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Old 04-03-2004, 11:43 PM   #1
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it live

I have a problem with rock
basicly i was sold fugi rock and some lava also few tonga branch which came from a big tank, I was told it was cured.

Then i hear about people saying their rock came with all kinds of stuff on it.
I used the rock to cycle my tank again since adding 60 lbs, and 2 more inches of sand whick was crushed coral.

I brought the rock home wrapped in moist paper, then added to tank took fish out to QT,

levels all went up now at zero though it has only been about 10 days. Is this cycled.

I had tank set up for 3 months with emp 400 biofilters and 1 inch of live sand. and 15 lbs of again rock that was supposed to be cured from lfs
however 1st rock never grew anything on it in the 3 months. Was i sold base rock as cured live rock or what.

Now that tank levels are down
amonia 0
nitrate 10
nitrite 0
ph is 7.5
calcium is off the chart
better than 400ppm
and kh is 179

the lr that i reacently purchased looks like a peeling sunburn stuff is hanging off it all over the place. \

I do have on 6 lb Lr that has corolin and feathers and orange polyps though only a few of the polyps come out. it is 1 year old. is there a amount of time before i get corolin coming to my other rock which is in seperate tank.

Ive thrown in 4 turbos emrald and 6 hermits, 1 nassaria in 55 with LR still holding fish out.

I m thinking of 25 nassaria for my 3"in dsb, I had algee problem before which I assume came from over feeding and use of tap instead of RO

I want to go slow but all test show what I know to be cycled tank.

what do you think should I use baster to dust off rocks or just get more turbos.
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Old 04-04-2004, 10:38 AM   #2
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Darn back button. I had a big reply worked up and i grabed the mouse to hit submit and i hit the back button on the mouse... Oh well. Now to type it again...

Live rock does not have to have all the extra stuff like hermits, shrimp, macro algae and small coral pods to be classified as live rock. All of that stuff is great to get but is more of an added bonus than a cirital part of the rock being classified as living. The basic root of what makes live rock living is the millions of bactera that call the rock home. These backtera make the rock not only a decoration but also a living filter.

If your tank measured ammonia in the past and that ammonia level has now dropped to nothing along with nitrite than your tank sounds cycled and ready for fish life once again.

The peeling sunburned stuff could be coraline algae that is not optimzed for your lighting setup. Different colors of corline will do best under different lighting intensities and if the lighting setup no the former tank was a great deal different than the lighting setup on your tank then the existing corline could regress some before a more optimized color of corline takes off in its place.

Corline will grow at different rates depending on the water conditions and the lighting conditions. Members have acutally found corline growth can sometimes be slower under high intensity lighting setups than under mid to moderate lighting.

I would add your fish back to your main tank and at the same time monitor the water conditions to make sure the ammonia and nitrite either do not return or if they do that the levels do not get to high before hey drop again.
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Old 04-04-2004, 11:50 AM   #3
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what about the calcuim can it be to high, I have a ca test kit and couldn't add enough drops to get it to measure course it did just get new sand added will test again sp water change.

My Ph is a little low isnt it what is the better ph

I added all my snails and hermits to the 55 gal , I just have 1 damsel and 1 goby I think Ill hold them in my QT for a little longer untill I learn little more, my PH in QT is 8

do you ever use dip stripes , i like them but hear they are inaccurate. I hate the long drawn out testing that came with my tank. what is the best easiest way to test.

Last my Lr in QT which does have stuff all over it, Leave it in QT or add to tank.

Ive got 50 nassauria coming, and should add to QT or just go to main tank. do you QT snail hermits ext. or just fish.
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Old 04-04-2004, 01:46 PM   #4
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Yes your PH is very low. It should be 8.0-8.2. Your calcium levels sholud be around 400-450ppm IMO.

I prefer seachem test kits. They have a more specific scale on them as far as what the readings are. Many kits have scales like 0.0, 0.2, 0.4, etc. Where as the seachem kits are morelike 0.00, 0.01, 0.02, etc so you get a better idea as to what your water levels are like.
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Old 04-04-2004, 04:52 PM   #5
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ok My Kh is 179 which i beleive is low is this what is lowering my ph'
should i add proper 8.2 or just use ph plus.

I cant get calcuim test to turn collors is is supposed to be turning from orange to green after 80 drops is just red, 1 drop = 17.9 ppm gh
which is above 1400 ppm is this odd. or is test bad.

I tested my tap and changed just fine. can you have to much calcium in tank.

tanks amonia has gone up since adding hermits and snails. or something on lr is dying.

so ph should be 8-8.2
what should KH be at
and Gh

think ill pick up some water tommarrow in tulsa

maybe some more turbos
and a cleaner, will they pick the sunbrun off. the rock, the dead algee.,


What about live bacteria do you use it.
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Old 04-05-2004, 01:03 PM   #6
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Originally Posted by f-dean
ok My Kh is 179 which i beleive is low is this what is lowering my ph'
should i add proper 8.2 or just use ph plus.
If measuring your alkalinity in ppm, then 179 ppm is fine. It's close to 10 DKH which is an acceptable level. In which case your low ph reading will not be chemical, it will be environmental. If the tank has a glass lid, remove it. Trapped CO2 will lower ph quite quickly. 6 lbs of LR in a 55 gal should not affect the tank chem that much unless there is an abundance of die off. I would look for low GPH, trapped CO2 or poor ambient air flow as the cause, try just opening a window.

An easy way to test this is take a cup of water out and let it sit for about ½ hour and then retest. You should get a better ph level. If it's chemical, the ph will not change. If environmental, it should rise.

Quote:
I cant get calcuim test to turn collors is is supposed to be turning from orange to green after 80 drops is just red, 1 drop = 17.9 ppm gh
which is above 1400 ppm is this odd. or is test bad.

I tested my tap and changed just fine. can you have to much calcium in tank.
It is very easy to overdo the calcium in a tank. Have you been adding suppliments I would take a water sample to the LFS and have it checked. As fishfreek suggested you may wish to get better kits. Seachem is good but you might try Salifert as well.

Quote:
tanks amonia has gone up since adding hermits and snails. or something on lr is dying.
It could be from the rock or overfeeding the fish. The inverts will not add to the bioload (unless they die). Water changes would be the best way to deal with the NH3. It would also help fix any chemistry issues you have providing the saltmix is balanced. Have you tested a newly mixed batch of SW (after 24 hrs) to determine the levels?

Quote:
so ph should be 8-8.2
what should KH be at
and Gh
GH is a measure of the combined magensium and calcium in the water and is unimportant for what you need. Total alkalinity or carbonate hardness is what's important. It's a measure of carbonate and bicarbonate in the water. Magnesium and Ca should be determined by seperate test kits.
NSW alk levels range from 1.5 - 3 mEq/l but up to 4.25-4.5 is safe. 75-145 ppm or up to 220ish ppm depending on calcium levels.

ph levels are not relative to the alkalinity as a measure but they are tied together. If alk is too low or too high, it can affect ph but it does not detrmine the ph level. Alkalinity is a measure of the waters ability to resist changes in ph. The level of ph is also dependant on the time of day tested. 8.1-8.3 being optimum but there will be variances as it is affected by the available O2 in the water at a given time and the acids working against the alkalinity. At night after the lights go off, the algaes in the tank work much like house plants. They consume O2 and give off CO2 which pulls the ph down somewhat. Having a 7.9-8.0 ph in the morning before the lights come on is not uncommon. After the lights come on, those same algaes will switch production and start consuming CO2 and give off O2. That will result in the ph naturally climbing throughtout the day. Nearing the end of the light cycle is when the ph will be at it's highest and can reach upwards of 8.4-8.5 depending on the tanks set up. The best method of determining ph is to test midway through the photoperiod and always try testing at the same time of day to detrmine stability.

Try >>this article<<. It might help with some of the basics.

Quote:
What about live bacteria do you use it.
Don't waste your money

Cheers
Steve
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Old 04-05-2004, 05:59 PM   #7
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Ok just back from tulsa nice store packfan was closed when i went by first but came back by. I like the corals to bad im not ready for them still cycling I guess

I do have glass top, with seals in back to keep fish in. going to try the 1/2 hour cup test and see if helps.

I asked about the GH test and got same answer, no need to test for saltwater, will give to my sister who has fresh,

My amonia has risen again , thinking continued die off due to ph level should I add ph 8.3 from seachem marine buffer.

I have not added calcuim but was talking about GH which as i just learned is not important, do I need seperate calcium test or should I just add the araga milk. which is calcium and buffer.



I used power head to clean some of stuff off rock looks better.

I'm told to buffer and airate my water changes 24 hour prior to water changes,
how fast can I add water to tank. poor in or drip
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Old 04-05-2004, 06:04 PM   #8
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Oh one more thing do you ever use live bacteria products?

I have some, but have not heard anyone here using it, Is it useful or just taking up space.

My sister has salt tank with two clowns I have 5 apistasia annemones can I get one off to give here. or should I just joe's jucie them.
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Old 04-05-2004, 09:31 PM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by f-dean
My amonia has risen again , thinking continued die off due to ph level should I add ph 8.3 from seachem marine buffer.
I would actually suggest a few water changes instead. It will lower the ammonia and the buffers contained in the saltmix will help adjust the ph some. Having insufficient breathing area (glass cover), the tank will generally have cronic low ph unless using a sump with a large surface area.

Quote:
I have not added calcuim but was talking about GH which as i just learned is not important, do I need seperate calcium test or should I just add the araga milk. which is calcium and buffer.
Never add anything to the tank you cannot test for and always test before you add anything. Wait until you have the proper test kits so you can determine if any additions are necessary. As I said, the saltmix should do all you need for now as long as it is chemically balanced properly.

Quote:
I'm told to buffer and airate my water changes 24 hour prior to water changes,
how fast can I add water to tank. poor in or drip
The water does need to be properly aerated but rarely if ever needs buffering. Newly mixed SW should already have a proper alk/Ca balance. Remove the desired amount of water from the tank and replace it with the premixed SW. It does not need to be dripped in. Even when topping off with unsalinated RO water, it does not need to be buffered or dripped.

Quote:
Oh one more thing do you ever use live bacteria products?
Yes, they are bunk!

Quote:
My sister has salt tank with two clowns I have 5 apistasia annemones can I get one off to give here. or should I just joe's jucie them.
Unless your sister miffed you in some way, I'd juice 'em.

Cheers
Steve
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