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Old 04-18-2013, 11:37 PM   #11
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Explain:

http://youtu.be/8rjXWSZ-fnc

http://youtu.be/O1WKyPt-P3o

http://youtu.be/WpWEzAN13KU

FYI I'm not buying full grown Tangs, I'm buying 1-2". It's the same ratio as it would be with a full grown tang in 180g or whatever the "tank size requirement".
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Old 04-18-2013, 11:41 PM   #12
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Also you're not listening and answering my question in the beginning, this would have never happened if you just simply answered the question. I'm not looking to debate but just have a simple answer for my simple question.
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Old 04-19-2013, 12:03 AM   #13
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Any fish taken from the reef is sad. That tang might be better off with you than the noobie who buys it and never does wc and it dies along with everything else. At least you will try to keep it alive. One of those hit or miss like my lfs says usually they will work it out (but) lots of variables. Good luck at least your trying to make a educate decision with switching to the hippo.
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Old 04-19-2013, 12:21 AM   #14
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Originally Posted by ReefNoob0424 View Post
Also you're not listening and answering my question in the beginning, this would have never happened if you just simply answered the question. I'm not looking to debate but just have a simple answer for my simple question.
Ok, to get to your actual question, IF you are dealing with smaller fish, you can "GET AWAY" with putting multiple tangs in the tank provided that they are of different body shapes and colors, for a short period of time. BTW, Multiple elongated surgeon fish do better than multiple circular tangs.

The "debate" going on here is that either type of fish grows pretty large and, if cared for for maximum longevity ( which IS what we want for our fish isn't it? ) under the best conditions, either will out grow a standard 55. Ironically, many years ago, I happened to once get an almost fully grown Sailfin Tang for a 300 gal. display tank in a pet store I was working in. The fish was out of Hawaii and BEAUTIFUL!!!!!! Unfortunately, it took so long to get him that when my supplier finally sent the fish to me, the tank had already been re- landscaped for smaller fish instead of the original idea of a few "Show" fish so he could not go into the tank safely so we had to use our next largest tank for him, a standard 5' -100 gal tank. So that you get the full picture, we had to empty the tank of all it's gravel so that the fish could fit into this tank. When it opened it's fins, it's dorsal would stick out of the water like a shark. Needless to say, this fish was shortly relocated to a public aquarium for it's own good.
The point I'm trying to make ( and the others here are trying to explain to you) is that these fish that we keep, that grow so large, THINK like a big fish even when they are small fish. So while they might physically fit in a smaller tank because of their size, they may not do so well in a smaller tank because of their minds. ( It's the ol' "YOU can live in a broom closet but you won't be happy" debate here )
So I would say, if your intentions are to either get a larger tank down the road or rehome the fish as they begin to get too big, you now know what to do.

Hope this helps
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Old 04-19-2013, 08:08 AM   #15
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I understand where you're coming from, I know the fish will outgrow my tank. Already talked to my LFS and they have no problem taking the fish back. I'm planning to have a larger tank way down the road.

Thank you Daniel Fishy, it's not like I'm going to throw this fish in my tank and not care for the fish or for the tank as well. I am listening to you all of you but I made my decision already with housing these creatures. I dedicated this tank for my tangs with the rock work so that the fish can feel more comfortable. I put lots of caves and swimming room so he feels safe and he does.
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Old 04-19-2013, 08:16 AM   #16
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I understand where you're coming from, I know the fish will outgrow my tank. Already talked to my LFS and they have no problem taking the fish back. I'm planning to have a larger tank way down the road.

Thank you Daniel Fishy, it's not like I'm going to throw this fish in my tank and not care for the fish or for the tank as well. I am listening to you all of you but I made my decision already with housing these creatures. I dedicated this tank for my tangs with the rock work so that the fish can feel more comfortable. I put lots of caves and swimming room so he feels safe and he does.
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Old 04-19-2013, 12:34 PM   #17
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Thanks Andy for that post. I like the little fish think like big fish idea. That is kind of how I've always looked at it, just never thought of it in those exactly those terms.

My understanding is that when books and websites state "minimum Tank Requirements", they mean minimum for a small fish, not the fully grown version. Thus, the "minimum" wording. With Tangs, that have immunity and stress issues that a lot of other fish don't have (or at least not to the same degree), I tend to stick within those guidelines in hopes of keeping them healthy.

I also agree that buying really small Tangs would work for a short period of time. The OP never asked would they be okay for a while, which is what my answer was based on. I've never seen the point of buying fish that are going to get too big for the tank I am putting them in, so i guess i assume, unless stated otherwise, that people mean "will it work long term?". Trying to catch them and stress them out down the road just seems odd to me. I get attached to my fish and like to keep them for the long haul.
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Old 04-19-2013, 03:40 PM   #18
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Thanks Andy for that post. I like the little fish think like big fish idea. That is kind of how I've always looked at it, just never thought of it in those exactly those terms.

My understanding is that when books and websites state "minimum Tank Requirements", they mean minimum for a small fish, not the fully grown version. Thus, the "minimum" wording. With Tangs, that have immunity and stress issues that a lot of other fish don't have (or at least not to the same degree), I tend to stick within those guidelines in hopes of keeping them healthy.

I also agree that buying really small Tangs would work for a short period of time. The OP never asked would they be okay for a while, which is what my answer was based on. I've never seen the point of buying fish that are going to get too big for the tank I am putting them in, so i guess i assume, unless stated otherwise, that people mean "will it work long term?". Trying to catch them and stress them out down the road just seems odd to me. I get attached to my fish and like to keep them for the long haul.

Thanks Todd
The way I see it, if we look at the mature sizes of the average fish in our tanks then went with all the guidelines for these fish, we really shouldn't be putting almost any fish in any tank. Nano tanks would be considered cruel and unusual punishment. Keeping a single fish that is, by nature, a schooling fish, that too should be frowned upon and illegel. Probably 50% or more people keeping fish today would fit into these catagories. But... here's the thing, fish don't always read books or go to "school" to be happy and healthy. To say that a single schooling fish is unhappy when by himself doesn't really cut it ( in my book at least) when the natural act of schooling is designed for protection against predators. If there is no chance for predation in the tank, why wouldn't the single fish be happy? I say this because some schooling fish, as younger fish, become solitary or stay only with a single mate as adults. I know, this whole thing can be confusing. Point being that I have taken very small fish and have kept them for many years before rehoming them to larger tanks. My last saltwater tank (75 gal) contained only 3 fish when I had to dismantle it for a move. 1 was an 8 year old Maculosus/ Asfur natural hybrid, 1 was a 10 year old black saddleback clown and the last was a zebra serpent star that I had for 6 years. Considering that the Angel was over 8" when I had to give him up but was only about 1" when I got him, one would have to think that that 75 was not too small to keep him for that length of time or that he was unhappy during his stay. This can be debated to death but I have no doubts about the health of my fish.

As to my little fish/ big fish thought process, I used to see this all the time, especially in groupers. When we were importing 2"-3" Bumble bee groupers (Pomacrops lancelatus) for example, we would watch them looking at 4" fish and trying to eat them. That's a mental thing not a size thing don't you think? We'd see juvenile fish act like Big Bad Terrors against larger fish and we'd think " That fish has either guts or no sense!" lol It's all just studying fish behavior.

So, in reality, considering that most people don't keep these fish for as long as their natural lives are (25 years for some clownfish for example), I think it's rather "iffy" that someone who hasn't kept a fish for it's entire full lifespan, should telling someone else what they HAVE to or should do. Obviously, this is my opinion so there's no need to start that debate here

I am just giving my experiences over 30 years of marine fish keeping on these threads. I've seen a lot and done a lot so I have a lot I can and do like to share

Thanks again
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Old 04-19-2013, 06:47 PM   #19
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+1 Todd


Read the hundreds of posts from people who decided to ignore any advice on tangs, most of those fish are long dead. I have been following this post and decided not to join it once I heard the refusal to discuss tank size. Don't ask for advice and then complain it doesn't fit what you have already done or decided to do. A tiny tang can be kept in a smaller tank, but even then they can get stressed.

Yes, I guess I am a part of the tang police, but as a LFS owner in the past I am sick of sending what is becoming a rarer fish to its death over and over again.

And most of my fish are over 10 years old, even the tangs.
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Old 04-19-2013, 08:08 PM   #20
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These tang discussions are always an amazing study in both fish and human behavior....unfortunately ,the fish we put into our tanks have no say so as to their fate , it all lies in reef keepers ability to understand the fishes environmental needs and then do the ethical thing,..which more times than not is not the case.
The " tang police" as is often referred to is not to just rial up a reef keeper trying to keep one in a smaller tank but is to try and maintain the longevity of the hobby.., tangs and other creatures are and will be getting harder and harder to " harvested" from the wild as more and more closures and regulations appear, so we all as reef keepers need to do everything we can ethically to preserve this privilege .
Anyone who has ever seen the tangs in their natural state on the reefs would never even think of housing them into something that would hinder them in any way,..tangs and other creatures are beautiful and amazing to keep and cherish. I'm not in any way trying to preach one way or another because you are going to do what you do anyways,..it's more of a study of human behaviouf ,.. Kind of like the signs in the park stating that ALL dogs must be on leashes,..but then there's the people who seemingly think that their dogs are exempt ,. Humans ! Gotta love'em
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