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Old 08-05-2012, 06:47 PM   #11
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Quote:
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cyano does not discriminate between a vodka carbon source or a vinegar carbon source.

Do you have some sort of reference to confirm this statement? A concept as simple as the Lac Operon which is taught in most high school biology curricular seems to disagree - bacteria can in fact enzymatically and allosterically differentiate between carbon sources. Assuming the above seems like a poor idea, unless of course you have some literature which shows it is true
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Old 08-05-2012, 07:42 PM   #12
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http://reefkeeping.com/joomla/index....arine-aquarium

Scientific research has found that cyanobacterial growth does not increase when dosing vinegar (acetate), where it was found that ethanol dosing will increase cyanobacterial growth. Cyanobacteria produce PHA to store energy when needed. PHA is an ingredient in some biopellets. So cyanobacteria can utilize some if not all of the biopellets. Hobbyists who have dosed vinegar have reported less cyanobacterial problems compared to dosing biopellets & ethanol. This was my experience as well.
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Old 08-05-2012, 07:43 PM   #13
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Not all carbon is created equal my friend. The false rumor is that they are all the same.
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Old 08-05-2012, 07:47 PM   #14
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Thank you for providing some reviewable evidence
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Old 08-05-2012, 07:52 PM   #15
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The coauthor Randy Holmes-Farley is pretty much THE expert in reef chemistry.
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Old 08-05-2012, 09:32 PM   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MikeYQM
http://reefkeeping.com/joomla/index....arine-aquarium

Hobbyists who have dosed vinegar have reported less cyanobacterial problems compared to dosing biopellets & ethanol. This was my experience as well.
My statement is correct. To say vinegar has nothing to do with cyano growth is incorrect. Its has an advantage over vodka for example in that vinegar increases anaerobic break-down of nutrients with the sand bed and live rock. If enough of these biofilms are present then they out compete cyano in many cases. Cyano is still a factor with vinegar although usually less of a problem because of this fact in many tanks.

I think your misinterpreting slightly. Cyano does not differentiate. Vinegar can out compete cyano through growth of anaerobic bacterial films. These films quickly break down organics and out compete cyano in sufficient numbers. Almost how an algae scrubber for instance out competes algae in the display for nutrients.

You can still have cyano issues with vinegar, ive seen it happen. Mr. Holmes-Farley even states hobbyists report LESS cyano problems compared to biopellets or vodka however the problem is not non existent.
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Old 08-05-2012, 09:37 PM   #17
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My statement is correct. To say vinegar has nothing to do with cyano growth is incorrect.

Perhaps I have misread but I do not believe anyone has said this is the case?

Do you have some sort of literature which shows that cyanobacteria does not differentiate between the carbon-containing molecules found in vinegar and ethanol? I would be interested to read about the processing of these metabolites in a controlled environment.
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Old 08-05-2012, 09:42 PM   #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MrPillow

Perhaps I have misread but I do not believe anyone has said this is the case?

Do you have some sort of literature which shows that cyanobacteria does not differentiate between the carbon-containing molecules found in vinegar and ethanol? I would be interested to read about the processing of these metabolites in a controlled environment.
No literature on the specific subject on differences. However if we use what we know we can make educated guesses
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Old 08-05-2012, 09:55 PM   #19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Schism

No literature on the specific subject on differences. However if we use what we know we can make educated guesses
I will be looking for some sources. Im compelled to research the subject not so i will let you know of sources i come across besides the one listed.

I havnt seen anything else by holmes-farley going a bit more in depth.
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Old 08-05-2012, 10:05 PM   #20
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MrPillow

Perhaps I have misread but I do not believe anyone has said this is the case?

Do you have some sort of literature which shows that cyanobacteria does not differentiate between the carbon-containing molecules found in vinegar and ethanol? I would be interested to read about the processing of these metabolites in a controlled environment.
On the flip side i would also like to know if you find such sources. The article listed while co-written by a very respectable and knowledgable person contains only experience and opinion on the subject of vinegar and cyano, no real facts presented by means of science and reasoning. The references in the article are also shaky or void on this smaller subject pertaining to vinegar and cyano and whats taking place.
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