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Old 02-20-2003, 07:58 PM   #1
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This is disturbing.

please read this thread and post your thoughts, if you are a member of Reefcentral please reply to the post. This is a guy who is only in it for the money. It is discusting.

http://reefcentral.com/forums/showth...18#post1050018
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Old 02-20-2003, 08:22 PM   #2
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I looked at it, I feel it was posted in the wrong forum, but I also feel the guy was pretty well descriptive of the fact that they were harvested...through the entire thread. As for being in it for the money....he probabaly is. But there is not necessarily anything wrong with that. The question is, will he put his needs over yours for the money, I thought he showed that it was important for his cusomers to be happy with their purchase. Like I said, from what I see he posted in the wrong forum.
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Old 02-20-2003, 08:28 PM   #3
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If it is that easy to just go harvest them, why dont you go try? Maybe you could hook some of us up.
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Old 02-20-2003, 08:42 PM   #4
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I am in N Florida, he is in S Florida, the zoos are in his backyard, it would be several hours drive for me to get there. I am also at a point in my hobby where I prefer to have actual captive raised frags whenever possible. I do not yet feel it should be illegal for recreational harvesting...but I'm not interested in it. I want to go swim the reef but I want to leave it as I found it
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Old 02-20-2003, 09:25 PM   #5
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Well,I would not consider this guys actions recreational harvesting. He is just rippin in there to make a buck and thats it. Just ask him, he will tell you. This is all the more reason we should support places like www.logicalreef.com.
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Old 02-20-2003, 10:06 PM   #6
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As long as people buy, there are those that will harvest. I like to ride the moral pony too, but the fact is, if there was a fish I wanted, I would buy it, if there were a coral, I would buy it, even if it were wild harvested. I do search for captive bred and when I find such specimens, I don't mind paying extra. As soon as everything we desire is captive bred, it will be a different story. I am afraid that those days are a long way off.

Can you honestly say that everything in your tank is captive bred? I sure can't. I try to not be hypocritical about it, so I do not reply to posts such as his. Until I have nothing wild caught in my tanks, I feel I am a hypocrit by saying something.
Dont get me wrong, not calling you hypocritical, just professing my moral views on things.
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Old 02-20-2003, 11:21 PM   #7
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All my fish are captive bred, not sure about my corals. I would like to ask you a question thought. To me this is not about having wild caught things. If someone obtains a harvesting licence, it is my understanding they can only take so much in a period of time. However, do you feel it is right for this guy to just pillage the area he goes to just so he can make a buck? I mean he said that he just walks out there and steps on zoos. I have heard from several people now that I have gotten into this issue that he does burn a lot of people. He is not about good customer service. This guy is accually giving the people who do captive breed things a bad name. I think it is dispicable and I hope people find out about him and no longer purchase from him.
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Old 02-20-2003, 11:53 PM   #8
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If the guy is able to do this, then it is the laws that must be changed and the ability to enforce them. There are many companies with harvesting licenses that I would not buy a single crab from. Also, those with import licenses. A license does not mean that harvesting will be done in a concientous manner, only that they will be less likely to be observed. I read his comments to be ones of sarcasm in response to what he most likely felt was persecution. I do not see how he is giving people that are conscientiously breeding a bad name. Also, if he continues to ream people financially, it will be its own reward or punishment.

Please understand that I am an animal advocate in every sense of the word. I have been involved in more rescue projects than you can imagine. The one thing I have learned is that getting verbally involved in places like forums, will never do any good. Education, not persection, is the answer. You did well by giving an alternative purchase source.

Will I ever buy from him? no. Will others? yes.
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Old 02-20-2003, 11:59 PM   #9
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I appreciate the way you have conveyed your opinion and you make very good points, thanks Hara. I guess the bottom line is, I agree with you, I will not buy from him. I guess that is the worst thing I can do to him.
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Old 02-21-2003, 12:40 AM   #10
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I have to say that this guy doesn't seem to care much about whether he causes a problem by collecting the zoos. I think captive raised is the way to go if possible. Even though captive costs more, it has, IMO, a better chance of survival. The only way we can really enforce this is not to buy wild caught when captive is available. If you can't get it captive raised, then there isn't a lot of choice. Of course, you can always propagate your wild caught specimen and sell/trade the offspring to others. Then you are making a real contribution to taking the pressure off the reefs. JMHO .
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