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Old 05-24-2013, 11:01 AM   #11
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I'm using ro water saving up to order a rodi unit and I also forgot to add that my 55 started leaking that's why I switched to a 30 and since its going on repair and planning to start the 55 new and build a sump and ditch the hob filters but that's getting off topic I was just asking how to get that ammonia and nitrates down

Will doing 50% pwc everyday harm the fish or send them in shock?
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Old 05-24-2013, 11:21 AM   #12
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A water change of 50% would stress all your tank inhabitants. You can do 20% every other day if you need to. The ammonia level could be due to a spike when moving to a new tank. Water change will make your water parameter better. Do not add more fish until you have your DT back up and running and cycled. Another thing is that you can not use an ich medication in a tank with corals and invertebrate.
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Old 05-24-2013, 11:44 AM   #13
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Water changes will get it down, but you need to find the source
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Old 05-24-2013, 12:31 PM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Holygral View Post
Water changes will get it down, but you need to find the source
Exactly. If you can not find what is causing the problem, then it will continue. Odds are the filter is part of the problem (unless its being cleaned very frequently). Having those larger fish was definitely a problem. Big fish in tanks that are way too small almost guarantees stress (even if they are really small now) and stress opens fish up to all the nasties out there.

The larger tank with a sump will do much better for you. Moving forward, do not hesitate to ask questions if you are not 100% sure about things.
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Old 05-24-2013, 01:44 PM   #15
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I'm going to be a bit of a decending voice here. Very frequent PWC I agree will stress the fish, but high nitrates will as well. I am not a huge proponent for PWC to solve nitrate issues because there is no way to remove all your nitrates by doing a "partial" water change.
The fact is your fish are adding nitrates to the water and PWC won't remove all of it, unless you do a weekly 100% water change (no, not 2 x 50%). So, you have to find a way to remove those nitrates. Doing large water changes now will lower the nitrates, but they will just start to go back up. I had the same problem in my 30 gal system before I got a HOB refugium where I could put chaeto. But, there is help.

First is vodka dosing. It helps the skimmer efficiency and removes poop BEFORE it becomes nitrate. BONUS! (some have used vinegar as well)
Next is nitrate destroyer. It is a bacterial additive that consumes nitrate and then dies. The dead bacteria are consumed by corals and/or removed by the skimmer. I know there are other names for this type of bacteria, but they worked for me.
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Old 05-24-2013, 02:24 PM   #16
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Totally disagree, he has enough issues without vodka dosing and or add more chemical quick fix solutions, many people have crashed their tanks vodka dosing, stick with basic and you cant go wrong
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Old 05-24-2013, 02:59 PM   #17
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Just wondering if new substrate was added when first bought with fully cycled tank. That would be where your ammonia is coming from. Your bioloads might also be overwhelming your bacteria or filtration. Remember that corals excrete waste also.
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Old 05-24-2013, 03:21 PM   #18
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tell me how to remove all the nitrates thru small water changes.

If his fish add 10ppm of nitrigenous waste to the tank every week (which ends up being 10ppm nitrate added weekly), how can a 20% weekly water change help. his nitrates will climb until the 20% removed = weekly added (10ppm) which would stabalize around 40ppm. Water changes will NEVER get your nitrates down to 0 which is where we all want them to be.
I agree there are better ways, but they have to include nitrate removal that is not based of a fractional efficiency (PWC). Macro Algaes are the easiest method as they will remove 100% of the nitrate. But they're not always possible. Resins are another possibility that will remove nitrates right down to 0. But they're not always possible.
The problem is we add nitrogen to the tank (in the form of food) and we need to remove it. Most of us want to remove ALL of it, and removing SOME, thru PWC will not cut it. It also does not address the issue of nitrogen in > nitrogen out.
There are other members here who still use methanol dosing (vodka or vinegar) which simply binds the protien strings into longer strings, maximizing the skimmer efficiency and lowering the amount of nitrate being produced.
Nitrate Destroyer is NOT a chemical additive, its the same anaerobic bacteria type that naturally live in our tanks in small quantity. You just add more and then let them die and get skimmed or be consumed.

BASICS - no amount of magic math will get nitrates to 0 thru PWCs as long as you feed your fish food.
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Old 05-24-2013, 03:33 PM   #19
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PWC won't cure the problem, but it will buy time. The high organics (ammonia being the one I worry about the most at this point) have to be exported some way. Growing chaeto, even if it isn't in the sump but in a ball in the aquarium is a very good way to export nitrogen byproducts but I would consider running a ammonia/phosphate reducer in your filter for a while.

As others have already beat you up on the topic, I won't go into fish selection details for a 30 or even a 55. I made this mistake early on as I didn't think I needed to play by the rules. It cost me and some nice fish. This problem cannot be cured unless livestock rules are obeyed. French angels and most tangs are very critical of their living space and will sicken and die without it being right, no matter your water quality. It's like keeping a lion in a small room in your house. Nobody is happy.
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Old 05-24-2013, 05:10 PM   #20
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Thanks everybody for your input
Like I said the source of all of this was poor maintenance I wouldn't do water changes for like 4 months and didn't clean out my filters either all I did was just add ro water cuz I lost my job andcouldnt buy salt mix for the pwc I know what was the source of my dissaster from the beggining now I picked my self up and trying to get my tank back stable again

Also I didn't add anything new like sand or anything I just switched everything I had in my 55 to my 30 wat I'm trying to do is get my levels as low is possible without harming any of my fish
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