Aggressiveness... what am I doing wrong? Should I quit?

[WiNGSPANTT]

Hi everyone

I am pretty discouraged about my 30 gallon tank.

I used to have just 1 blue 3 spot gourami, about 4.5", and one african spotted leaf fish, which I know is not really called that, but anyway it was about 2". I also had one mystery snail, pretty big. These 3 got together very well, but basically any other gourami I added got beaten up/killed by the one in there, and any other leaf fish was also harassed by the current leaf fish.

So for a couple months it was jsut that trio, pretty small for a 30 gallon. People always asked me why so sparse a tank. I would say that anything else got killed, so it wasn't worth it. The tank has lots of hiding spots: plants, pots, driftwood, small gravel caves, large rocks propped near the walls. But the gourami jsut chased all other gourami around incessently until they died.

So 2 weeks ago I bought 2 more blue gourami, only I got 2 that were maybe 5" long, I figured they could stand up for themselves. The first day I put them in after a water change and moved everything around so the gourami who was already there would be less territorial. Well, it did not work, and he chased the 2 new ones around for hours.

The next day, however, the bigger of the 2 new ones stood up for himself and would not be chased. So the old guy just picked on the smaller newbie. Eventually though, this one would not be chased either.

Then about 1 week ago, the 2 new ones just chased the old, slightly smaller gourami all the time. They followed and chased him from every cave, to the point where he could only hide by jumping into some floating plants and staying there for hours. Then 3 days ago he was dead.

Just yesterday, I found the lead fish dead and raggedly torn, even though no fish, especially the old gourami, ever paid attention to it. It seems with the small gourami dead the two new ones needed someone to bully?

What am I doing wrong? I didn't add anything for months because new fish got killed... finally I found some that wouldn't get pushed around but they instead killed my old bullies, which is very disheartening. I just can't figure out HOW DO YOU KEEP THIS 30 GALLON and not have things killing each other? I just thought I could keep some (3-4) gourami and one leaf fish, but I guess I am wrong. Do I need to add more fish to even the aggro? Won't this overcrowd the tank? I don't think I can add more hiding spots, the whole bottom of the tank is hiding spots, in addition to the floating plants.

It even seems like the only hiding spot any fish likes is under the driftwood, even though I have made small dark spots of the same size with pots, plants, rocks, all over the tank.

The water itself has been consistently good with nothing other than Nitrates over 0, and keeping them below 20, just enough for the plants, and changing 20-40% water once a week.

This is really discouraging, I just feel like an idiot. Is this normal? How often do your fish die/kill each other? How can I add more fish to this tank and not have the current 5" bullies kill everything? It's like eveything I did in the past 4 months has been a waste.

 

[MyCatsDrool]

Hokay....


Gouramis are notoriously terratorial. And leaf fish are brackish...but we won't get into that discussion now.


Anyway, if you want to introduce multiples of aggressive or semi aggressive fish to a tank, you have to do it all at the same time.

Have you tried any schooling fish like tetras with the gouramis? Considered trading in the gouramis altogether and getting something else?

Pearl gouramis are more peaceful than most. and stay well sized for a 30 gallon. Blues might feel a bit cramped.


Think of gouramis like you would male b ettas. Most the gouriamis you get in a fish store are going to be males. and they are in the same family as bettas, with similar temperments.

 

[JustOneMore20]

I don't know enough about the Leaf Fish to advise you on that, but generally its best to keep gouramis singly....especially Opalines (blue, gold, 3-spot). They are pretty aggressive for gouramis.

I'm sorry you are getting discouraged, but don't give up!

Have you thought about adding a school of fish to the tank? Usually gouramis don't pay attention to smaller fish (i didn't say always though). A school of fish can be intimidating, so larger fish (that can't eat them) leave them alone. I'd try adding some larger bodied tetras to the tank, like Bloodfins, Lemons, Red Eyes, Phantoms, or Black Skirts. These are peacefully tetras that are large enough not to be at risk of being eaten by a large gourami.

edit: MCD beat me to it.

I'd definitely take one of the gouramis back to the LFS.

 

[justrelax]

I agree with everything said so far, just wanted to cheer you on... Don't give up!! We all have goofed on stocking at some point or another The hard part is that there's no hard and fast rule to fish behavior. Sometimes even the most docile fish can turn into a blood craving psychopath! Just do as much research as you can, don't be afraid to ask for advice, and don't give up when things don't go 100% as planned. Good Luck!

 

[WiNGSPANTT]

Thanks I guess I will have to ditch the gouramis? I don't know what to stock I just wanted some fish that were medium sized but I guess it might be better to run tetras or something. I was just sick of platys... I had too much success with those and just had hundreds of platy fry constantly...

I just thought the gourami would live in peace. I went to 2 diff stores and they told me they'd be all right, and of course I watched the little tank with dozen+ gourami in it, with no fighting, but I guess they are just stuffed in there.

They have some cute "pink honey" gourami that are about 2" but don't know how big they get.

I should just give up on gourami.. they just had such an interesting body style.

I guess I should keep one gourami (the less aggressive) and run some schooling fish. I just wish there was some medium sized fish that was kind of smart, like a betta (i.e. not an eating factory that shows no sign of curiosity!)

thanks for the advice please let me know if you think of anything other than tetras to put in.

 

[plecoperson]

Git some lil' sparkling gouramis; they are pretty, stay small, and their "fights" consist of flaring at each other. Blue eyes, too.

 

[Mosaic]

I think the leaf fish is actually a Ctenopoma. Unfortunately, you just picked some rather obnoxious species. Speaks to the importance of research.

If you'd like a smart little fish, try some dwarf cichlids (kribs, apistos, rams). They've got TONS of personality and mostly stay to themselves. Grab yourself a male/female pair and you're all set!

 

[friend4fugu]

african leaf fish are actually soft water fish prefering a ph of 6.0 to 6.5. and although aggressive, there not as aggressive as south american leaf fish.

 

[zenkatydid]

Have a look at rainbows for peaceful mid-sized fish. They are gorgeous, there are many different variaties, and they are great community fish.

 

[RoK]

Pearl gouramis are peaceful, medium-sized gouramis. You could try them out and I highly doubt they would kill anything.
Honey gouramis stay fairly small but are very peaceful as well.
Rainbowfish, tetras (non-nippy types), and many other schooling fish do well with gouramis.

In my tanks that have multiple blue/opaline/gold gouramis, I have at least 4 to help spread out aggression. 1 male and many females or all females are the best way to keep them.

 

[WiNGSPANTT]

Thanks for the replies.

I have stocked the 30 gallon with 7 black skirt tetras and 3 spotted cories. So far so good!!!!

 

[donk1667]

i had some problems .it's easy get more tanks!!!