replacing LR

[BBReef]

I recently went to a club meeting in my local area and got to hear Bob Fenner (author of The conscientious Marine aquarist and Reef invertebrates for those who don't know him) speak. one thing he said that kind of surprised me was that we should be changing out a portion of our LR every year and a half, and if we don't, it will have a greater chance of crashing.

Does anyone do this? has anyone had experiences of their tanks crashing after this long? just curious about what others have to say about it.

 

[yaksplat]

Here's the only thing that I think I could get out of this. I don't know about anyone else, but when i move my rock, a lot of crud starts floating around. I almost think that It may be a good idea to do a saltwater rise with the rock every year and a half or so, but as far as removing it completely, I don't see the logic behind it.

 

[fishfreek]

I recently went to a club meeting in my local area and got to hear Bob Fenner

Awsome dude.

My guess on the logic would be that over time in our closed systems the diversity of life forms on the rock is slowly lowered to where its more a small subset of promonite microb life. Regular additions of new live rock would keep the diversity of the entire system up.

Also over time our rock will naturally shrink as the calcium carbonate in the rock disolves.

 

[SquishyFish]

If you do change out a portion of the rock every 1 1/2 years, you will never get the look of the tanks that have been set up for 5+ years and look as though they were taken from the ocean. One of the biggest elements of getting a reef tank to look like the real thing is to just leave it alone.

He is much more educated than I, and I would love to hear his reasoning behind this. But the true "reef" look will never be accomplished.

I have been in this hobby for a long time and still havent read that book...I really should go get it.

 

[reefrunner69]

I would say the theory stems from DR Ron's salt studies where he concludes that the sand and LR take up heavy meatals in the salt mixes, once they are full they start releasing them back into the water. The "Old Tank Syndrome" Theory, which is why your seeing alot of folks pulling their DSBs and going back to bare bottom tanks.

 

[SquishyFish]

I thought the OTS had been proven incorrect provided that you have the proper infauna to aerate and shift the DSB.

Squishy

 

[reefrunner69]

I think the thinking now is that they are very big sinks. They will hold the heavy metals and phosphors for only so long and then they crash. I also don't see how aerating or sifting would remove heavy metals from sand or rock.

I am also not saying I subscribe to the heavy metals theory, simply pointing out that might be a reason why Fenner would recommend replacing some rock every so often. I do find logic in the DSB being a sink. All the detritus and waste processed by the sand has an end product, not all of that end product is nitrgen, this is sunk into the DSB, over time the sulfide layer creeps ever so slowly upwards until there are problems all over the place.

 

[Biggen]

I thought the OTS had been proven incorrect provided that you have the proper infauna to aerate and shift the DSB.

I think RR is speaking of OTS as in the fact of the SB and LR absorbing heavy metals over time via food, salt mix, etc... No matter how much infauna you have, that won't make a difference to the toxic metals "sucked" into the LR and SB.

But unless we use plastic rock and bare bottom tanks, there is no way to prevent this. At least this is basically the view that I believe Dr. Ron takes...

 

[Guest]

So does this mean that if you don't change out the stuff, in the future you'll lose everything?

 

[reefrunner69]

The theory is that the rock and sand will suck up metals to a point of saturation, then they start releasing them back into the water column and the tank experiences unexplained deaths, algae blooms and crashes.

 

[Biggen]

So does this mean that if you don't change out the stuff, in the future you'll lose everything?

Who knows. This is all theory at best. People who have had their reef tanks set up for 10+ years would disagree...

 

[reefrunner69]

People who have had their reef tanks set up for 10+ years would disagree...

See the thing is, I hear all about these "people" that have had their DSB's up for 7-10 years, but no one seems to be able to name them...

The tank Dr Ron tore down due to OTS was 7 years old, again another expert in the field maintaining the DSB.

This is all theory at best.

Agreed

 

[Biggen]

See the thing is, I hear all about these "people" that have had their DSB's up for 7-10 years, but no one seems to be able to name them...

The tank Dr Ron tore down due to OTS was 7 years old, again another expert in the field maintaining the DSB.

Good point, Kevin. I had no idea about Dr. Ron's OTS. I would like to know more about that. I may have to go do some research now that my wife is watching Gilmore Girls.

I will say that if I get 7-10 years out of my tank, it will be a blessing. I actually wouldn't mind having to tear down and start over if I had that kind of run. Would be a great excuse to "upgrade" at any rate.

 

[reefrunner69]

I will say that if I get 7-10 years out of my tank, it will be a blessing. I actually wouldn't mind having to tear down and start over if I had that kind of run. Would be a great excuse to "upgrade" at any rate.

That is also where the big question lies...you've been doing SW for 8 months...can you actually forsee NOT upgrading within 5-7 years? much less 7-10...

 

[dralarms]

This looks like a fine mess I've gotten myself into. I just changed out my cc to a 5" + dsb. Now I've got my live rock into my tank you are telling me that I may have messed myself over? I know I've got alot to learn but every one I spoke with about changing from cc to a dsb said it was the best thing I could do. Ok Do I pull out the dsb and put back my cc? If so why did I have to spend around 60 bux for sand I can't use? and why is everyone looking for southdown? Sorry but I'm really :? now.

 

[reefrunner69]

Don't get bent, LOL. As has been noted in both this thread and the other, DSB's will work for years flawlessly and the whole basis behind removing them or using them is theory. I don't think there is anything wrong with a DSB, but I do believe it has a finite life span. You simply need to research them and set them up and maintain them properly and recognize the signs when your DSB has reached the end of it's life.

 

[dralarms]

Ok, thanks. And BTW I put my lr in today and I did get an ammonia spike. You were right again.

 

[BBReef]

I am planning on emailing him in the next couple days about it so hopefully i will have for sure answers about it and not just what i remember.

 

[yaksplat]

I think that in the next few years some more information will surface on this subject. By the time that you or I are in the time range for OTS there will be methods of determining how long you have, or what to look for with greater accuracy. In other words, why worry about something now, that you don't have to think about for over 5 years. I personally plan on moving in the next two and I will probably set up a new tank in the process.

Jim

 

[jamal-188]

In other words, why worry about something now, that you don't have to think about for over 5 years.
Jim

Agreed, I have enough worrying to do about corals/fish I"m buying now and learning about all this.