be a huge contributor. RO alone will not help either. Keep in mind as well cyano can actually manufacture it's own food sources to some degree keeping it alive so any amount of added nutrient is growth material.

Ca - 380; Alk - 2.86mEq;
The Ca could use a good boost based on your alk level but this isn't really a contributor nor is the Mg.


Where I'm at now is I am aggressively vaccuuming my sand bed and replacing 5% water daily.
Cyano control in the sandbed is best accomplished with conch snails. They are about the only thing that will consume it purposefully. Siphoning off the rocks and such is a good goal though. Remove the algae and you export some nutrient with it.

IME, your best solution is rethink some of your food types (not so much feeding schedule), RO/DI water unless already used and possibley the use of a ferric oxide PO4 sponge. You might eventually kick the cyano through water changes and better food choices but it doesn't hurt to help it along, especially in removing organic PO4. Once in the system it becomes a never ending chemical circle.

Cheers
Steve
 
your best solution is rethink some of your food types (not so much feeding schedule)
Steve, what would recommend? A specific commercial brand/blend, blender mush...? Sorry about the hijack Brad, I could use some help also. Thanks
 
Water has always been RO/DI.

the lack of detectable PO4. The cyano is consuming it as fast as it enters the system. Also keep in mind, test kits cannot read organic forms of PO4, only inorganic.

That is a thought...I've been using some RowaPhos off and on lately. I haven't left it in for long periods since I couldn't detect any Phosphate. I'll just leave it in there for a while.

Today we'll do more sand vaccuuming and replace a LARGE amount of tank water.
 
Water has always been RO/DI.
Good, but make sure your filters are not old. When I got my RO/DI unit, I could get a PO4 reading from the RO/DI water. I had to change the DI filter to correct the problem. The unit was almost new as well.

Just a thought.
 
MT79 said:
your best solution is rethink some of your food types (not so much feeding schedule)
Steve, what would recommend? A specific commercial brand/blend, blender mush...? Sorry about the hijack Brad, I could use some help also. Thanks
It's not that I actually recommend one over the other, moreso that I highly suggest reading the label. Many types of dried foods especially contain vitamin substitutes that are quite high in organic PO4 and usable iron. L-Ascorbyl-2-polyphosphate (a type of vitamin C) being high on the list but be equally as wary of those that just say "vitamins" without actually listing what types.

If your having nuisance algae issues, switch to a frozen prepared food. Either make it yourself (best option) or look for one that is more basic in nutritional value. Being frozen, most manufactureres do not need to add preservatives and can use actual stabalized vitamin C instead of the alternative.

Cheers
Steve
 
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