started a saltwater talk back in July (I believe) and has since been battling non-st

[jehenry89]

Hello everyone,

My boyfriend started a saltwater talk back in July (I believe) and has since been battling non-stop algae. He first started with brown algae, which I know is normal for new tanks, then it grew into some kind of hair algae, then slime started and now it has turned into what you see in the pictures below. He is about to tear this tank apart and give up completely and I really don't want to see that happen . I have my own two planted fresh water tanks which are both very successful. I have had my battles with algae but nothing like this where there are 7 different things growing at once. We are both kind of out of ideas on how to fix this and really don't know what else to do. Please any help you can offer would be appreciated.

His specs are as follows: 50 gallon tank with 20 gallon sump, two 240watt TaoTronics LED light fixtures, automatic top off system, around 70lbs of rock (which he didn't buy live), Eshopps 75-100 gallon skimmer and two 1200 pumps. He also just added some cheato into the sump like a week ago. He also bought a phosphate reactor about a month ago and at first it seemed to be helping quiet a bit but then after about two weeks, it only seemed to make things worse.

Fish in the tank are two Picasso clown fish, one Cardinal fish, one Royal Grama and one Blenny (cant remember the specific type). There is also an assortment if snails and a cleaner shrimp in there as well.

He uses a 3 stage RODI unit to make water. MaxPureMPDI 90-GPD RODI System.
But he isn't really sure how to use it and the manual didn't come with any useful information. How do we actually operate it? Are we suppose to clean it after every use?

The light cycle is 8 hours and we do about 15% water changes weekly.

 

[jehenry89]

More pictures

 

[jehenry89]

There should be two lights there, he took the one to down to clean it.

 

[mr_X]

How are you feeding? I would cut back on feeding to a couple times a week for a while, and continue water changes. You are going to have to starve this algae out. No matter what the test kits say, you have an excess nutrient problem. Also, what supplements are you adding?

 

[jehenry89]

How are you feeding? I would cut back on feeding to a couple times a week for a while, and continue water changes. You are going to have to starve this algae out. No matter what the test kits say, you have an excess nutrient problem. Also, what supplements are you adding?

He feeds them every other day about 1/4 a cube and doesn't add any supplements because he uses reef crystals salt which is suppose have everything already in it. Every time we test for nutrients for the corals, they are right where they should be. Should we be adding more?

If figured it was something regarding the water chemistry but with all of our numbers coming out fine, I am not really sure what exactly is causing it or how to control it. : \ I am really just utterly lost as to what the heck to do. We even attempted a 3 day blackout and it literally did nothing.
Is there something we could use in the phosphate reactor to help? We attempted to use the bags in the sump at one point but there really isn't a lot of flow in there and it didn't seem to make a difference.

 

[Olliefowler]

Vodka dosing? Then introduce rowaphos and bring vodka down and keep changing rowaphos.
Manual removal is important also!!


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[Sniperhank]

This is one of those instances that you won't detect any nitrates because there is so much algae consuming it. I would do huge water changes with ro/di water. Use the old water to scrub the rocks down to get all of the current algae off.
That way you have a start point. You can then cut back to feeding, I only feed my reef tank half a cube of mysis every 3 days for example.
Continue use of your phosphate reactor, but make sure you are replacing the media monthly as it is consumed over time, between 28-30 days on average depending on the media type.
This will be a long battle, as algae always is. There are two articles in my signature that are in our articles section that will help you battle this as well. And remember, if your nitrates are 80(if you could detect them) a 50% water change would bring them to 40. So make sure they are large water changes over several days to bring it as you possibly can.

 

[jeffaquarius]

Aside from nutrients algae also needs light to grow. You combine reduce of feeding and lighting. Just remember that they love that white light. IME using more blue light will slow down their growth. Set the blue 50% for 8 hrs and the white 25% or less for 4 hours. In a week you will notice the difference.

 

[jehenry89]

This is one of those instances that you won't detect any nitrates because there is so much algae consuming it. I would do huge water changes with ro/di water. Use the old water to scrub the rocks down to get all of the current algae off.
That way you have a start point. You can then cut back to feeding, I only feed my reef tank half a cube of mysis every 3 days for example.
Continue use of your phosphate reactor, but make sure you are replacing the media monthly as it is consumed over time, between 28-30 days on average depending on the media type.
This will be a long battle, as algae always is. There are two articles in my signature that are in our articles section that will help you battle this as well. And remember, if your nitrates are 80(if you could detect them) a 50% water change would bring them to 40. So make sure they are large water changes over several days to bring it as you possibly can.

What would you suggest if we cant get the rocks back out? They are ziptied together. I told him to scrub it all off and use a net to take out the top layer of sand then do a huge water change. I know that is what i do for my tanks anyway. He is scared that by doing that, he is going to make it worse. Also, can we add both phospahte and nitrate remover into the reactor?
What are some ways we can keep the nitrates down aside from feeding a little less? I know there isnt any nitrates in our tap water because I test it every few months foe my freshwater tanks so it is something else causing it. I know my local fish store sells live rock, maybe we should add some to the sump?

 

[mr_X]

Adding rock isn't going to do much. As a matter of fact, it might make things worse if it's uncycled/uncured. No, you shouldn't be adding anything in the way of supplements. I was asking to rule that out. Many folks dump phytoplankton in the tank not thinking it's adding to the nutrient problem.
You could always get a clean, new brush and scrub the algae off inside the tank just before a water change.

 

[jehenry89]

Adding rock isn't going to do much. As a matter of fact, it might make things worse if it's uncycled/uncured. No, you shouldn't be adding anything in the way of supplements. I was asking to rule that out. Many folks dump phytoplankton in the tank not thinking it's adding to the nutrient problem.
You could always get a clean, new brush and scrub the algae off inside the tank just before a water change.

Ok thats what we will do next. Can we mix phosphate and nitrate remover in the phosphate reactor?

 

[Rockster2]

There is a lot of good advice in this thread. The only other thing that I would add is to make sure that you have sufficient water flow throughout the tank. Algae tends to grow the most in the dead spots where there is little water movement. you might try adjusting your powerheads or adding another powerhead to the tank (toward the bottom of the tank).


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[jehenry89]

There is a lot of good advice in this thread. The only other thing that I would add is to make sure that you have sufficient water flow throughout the tank. Algae tends to grow the most in the dead spots where there is little water movement. you might try adjusting your powerheads or adding another powerhead to the tank (toward the bottom of the tank).


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We have a spare but took it out because the high flow was bothering two of the corals

 

[Bectan01]

I would also advise getting that RO working, so you are using tap water at the moment? You could also buy ro-di water from your lfs for this battle until you work out your own system...


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[mr_X]

Ok thats what we will do next. Can we mix phosphate and nitrate remover in the phosphate reactor?

I never tried it. Which products are you using exactly?

 

[jehenry89]

I would also advise getting that RO working, so you are using tap water at the moment? You could also buy ro-di water from your lfs for this battle until you work out your own system...


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It is working

 

[jehenry89]

I never tried it. Which products are you using exactly?

Phosguard i know is the one. The other one i think is called like de*nitrate. I convinced him to put the nitrate remover in my old HOB filter and use that instead of puttng them both in there.

I will keep this thread posted once we do all this. Currently at the in laws for Christmas.

 

[Ingy]

I'm gonna chime in as I fought a battle with algae for over a year. Finally I'm winning.

First, algae LOVES water movement. Bacteria like Cyanobacteria hate water movement but hair algae loves it. More movement means fresh nutrients brought in.

Like you I also had 0 nitrates and phosphates, fed very little (which led to a few crab and shrimp deaths) and reduced lighting. Completely removing lighting will not get rid of algae (therefor neither will reduced lighting) but it WILL help slow the growth of new algae.
[I put half my rocks into a 25 gal curing bucket with a lid, heater and water movement, did periodic water changes to keep nutrient levels very low, and after 4-6 months with absolutely NO light the rocks were still covered in algae]

The ONLY thing I found that got rid of algae that was already there was manual removal. Now there was no way I was going to tear apart 150 lbs of rocks, so I hired some help. A ton of hermit crabs, who attacked the algae with vigor. About $200 of hermits for a 110 gal tank from a wholesaler (about 1/2 price from a LFS). Scarlet and dwarf blue leg crabs mainly plus a couple electric orange. I avoid dwarf red leg as I find they eat all my snails.

Also check your Alk and Calc levels, as low numbers there can lend to algae growth.


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[Fatboyfish]

Are you testing the filtered waters TDS? You have a tds meter correct?

Ifnot you need one. You need to monitor the tds after the membrane and after the DI filter. A rodi unit should be producing 0 tds water or something needs replacing.

For instance if you were to test the tds of the water and it showed a tds of 17. Unhook the DI filter and make some water minus the di filter. If the tds of that water is 1-5 tds then you have a bad di filter. If you get a reading higher than that then you have a bad membrane. An old membrane can ruin a DI filter pretty fast.

Quick guide - Results will vary.
sediment filter - 6~12 months
carbon filter - 6~12 months
RO Membrane - 2 ~ 3 years
(De-Ionized) filter - approx 400gals max

You can pickup a handheld tds meter on ebay for around $25. To test I typically use a new plastic cup let the filter water fall into the cup and test it there. Or you can get a inline tds meter for a bit more.

If I typed all that out for nothing. Next I would look at how effecient your protein skimmer is. I personally wouldn't run a skimmer brand unless bulkreefsupply sells it. I have a Reef Ocotopus.

 

[jehenry89]

Are you testing the filtered waters TDS? You have a tds meter correct?

Ifnot you need one. You need to monitor the tds after the membrane and after the DI filter. A rodi unit should be producing 0 tds water or something needs replacing.

For instance if you were to test the tds of the water and it showed a tds of 17. Unhook the DI filter and make some water minus the di filter. If the tds of that water is 1-5 tds then you have a bad di filter. If you get a reading higher than that then you have a bad membrane. An old membrane can ruin a DI filter pretty fast.

Quick guide - Results will vary.
sediment filter - 6~12 months
carbon filter - 6~12 months
RO Membrane - 2 ~ 3 years
(De-Ionized) filter - approx 400gals max

You can pickup a handheld tds meter on ebay for around $25. To test I typically use a new plastic cup let the filter water fall into the cup and test it there. Or you can get a inline tds meter for a bit more.

If I typed all that out for nothing. Next I would look at how effecient your protein skimmer is. I personally wouldn't run a skimmer brand unless bulkreefsupply sells it. I have a Reef Ocotopus.

Thats what he wants to get but doesnt want to spend all this money on one before we know that is the issue. He too also wants the octopus but it is too big. We were looking at the coralife superskimmer one. I think he wants to buy the one for 250 gallons lol. That is something that will have to wait until afer the holidays though. We are going to try manual removal and running the phosguard and be-nitrate then go from there.

But yes getting a new skimmer was my first reaction too since he hates the one we have now. :/ after christmas...
Thank you for the info about the RODI though. We just changed all the cartridges but I am not sure about the one that is only good for 400 gallons. I guess I wwillbuy him a tester and add it to his christmas gift lol.