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Old 02-21-2003, 06:31 PM   #11
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There are many companies with harvesting licenses that I would not buy a single crab from.
Not to step on your toes, but, where did you get your live rock from????

I mean it seems so contradictory in terms...****ed if you do ****ed if you don't...
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Old 02-21-2003, 07:36 PM   #12
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I would just like to go on the record and say that this post was not about tank raised vs. wild caught. It was about a certain individuals actions. Hara said that he was probably being sarcastic. After she said that, I realized he problably was. I have stated my opinions on tank raised vs. wild caught in other threads.
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Old 02-21-2003, 09:05 PM   #13
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My point is, you can't pick and choose...you are either one way or you aren't and if you preach save the reefs, Practice it fully. Stop buying some things that are not propagated and some that are...and saying you are saving reefs ... That is contradicting in terms.

I look at it this way:

Homemade LR
Propagated Corals
TR Anenomes if any,
TR Clowns or any of the very few that can be TR

Then you can say " I " am saving the reefs by choosing not to buy commercially available wild caught specimens...

Otherwise it is all a bunch of words meant to strike up Tank Raised vs Wild Caught every time...

This is only my opinion and not the opinion of a whole.... Sorry for any bad feelings this might have sprung up... :|
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Old 02-21-2003, 09:19 PM   #14
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Well...I think that sums it up very well. Also, it is true, you can't start on a topic like this without eventually getting into the TR vs WC discussion...it's inevitable.
Logan J
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Old 02-21-2003, 09:21 PM   #15
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One item to note.

When you purchase your live rock unless its illegally collected its more than likly comming from a leased plot of ocean bottom that was totally void of life. The company that is leasing this plot goes out and buys TONS of rock and has it barged out to that plot and dumped into the ocean.

Years later they come back and what has developed is a natural artifical reef. This rock is what is being sold. Its not comming from the wild natural reefs but comming from leased plots of ocean bottom that has had rock placed there for the exclusive purpose of selling to hobbists.
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Old 02-21-2003, 09:26 PM   #16
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I will never look down on someone for posting their honest opinion. I appreciate you guys being civil. I do have to say that I am done posting on this thread. I think what the guy on reefcentral is doing is wrong, not just because of the way he does it, but because he has burned several people. He just straight up ripped some people off and does not really care. Therefore this gives legit coral propagating online retailers a bad name. People will say " I purchased from this guy and he did me wrong, I wont be buying anything off the internet anymore." That is my opinion plain and simple. I doubt there is anything that can be done to change it. Not that I am stubborn, because you guys have probably all seen me change my opinion when a very good case was presented to me. If you guys feel what he is doing is right, thats your opinion, if you purchase from him, let me know how it turns out. And with that, I am done with this subject. Kudos to you guys for your opinions.
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Old 02-21-2003, 11:23 PM   #17
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Originally Posted by timbo2
My point is, you can't pick and choose...you are either one way or you aren't and if you preach save the reefs, Practice it fully. Stop buying some things that are not propagated and some that are...and saying you are saving reefs ... That is contradicting in terms.
Otherwise it is all a bunch of words meant to strike up Tank Raised vs Wild Caught every time...
This is only my opinion and not the opinion of a whole.... Sorry for any bad feelings this might have sprung up... :|
I think you may be a little confused. You quoted me and yet in my first post I pretty much said I will get what I want from where I can get it, if CB is available, I will choose that source, if not, oh well. There is very little in my reef tank that is CB...(and TR is only one step away from WC)

My seahorse tank is all CB, why? because the survival rate is much higher, and I dont like throwing away my money. Also, there is the situation of endangered species vs a species that is quite numerous. Many factors are involved. It is not as cut and dried as you make it out to be.
In a perfect world................
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Old 02-22-2003, 01:28 PM   #18
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Just a quick point on the above quote. And it should be noted that I'm not exactly sure if I'm agreeing with Hara or not, but ...

I think you absolutely can go both ways and think there are many of us in the hobby that do go both ways. We strive to limit the impact on the environment as much as we can and still enjoy the hobby.

I for one will always seek out CB when possible. In addition to better survival rates, which help me, the fish and the evironment (since I don't need to replace as often), I also feel better knowing I have not impacted a wild habitat. However, I will not say that nothing in my tank will ever be WC. I may choose to get a fish that is not available CB and will have to WC, because I want to. However, by supporting LFS and suppliers that follow appropriate guidelines and laws and harvest in a responsible manner we are least lessening the negative impact. This is my opinion and the way I choose to practice the hobby.

WE IMPACT THE PLANET. There is no way around it. If we lessen it and be responsible, it's helpful.
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