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Old 11-10-2005, 07:53 PM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by runway1
Well there I must correct. Glass is glass and light is light. MOST light may come from the top but light does enter through the glass. And yes, curved glass distorts light.

Also, most folks have FW tanks with 30-60 watts of light. In those cases MOST of the light would actually come through the glass and not the hood.
Even with only 30-60w of light, it is placed right over the top of the tank and the units are designed to reflect the light down. Thus, I don't believe the ambient light for a room with a lamp would actually put more light into the tank. The only logical way would be natural sunlight from the tank near a window....but as stated if the majority of the aquarium industry is FW than likely the majority of tanks are not near windows (most FW tanks run higher nitrates and sunlight power would complete the equation for algae growth). The only way to state your claim would be to borrow/buy a PAR meter and measure the light in the tank and the light in the tank again with the flourescents off....taking into account how long the tank gets ambient room light, etc.

I'd understand the whole "curved glass distortion" more if the stress would be stated more clearly. Is it stress due to vision distortion through the glass? I don't know how big of a factor this would be anyway, since most fish do not have great vision to begin with. I would also point out that most if not all public aquariums have at least some displays with curved glass. I would have expected, with the normal staff of experienced marine/biologists in charge of such displays that a correlation would have been established some time ago.

An internet search yielded nothing, including a Google scholar search for research papers.
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Old 11-10-2005, 08:21 PM   #12
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It makes good sense if you ask me. Imagine if you lived in a glass room and every time you looked out, everything was distorted and blurry. It would probably make me feel sick.
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Old 11-10-2005, 08:25 PM   #13
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ok, then I will just say this. I have a 175 bowfront. My fish are pigs...I almost wish something would upset their digestion a little.
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Old 11-10-2005, 10:28 PM   #14
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I also run and fix network for a living. Must be something fishy in the air LOL
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Old 11-11-2005, 01:19 PM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DragonForce
It makes good sense if you ask me. Imagine if you lived in a glass room and every time you looked out, everything was distorted and blurry. It would probably make me feel sick.
First and foremost, if the glass was that distorted and blurry, I don't understand why it would be used in aquaria since the purpose of them is to look at.

Second, it is important to note that human and fish eyes and vision are very different.....even among fish it is very different. Much of this depends on environment and the purpose of the eye. Some fish are only able to distinguish shapes or movement, while others (especially marine reef fish) have evolved to distinguish colors, etc. In all of these cases "blurry" is much more of a human description because we rely more on finer details.

Fish have multifocal lenses for the purpose of correcting light refraction, so without scientific literature I find it tough to determine whether they would be inhibited or disturbed by glass with simply a different curvature.
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Old 11-11-2005, 01:40 PM   #16
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If this were true, wouldn't that mean they would have to outlaw fish bowls too since they all have at least 2 curved sides that would distort the light?
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Old 11-11-2005, 03:43 PM   #17
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I would like to add that Runway's intitial comment regarding bow front tanks and light distortion is quite interesting. She, however, was not bluntly stating that "Curved tanks stress fish and cause them to live a shortened life."; she simply stated that she had HEARD this and was asking for input from fellow aquarists. She did not intend her comment to anger or frustrate fellow aquarists who own bow front tanks. It was simply just something to think about.

I'm willing to bet not one of us here is a optical physicist, so no one can really be sure how curved glass affects fishes. Curved glass may have no effect on fish. However it may, indeed, distort light in such a way to visually irritate fish. This irritation may be minor or more involved.

From my experience (I've had bow front tanks in the past), I have never seen any ill effects on fish. But I can not say for sure that the bowed glass did not have some effect on the fish. I do not know, and I do not think anyone here knows for sure. It is definitely something that I am interested in researching. JMO
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Old 11-11-2005, 04:16 PM   #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ClamKnuckle
If this were true, wouldn't that mean they would have to outlaw fish bowls too since they all have at least 2 curved sides that would distort the light?
italy recently banned goldfish bowls. not because of the curved glass, but because they are oxygen restrictive.
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Old 11-11-2005, 04:20 PM   #19
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well, at least there is someone with power out there who is *trying* to make sure fish are kept in decent conditions.
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Old 11-11-2005, 04:50 PM   #20
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HoopsGuru
Quote:
Originally Posted by DragonForce
It makes good sense if you ask me. Imagine if you lived in a glass room and every time you looked out, everything was distorted and blurry. It would probably make me feel sick.
First and foremost, if the glass was that distorted and blurry, I don't understand why it would be used in aquaria since the purpose of them is to look at.

Second, it is important to note that human and fish eyes and vision are very different.....even among fish it is very different. Much of this depends on environment and the purpose of the eye. Some fish are only able to distinguish shapes or movement, while others (especially marine reef fish) have evolved to distinguish colors, etc. In all of these cases "blurry" is much more of a human description because we rely more on finer details.

Fish have multifocal lenses for the purpose of correcting light refraction, so without scientific literature I find it tough to determine whether they would be inhibited or disturbed by glass with simply a different curvature.
The distortion that the curved glass gives off is subjective to distance. Meaning, the fish, corals, rock, etc are close to the glass making the distortion very minor to the distortion they recieve by looking outward. Think of it similar to a magnifying glass. When you try to look at things in the distance it feels quite nausiating.

Keep in mind the effect of the glass curvature is probably rather negligible, but none the less should be taken into consideration. I have seen some tanks with rather extreme curvage.

I can really only picture the curvature having a negative impact on stressed fish, such as during the first few days of acclimation.
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37 gal all glass
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3' fine sand bed 1x Orange Stripe Prawn shrimp goby, 1x sixline wrassemated pair of true percula clowns, 1x CBS shrimp, 2x peppermint shrimp, 1x pistol shrimp, 1x tiger tale cuke, ~20+ snails, ~10+ hermits, 1xserpent star.
green Bubble coral, hammer coral (8 heads!) ,various Zoos,green finger leather, green star polpys ,shrooms
175w 10k MH
28w actinic 03
2x maxi jett 1200
Prizm skimmer (modded)
Hagen powerfilter(for running carbon 24/7)
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