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Old 05-17-2005, 06:53 PM   #11
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Thanks Steve. I will have to try it to see. I have been using B-ionic for a little while but just got my calcium test kit. I am also waiting for the LFS to get more Salifert Alk test kits. My calcium is at 370 and I thought the kalk would be easier to raise it a little and then use the B-ionic to maintain that level. Does this sound logical?

Stephen
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Old 05-17-2005, 07:03 PM   #12
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Kalk is a great maintainer but if you have an imbalance, it won't help. Wait until you get the alk kit replaced and post both your alkalinity and Ca levels. You should get these two balanced before using kalk. If you use the kalk with unbalanced chemistry it will just make matters worse and much harder to correct. If you've stopped using B-ionic, you'll need to get a stand alone CaCl to help boost the Ca. Don't start any new dosing regime until you confirm your current chem levels though.

What salt mix do you use?

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Old 05-17-2005, 08:57 PM   #13
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That sounds like good advice. I will wait before trying the kalk. I hope the LFS gets the Alk test in quickly. He said there is a back order and I am going to stick with the Salifert kits. I don't really have many corals(mushrooms and a small leather of some kind) but I have noticed the coralline growth slowing down. I'd like to keep it growing well. I've been using 20ml of B-ionic every day. Is it safe to continue this? The guy at another LFS that I take very little advice from anymore said I wouldn't need to test the water to use the 2 part supplements, but that was before I became a member of AA.

I use IO salt. It seems it is notorious for a lower Ca reading when freshly mixed.

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Old 05-17-2005, 10:21 PM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by saltwatersmac
I've been using 20ml of B-ionic every day. Is it safe to continue this?
Hard to answer without some additional info. How long have you been dosing that amount, what do your test results show/how often where you testing and is that 10 ml each or 20 ml?

Quote:
The guy at another LFS that I take very little advice from anymore said I wouldn't need to test the water to use the 2 part supplements, but that was before I became a member of AA.
LOL, gotta love those types. You should go back and tell them you had a tank wipe out because of their advise and watch them back peddle. Just kidding of course but.. wishful thinking!

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I use IO salt. It seems it is notorious for a lower Ca reading when freshly mixed.
That can easily be fixed with some Kent Turbo Ca. A small addition to your mixing pail before using in the tank should help the imbalance. You can use the calculator below to figure out how much... be sure to wait a good 12+ hours before tweeking to be sure the chemistry has stabalized.
http://home.comcast.net/~jdieck1/chem_calc3.html

Cheers
Steve
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Old 05-18-2005, 11:04 PM   #15
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I've been using 20 ml of both parts for a total of 40 ml. That was the starting point to use based on the bottles directions for my 90 gal. I've only tested the Ca twice in a week since I bought the test kit. It read 350 and then 370 two days later while dosing this amount. I actually started using Kent Tech CB but recently switched to ESV because its a little cheaper. I've been using these products for over a year without testing until recently. I am almost ready to make the switch over to a sump/fuge from all the HOB equipment I am using now. I have had good success but I plan on more corals later and I want to get all the parameters as close as I can.

I will do the Kent Turbo Ca for my water changes. I will not try anything drastic until I get that Alk kit then I will report back with numbers.

Nice idea on the guy at the LFS. That should be a lot of fun to watch.

Thanks again for all your help!!!

Stephen
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Old 05-19-2005, 11:31 AM   #16
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Somethings not adding up. Your current Ca level is 370 ppm? After 2 daily additions (previously) your Ca goes from 350 to 370?

If the 20 ml each is a daily addition ongoing, you should still see the Ca increasing. Unless the alk has gotten very high, your current Ca level doesn't make sense.

What kind of hard corals do you have and how often do you do water changes?

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Old 05-19-2005, 09:48 PM   #17
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Steve I couldn't wait no longer so I got an Aquarium Pharmaceuticals Alk kit. It'll have to do until the Salifert's come in at the store.

I have been a little sloppy with my additions. I try to add that every day but sometimes I miss one. I am going to make a better attempt now that I can test and make adjustments with your help. Also, how often should I test to get the numbers in the ideal range?

I just got done testing and here are the numbers:
pH 8.24 => Hannah meter
Ca 365 ppm => Salifert kit
Alk 11 dKH => Aquarium Pharmaceuticals kit
Salinity 1.024 => Hydrometer reading adjusted with Refractometer reading
Temp 28 deg C(82.4 F) => Hannah meter

I actually didn't realize the tank got that hot. I will turn the heater down since I like to shoot for 80 deg F.

The only corals I currently have are 2 bunches of mushrooms with about 8 on each rock and a small leather that I got an a piece of live rock. I also have about 20 majanos that grew on another chunk of rock. I thought they were pretty cool until I started reading on AA and discovered they were considered pests

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Old 05-19-2005, 10:19 PM   #18
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Considering what's in your tank, most of your issue will be with the salmix depending on how often/how much water changes are done. Scleractinians and heavy coralline growth are your main draws on CaCO3.

The first goal should be to re-balance your chemistry. It would be much easier through a series of water changes once you tweek the IO with some Turbo Ca. Need you to post the numbers of a new batch after mixing for 12ish hrs and the water volume used before doing any "tweeking". Chemistry additions should also be done after the 12 hour mark to be sure it does not cause abiotic precip.

If not, you can easily add 1 tspn of Turbo Ca pre dissolved in your top off water each day for 7 days. If will bring it back up towards the 400-410 ppm level. At the same time, you need to let the alk fall to about 7 DKH. This would put you in a much better balanced region. You will still need to figure out the balance on your saltmix or this problem will re-occur with future water changes.

Once the main tanks balance is accomplished, the next goal is testing every second day or so to plot the rate of depletion. Make sure no water changes or additives are used for a good 6 days. So basically test Monday, Wednesday and Friday. You'll be able to see from the first test to the last a total net change in your chemistry and give you a better idea each days approximate usage. You can then target the amounts needed each day with much more accuracey. Once you have a additive schedule plotted, you can ease off testing to weekly at first to confirm the additions are working and augment where needed. After a short time, monthly or twice monthly testing will be all that is needed unless coral additions are made that might change the equation.

As far as your Majano problem... http://www.joesjuice.com

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Old 05-19-2005, 10:38 PM   #19
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I forgot to mention earlier that I do a 20 gal water change once a month. I will get the Turbo Ca. I looked today but the store was out. I will try another one this weekend. I will start making RO water now so I can mix a batch. I will post back with numbers before I add the Turbo Ca.

What kind of schedule of water changes will be best? It seems I should stop the other additives until the balance is reached?

Don't mean to sound crazy but what are scleractinians?

I'm also curious. What brand of salt do you prefer?

Thanks
Stephen
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Old 05-19-2005, 11:02 PM   #20
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Quote:
Originally Posted by saltwatersmac
I will post back with numbers before I add the Turbo Ca.


Quote:
What kind of schedule of water changes will be best?
Hard to say, it's best to see what the need is. If this is still a newer tank set up, about 10-15% weekly would be best. It really depends on if it's being done for chemistry, nutrient control or trace element replenishment. If simpley trace elements 10ish % every few weeks is fine. Monthly does not really help. It allows the levels to fall off and become unbalanced.

Quote:
It seems I should stop the other additives until the balance is reached?
And until the rate of depletion is calculated.

Quote:
Don't mean to sound crazy but what are scleractinians?
Hard corals...

Quote:
I'm also curious. What brand of salt do you prefer?
I don't really like trying to influence people in this regard. I think it's best to find a salt you can work with a stick to it. There is no such thing as a "perfect salt" and all have varying chemistries. Personally I use Kent Marine as I have always found it to be the best balanced and consistant for my needs.

Cheers
Steve
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