More fish, and why petco makes me go "huh?"

[bighabeeb]

OK, so...72 gallon tank, 2 firefish and a sleeper goby. Everyone is happy, healthy, doing good things and living fishily, just as they should be. Haven't added fish in about 2 weeks, and all the levels are good, yadda yadda yadda.

So, I stopped by petco today to pick up some food for my son's rabbit, and happened to have a conversation with the new manager - they had some new, unusual (for petco) salt water stuff in the back and I was curious about the change (a haitian anemone and some clarkii clowns, both unusual for that location). Didn't have any interest in the livestock per se, but chatted with the guy who is a self proclaimed saltwater reef enthusiast.

So we get to talking about my tank, whats in there, whats not in there, what I want to add and so forth. And the conversation, at some point, goes like this:
Me: I have 2 firefish and am thinking about a royal gramma
Him: Don't do that, they're super aggressive and will go after the firefish
Me: Really? I picked gramma over dottyback because I was under the impression they were peaceful
Him: No way man, grammas are at least as aggressive as dottybacks
Me: Well...ok...anyway I'm waiting on adding more fish until I get the hang of feeding my open brain
Him: Why would you feed an open brain? You dont need to do that

Now I always tend to prefer experience over a website with a paragraph from someone I have no knowledge of...however this guy's advice appears to go against everything I've read, seen etc. Reefkeepers had a huge thread about open brains and how they'll LIVe without being fed, but to thrive need regular (2x a week at least) feedings - especially the red, deeper water ones (like the one I have...liveaquaria confirms). Liveaquaria also reports that the royal gramma is a peaceful fish except against its own kind.

So my question is this....is petco man full of doodoo? Is he trying to turn his store's reputation around with bad advice, or am I reading too much online?

What do y'all think about a royal gramma with a couple of firefish?

 

[Patrick93]

He's dumb and needs to be told that lol

 

[bighabeeb]

He's dumb and needs to be told that lol

That's kinda what I came away thinking as well. It's weird I mean...he wasn't pushing me to buy anything there (though I did end up buying some frozen mysis for the coral he told me I shouldn't need to feed)...the whole conversation was just so ODD!

I mean, look, everyone is an expert, we all know that...and there's lots of different theories about the right way to go about all of this...but it's rare that someone almost seems to be intentionally telling you the opposite of conventional wisdom.

 

[BallinCrew10]

Grammas can be aggressive. As can dottybacks. I had to return a dottyback that kept going after my sixline. Every fish is different though.

 

[Greenturtle]

That's kinda what I came away thinking as well. It's weird I mean...he wasn't pushing me to buy anything there (though I did end up buying some frozen mysis for the coral he told me I shouldn't need to feed)...the whole conversation was just so ODD!

I mean, look, everyone is an expert, we all know that...and there's lots of different theories about the right way to go about all of this...but it's rare that someone almost seems to be intentionally telling you the opposite of conventional wisdom.

One time when I was getting some food for my geckos I saw a maroon, clarkii, and Occelaris clown in the same tank. I tried to tell the fish guy that they would probably fight before anyone bought them, but he said "since they're clownfish, they won't fight." He also tried to argue with "Nemo and Marlin didn't fight in Finding Nemo, did they?"

 

[Bige]

I talked to the saltwater "expert" yesterday and I was buying mg. He said what's that for? So they seem to have enough knowledge to get hired and that it.

 

[crister13]

I agree. I was talking to someone at petsmart once and they didnt know what an arowana was............... lol.

 

[BallinCrew10]

One time when I was getting some food for my geckos I saw a maroon, clarkii, and Occelaris clown in the same tank. I tried to tell the fish guy that they would probably fight before anyone bought them, but he said "since they're clownfish, they won't fight." He also tried to argue with "Nemo and Marlin didn't fight in Finding Nemo, did they?"

Ha WOW. Disney movie reference, that's what I want to hear lol. Well educated argument he's got going there haha.

 

[BallinCrew10]

HAHAHA I hope you countered with the fact that there were also vegetarian sharks...not that I've watched the movie or anything....

 

[bighabeeb]

HAHAHA I hope you countered with the fact that there were also vegetarian sharks...not that I've watched the movie or anything....

Fish are friends, not food.

 

[Sharklover]

Nxt time u see him dnt stop "just keep swimming" cuz hees an idiot and shood b exicuted at dawn lol! Peace out jelly man!

 

[yetee]

perhaps they are sending him mislabeled fish. Quite often it happens there, not too long ago they had a mimic tang labeled as a lemon peel angel at the petco by me. The royal gramma and the royal dottyback could easily be mistaken for each other, especially if they are labeled as one of the others.

I have never heard that brain corals absolutely need to be fed. Yes there are some corals that have to be fed or they will die, such as the sun coral or the carnation tree corals. However, it sounds like this guy was actually trying to save you some money instead of just getting you to buy everything you dont actually need.

Also Live Aquaria specifically states, "The symbiotic algae zooxanthellae hosted within its body provides the majority of its nutritional requirements through photosynthesis." and that although it may be somewhat beneficial to feed the coral it is not necessary to do it. most of the time it will feed on pods and other things that are already in your water column.

I am not the biggest fan of petco either but sometimes I think threads like this come up just to try and bash on them. most the people in that store get paid minimum wage, but everyone expects to get people with phd's in marine science....

 

[kay-bee19]

...most of the time it will feed on pods and other things that are already in your water column...

I used to feed my LPS corals quite regularly (at least once weekly if not more often) for a couple of years but have since curtailed feedings to 1-3 times a year for the last couple of years. I haven't noticed any diminished LPS coral growth rate, to include my open brain, it's continued to put on size.

There have been times when I've been checking out my reef tank at night (hours after the lights have gone off) using a flashlight and many times there would be clouds of these free-swimming tiny shrimp (mysids?) that were attracted to the light beam. As they drew closer to the light source they get captured by LPS feeder tentacles that happened to be between them and the flash light.

I imagine on a nightly basis many of these tiny crustaceans (as well as 'pods and what not) end up sustaining my corals. So they're getting 'fed' even if I'm not target feeding them.

 

[Andy Sager]

He's not totally right or wrong...

OK, so...72 gallon tank, 2 firefish and a sleeper goby. Everyone is happy, healthy, doing good things and living fishily, just as they should be. Haven't added fish in about 2 weeks, and all the levels are good, yadda yadda yadda.

So, I stopped by petco today to pick up some food for my son's rabbit, and happened to have a conversation with the new manager - they had some new, unusual (for petco) salt water stuff in the back and I was curious about the change (a haitian anemone and some clarkii clowns, both unusual for that location). Didn't have any interest in the livestock per se, but chatted with the guy who is a self proclaimed saltwater reef enthusiast.

So we get to talking about my tank, whats in there, whats not in there, what I want to add and so forth. And the conversation, at some point, goes like this:
Me: I have 2 firefish and am thinking about a royal gramma
Him: Don't do that, they're super aggressive and will go after the firefish
Me: Really? I picked gramma over dottyback because I was under the impression they were peaceful
Him: No way man, grammas are at least as aggressive as dottybacks
Me: Well...ok...anyway I'm waiting on adding more fish until I get the hang of feeding my open brain
Him: Why would you feed an open brain? You dont need to do that

Now I always tend to prefer experience over a website with a paragraph from someone I have no knowledge of...however this guy's advice appears to go against everything I've read, seen etc. Reefkeepers had a huge thread about open brains and how they'll LIVe without being fed, but to thrive need regular (2x a week at least) feedings - especially the red, deeper water ones (like the one I have...liveaquaria confirms). Liveaquaria also reports that the royal gramma is a peaceful fish except against its own kind.

So my question is this....is petco man full of doodoo? Is he trying to turn his store's reputation around with bad advice, or am I reading too much online?

What do y'all think about a royal gramma with a couple of firefish?

After spending over 40 years in the aquarium trade in both retail and wholesale, ( 30+ with marines) I can tell you that Royal Grammas can have a nasty disposition not only against their own kind but other hole dwelling fishes as well. Also, there are 2 varieties of Royal Grammas so the type is important too. The way around it is to make sure that there are plenty of holes for your fish to make homes in with extras "just in case." Same goes for Dottybacks. I've kept multiple varieties of dottybacks together in tanks using this same method. Plus, these were wild caught fish so their true wild nature was in play. It all depends on the size of the aquarium and the way it is decorated. The bigger the better!

As for the brain coral, once again he was both right and wrong. The coral can live without your feeding it but will live BETTER if you do feed it.

As for the Haitian anemone, I've had or seen many fish use them. Clowns, Domino Damsels, Shrimps, etc. They were a good substitute for a Ritteri or Bubble anemone. I even once saw a Royal Blue Hepatus Tang (a.k.a. Hippo Tang) in one. He was not being eaten by it either He was rubbing himself along the tenticles just like a clownfish would. To date, the strangest thing I've seen in a marine aquarium. (I would love to know if anyone else ever had this experience.)

As for the Multiple species of clownfish in one aquarium, it's more common than you think. Also, since so many clownfish being offered for sale are tank raised, they very possibly were raised in communal tanks from a young age so the natural dislike for one another has been broken or removed. Once again, I've had many varieties of wild caught clowns together as long as there was enough space. That's the key!

As for advice, there is a reason why the Petcos and PetSmarts and chain shops like them don't carry much in the way of saltwater fish or equipment. It takes more than a little knowledge to keep and maintain a proper SW tank. That requires someone with more education and experience and that costs MONEY. My local PetSmart employee told me that they don't even order the fish they sell. Corporate does it for them from their main headquarters. I've always enjoyed the selecting which fish I was going to make available to my customers. I knew their needs and preferences and was able to get them unique fishes that fit into their tanks. My suggestion, if you want specialized knowledge, go to your local "Mom and Pop" pet shop and support them. They are the ones doing what you are trying to do. If you keep looking for expertice in the chain stores, you're going to be looking for a long time and spending a lot of money in dead fish. The few extra pennies you'll pay at the local store will be worth it in the long run. They're the ones who will reward your loyalty not the chain stores. I know this because that's how I was treated and I treated my customers.

Hope this helps..

Andy