QT Tank Set up (For new fish)

[fishman]

I have a 30 gallon QT tank that will have 2 HOB filters, heater, 1 small powerhead and PVC in the bottom. Im going to seed my HOB biowheels in my sump for 3 weeks. When Im ready to put a new fish in the QT tank, I will do a water change from my main into my QT. I will then move the biowheels and put them into action. What else would I need to do in order to prevent a cycle? Im only going to QT 1-2 small fish - IE firefish, then maybe a small yellow tang by itself, etc.
I thought about buying a small 5 lb of LR that is uncycled and put it in there. However the QT tank has had copper in it before so I would have to keep the LR in there and up and running once the QT time is over or pull it out and use it as base rock the next time I set up a QT tank.
Any suggestions? Each time I have set up a QT tank, I have not had good luck as it wants to cycle. I also have some polyfilter ready in the event my levels start rising and also some Prime.

 

[Macrosill]

To setup a "cycled" QT tank properly you will need some filter material that has been in the main tank for some time. What kind of hob filters are you using? I am assuming you are using a Penguin or Emporer, due to your biowheel description. If so then you would be well advised to put the standard filter material in the filters as well as the biowheels. The filter material will hold more beneficial bacteria. You do not need to take water from your main tank. There is no beneficial bacteria free floating in the water. All you will be doing is introducing nitrAtes into the qt tank. Just use new water that is very close if not the same parameters of the main tank. You can skip the LR in the qt tank.

Be sure to acclimate your fish to your qt tank just as if you were adding it to you main tank. I use the drip method.

Good Luck,
Brian

 

[steve-s]

Be sure to acclimate your fish to your qt tank just as if you were adding it to you main tank. I use the drip method.

Actually a much easier/faster/safer way is to test the parameters of the shipping water and manipulate the QT water to match. It greatly speeds up acclimation time. If the item is from an online source, ammonia and low O2 will be a rather large concern. Getting the fish out of that shipping water should be done quickly. Temp and pH being the two biggies, if the salinity in the bag is high, it's fine to add a fish to a lower salinity. It should never be added to a higher salinity.

Cheers
Steve

 

[fishman]

Macrosill
Im using 2 Penguin HOB filters (Like a 150 and 170). I have tried in the past using the filters that go inside the HOB and they collect a lot of stuff! I attribute a lot of my levels being elevated to these. Theres no way to clean them other than rinsing them off with tank water - but this Im sure also cleans off some of the good bacteria. I know I dont need to take water from my tank when setting it up, but since I have 0 trates, theres no reason not to in my mind. And yes I will acclimate using drip as well. I just am having a hard time understanding why my past QT tanks have had so many problems...not with just trates but ammonia. I had levels of like .50+ and never could get it down.

Steve
Long time no talk to! Glad to see your still around. I think you and I went through the whole QT tank issue when I was doing hypo last year. All is still well with my fish that went through that. And again I thank you!!
I want to try and avoid the drama I had last time. For 8 weeks I battled ammonia all the way to trates, and then back again. I want to have a good bacteria base for the QT tank. Granted I will only have 1 fish in there at a time and MAYBE 2 very small fish at most. Any thoughts as to making sure I have a good bacteria base? How can I make sure the tank is cycled? I started seeding my biowheels tonight. Will leave them in the sump for like 3-4 weeks? I also have a load of polyfilterfor my QT tank.
Also did you tell me that if you use prime, you need a special test kit that wont be thrown off by Prime?? Any and all suggestions are appreciated!

 

[steve-s]

Any thoughts as to making sure I have a good bacteria base? How can I make sure the tank is cycled? I started seeding my biowheels tonight. Will leave them in the sump for like 3-4 weeks? I also have a load of polyfilterfor my QT tank.

Polyfilters work amazingly well for helping with nitrogens. You just have to remember not to let it become a biofilter in the process (rinse regularly in RO) and be sure it's removed if medicating.

The best means of seeding any biomaterial is for it to be "in use". Simpley placing it in a seeded tank is not always sufficient and rather slow. If the HOB can actually be set up and run in the sump or what have you, it will seed all that much faster. Same goes for air driven sponge/corner filters. A biowheel gets my vote every time for QT's though.

Also did you tell me that if you use prime, you need a special test kit that wont be thrown off by Prime?? Any and all suggestions are appreciated!

Certain dechlor/nitrogen binders can skew readings for ammonia especially for some time unless using carbon. Basically you end up with a false possitive. The best kit for this is usually Seachems ammonia kit or their ammonia alert badge. The kit being the more accurate of the two. I think the one topic we where discussing was the Cupramine which is amine based. The amines in the copper can fool many ammonia test kits reading it as ammonia.

Cheers
Steve

 

[fishman]

Steve

I have a problem with putting the HOB filters into "use". The 2 HOB filters I have on my QT tank have been exposed to cupramine (copper). So I would not think I would want to use these in my main tank and then rotate them back to my QT. If I just keep the wheels in the sump, how long will they take to see without being in use? Any other suggestions?
Yes I remember the test kit and ammonia badge. I had more luck with the actual test kit.

 

[steve-s]

If the HOB is not usable, then be sure the wheel is placed in a high flow area. Either where the water exits into the sump or the outport of the skimmer. As long as it's not placed passively in the sump, it should seed much faster. Time frame would depend on the nutrient level of the tank but a week would be a good starting point.

Cheers
Steve

 

[fishman]

Yes I have 2 wheels in the return section of my sump. Meaning where the water drops down from the tank and begins its travel from one end of the sump to the other. So its in the highest flow area possible. How long would you leave them in there before using? Also what do you think about using rubble rock from my sump to go into the QT tank? OR a say 4-5 lb of LR and once Im done with the QT tank just discard it for next time...

 

[steve-s]

How long would you leave them in there before using?

At least one week but preferably two.

Also what do you think about using rubble rock from my sump to go into the QT tank? OR a say 4-5 lb of LR and once Im done with the QT tank just discard it for next time...

Nope, they will interfer to some degree with most meds, especially copper.

Cheers
Steve

 

[fishman]

Oh...well I wasnt going even going to think about starting the QT for another 2-3 weeks at least..so this should work.
Also once I set it up and running and want to make sure I have enough bacteria in the QT tank, can I test it without adding a fish first to make sure it will carry the bioload of the fish?

 

[steve-s]

Also once I set it up and running and want to make sure I have enough bacteria in the QT tank, can I test it without adding a fish first to make sure it will carry the bioload of the fish?

You can do it without a fish but it still needs a nutrient source. There could be a good lot of bacteria but no hobbyist test will tell you that without something rotting or ammonia being added/produced.

Cheers
Steve

 

[fishman]

Ok so once I get the QT up and running, to be sure I would throw a peice of shrimp or krill in the tank and wait say 3-4 days?

 

[steve-s]

Not enough time to tell really. Why not set the QT up now instead of in 2-3 weeks and just cycle it the same you would your display?

Cheers
Steve

 

[fishman]

Question is what do you cycle with? The reason I ask is I tried cycling it last time with 8-10 krill. In about 3 days I had slime everywhere in the tank. It was like floating snot in the tank. I assume this was because of the krill?
I have asked at like Walmart and such about a large peice of shrimp that is uncooked and unseasoned and cant seem to find any...
Is the snot normal? How many shrimp for a 30 gallon? Any recommendations?

 

[steve-s]

Question is what do you cycle with? The reason I ask is I tried cycling it last time with 8-10 krill. In about 3 days I had slime everywhere in the tank. It was like floating snot in the tank. I assume this was because of the krill?

If it was a thick clear slime, it was an accumulation of bacteria. For the average QT size, one or two krill would have been plenty. Dried foods though are not as advantageous as fresh. Takes much longer for them to break down .

I have asked at like Walmart and such about a large peice of shrimp that is uncooked and unseasoned and cant seem to find any...
Is the snot normal? How many shrimp for a 30 gallon? Any recommendations?

If you have any frozen food, add some of that. Really doesn't matter what form the ammonia comes from as long as it's produced. You also don't need high numbers for a tank to cycle. As long as the ammonia registers above 0.05, it's all good.

Set the tank up, add your ammonia source, let it run about a week and then add your biowheel. You should have an ammonia reading by the time the wheel is added so you can easily guage the effectiveness and readiness of the biofilter by the end of the second week.

Remember, no rock or sand. Just inert plastics or decorations of some kind for the fish to hide. You can use carbon/resin products, just be sure you rinse them regularaly in FW or change for new so they do not become a bilogical source. If treatment with a med becomes necessary, they willl need to be removed and you don't want the biofilter going with them.

Cheers
Steve

 

[fishman]

Sorry it took me so long to get back...
Yes the slime was clear for the most part. I just dont remember it being like that.
Yes I am soaking the bio wheels now for the QT tank and will throw in a couple of small krill once the QT is up and running like you said. I want the biowheels to soak for a couple or maybe 3 weeks. Im in no hurry!!!
Ok so Im going to use polyfilter. I do rinse them in FW and not the tank water when Im doing a water change? I thought by rinsing the filters and such in FW it would kill the bacteria?

 

[steve-s]

I want the biowheels to soak for a couple or maybe 3 weeks. Im in no hurry!!!

The longer it seeds the better it will be. So if three weeks is doable, your just fine.

Ok so Im going to use polyfilter. I do rinse them in FW and not the tank water when Im doing a water change? I thought by rinsing the filters and such in FW it would kill the bacteria?

Since this is a QT application, the Polyfilter may need to be removed if meds are added. In keeping with that, you do not want it to become an integral part of the biofilter. Using FW will help keep it clean and at the same time keep it from being a bacterial source. Let your biowheel handle that, they really are excellent for this.

Cheers
Steve

 

[fishman]

Oh I see. Well if I am relying on the biowheel then I will for sure make sure it is seeded well. Would you think rinsing it every other day would be appropriate?
Also what would keep me from using Prime as well just because? It cant hurt can it? Or should I just go without it and see what happens??
Thanks for all your help!!

 

[steve-s]

Would you think rinsing it every other day would be appropriate?

Should work fine but you don't need to use the polyfilter until there's actually fish in the tank. Completely uneccesary otherwise and a waste of $$.

Also what would keep me from using Prime as well just because? It cant hurt can it? Or should I just go without it and see what happens??

The only reason you will need to use Prime and/or the like is if the biofilter wasn't functioning and the water changes wouldn't keep up. Again, no need unless there are fish in the tank or your using tap water. You need to be careful to avoid it's use if you can help it though. If copper meds are ever needed, products like Prime will break the bonds of chelates/amine based remedies and make them toxic.

Cheers
Steve