At a loss to explain ammonia spike

[GallonsOfFun]

Here's the background: the tank is a 55g and the filter is a Fluval 306. I cycled the tank using fish-in cycling (tiger barbs — and I know, I won't do it again) with a bacterial product. This fully cycled the tank. I'm very familiar with cycling, I watched the water parameters like a hawk, and it was a typical cycle only accelerated by the bacterial product. The tank fully cycled within 2 weeks and I left the tiger barbs in another week just to be sure.

After this, I removed the tiger barbs and added two juvenile Green Spotted Puffers. As I did this, I added Tetra Safe Start just to make sure they did not overwhelm my bacterial colony. Aside from some false readings due to safe start, my tank has never registered any ammonia or nitrites since the puffers have been in it (3 weeks now). I tested the water 3-4 days ago and everything was good. I have been slowly raising the tank to brackish, it currently stands at 1.005 and has for two weeks.

Here's the now: I tested the water today and it registered at .5 ammonia and 0 nitrites and I cannot explain why. I threw some prime in there and will do a pwc when I get home, so the fish will be fine — but I want to figure out why this happened so it doesn't happen again. I change the water 25%-50% weekly without exception. One caveat, brownish clumps accumulate on the sand (their waste, I assume) but this week much more have accumulated than normal. I do not know why as I haven't fed them any more than usual.

I know some of you will be gearing up to type "your tank wasn't fully cycled" but I can assure you with near absolute certainty that it was. If it wasn't, it wouldn't have taken 3 weeks to register an ammonia reading with messy eating puffers in there.

I have two theories, but neither seem likely to me: 1.) I had an infestation of detrius worms (likely due to the fact I over-fed them the first week) and sucked a bunch up in my last water change. I know they help decompose waste, maybe the bacterial colony in my filter got used to this and shrank, and then I took the worms away and it couldn't handle the bio-load?

2.) I haven't cleaned my filter yet (had it 2 months), I know you're supposed to clean it monthly, I was just avoiding it because I didn't want to interfere with the Safe Start and then I got very busy. But I doubt this would cause such a sudden spike.

Sorry it's lengthy, wanted to avoid the back and fourth of details! Please offer your advice, I will much appreciate it!


Sent from my iPhone using Aquarium Advice

 

[Chest Rockwell]

How often do you feed the puffers

 

[GallonsOfFun]

I skip two days a week. It's difficult as they're so small and a tiny amount is often too much - but at the same time I don't want to fast too often because they're still juveniles.


Sent from my iPhone using Aquarium Advice

 

[GallonsOfFun]

Anyone? Also, I did a 25% pwc and the ammonia reading is now .25 - but obviously I added prime so this is detoxified ammonia (I have API test kit which will read detox ammonia and ammonia as the same), do I need to do another pwc to get this out or not? If not, how will I know when regular ammonia is present?


Sent from my iPhone using Aquarium Advice

 

[Delapool]

Checked your tap water for ammonia maybe?

Also I assume you ph is still above say 6.5?

Last thought (stretching here!) if anything has changed in tank to cause more bacterial activity (eg dead fish, stirred up gravel)?

 

[GallonsOfFun]

Checked your tap water for ammonia maybe?

Also I assume you ph is still above say 6.5?

Last thought (stretching here!) if anything has changed in tank to cause more bacterial activity (eg dead fish, stirred up gravel)?

I've checked my tap water multiple times before so unless it changed in the last few days (which would be worrying!), I don't think it's that.

Yep, my pH is 8 in the tank (6.8 out of the tap - I raise it with rock).

Hmm the only bacterial activity was those detritus worms and there's been a dramatic reduction since I sucked some up and got the feeding situation under control - but I'd assume they just went back into the substrate?


Sent from my iPhone using Aquarium Advice

 

[GallonsOfFun]

So my plan from here on out is to feed less as they're so small it's impossible to feed them the right amount (it's always too much). So I'll try feeding every other day and I'll do another water change tomorrow. If the bacterial colony still can't handle it, I suppose I'll have to add some more SafeStart. Posting this so anyone can let me know if they have a better idea or if this is a bad idea.

Still no clue what caused it so suggestions welcome.


Sent from my iPhone using Aquarium Advice

 

[Delapool]

The only other thing I can think of is the nitrifying bacteria didn't like the salinity increase and are adjusting. Could that be possible. I've only really done FW so just throwing out ideas.

 

[brennae]

This may be way off but did you have snails? If a bunch of snails died off that could cause a spike. Maybe had snails you didn't know about?

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-N900A using Aquarium Advice mobile app

 

[gilpi]

Here's the background: the tank is a 55g and the filter is a Fluval 306. I cycled the tank using fish-in cycling (tiger barbs — and I know, I won't do it again) with a bacterial product. This fully cycled the tank. I'm very familiar with cycling, I watched the water parameters like a hawk, and it was a typical cycle only accelerated by the bacterial product. The tank fully cycled within 2 weeks and I left the tiger barbs in another week just to be sure.

After this, I removed the tiger barbs and added two juvenile Green Spotted Puffers. As I did this, I added Tetra Safe Start just to make sure they did not overwhelm my bacterial colony. Aside from some false readings due to safe start, my tank has never registered any ammonia or nitrites since the puffers have been in it (3 weeks now). I tested the water 3-4 days ago and everything was good. I have been slowly raising the tank to brackish, it currently stands at 1.005 and has for two weeks.

Here's the now: I tested the water today and it registered at .5 ammonia and 0 nitrites and I cannot explain why. I threw some prime in there and will do a pwc when I get home, so the fish will be fine — but I want to figure out why this happened so it doesn't happen again. I change the water 25%-50% weekly without exception. One caveat, brownish clumps accumulate on the sand (their waste, I assume) but this week much more have accumulated than normal. I do not know why as I haven't fed them any more than usual.

I know some of you will be gearing up to type "your tank wasn't fully cycled" but I can assure you with near absolute certainty that it was. If it wasn't, it wouldn't have taken 3 weeks to register an ammonia reading with messy eating puffers in there.

I have two theories, but neither seem likely to me: 1.) I had an infestation of detrius worms (likely due to the fact I over-fed them the first week) and sucked a bunch up in my last water change. I know they help decompose waste, maybe the bacterial colony in my filter got used to this and shrank, and then I took the worms away and it couldn't handle the bio-load?

2.) I haven't cleaned my filter yet (had it 2 months), I know you're supposed to clean it monthly, I was just avoiding it because I didn't want to interfere with the Safe Start and then I got very busy. But I doubt this would cause such a sudden spike.

Sorry it's lengthy, wanted to avoid the back and fourth of details! Please offer your advice, I will much appreciate it!


Sent from my iPhone using Aquarium Advice

As you just found out, a tank will not cycle in two weeks, unless, you've taken filter media from an established tank and add it to yours. Adding Safe Start or any other so called bacteria in a bottle is not the way to go, as you also found out.

A couple of fish in a 55 gallon to start a cycle is fine as long as you keep the feeding to a minimum and do some water changes, you also need something very important... Patience.
Let the cycle take its place on its own, its all very simple.

Filter... You're not "supposed" to clean it every month unless you're way overstocked or if you over feed.

That's my advice, good luck with your tank.



Sent from my iPad using Aquarium Advice

 

[TMRC Exotics]

Some good advice from gilpi. IMO the tank could've been cycled to the original level of bio load but couldn't keep up in the long run once your regular stock was in. This is a mini cycle as the tank adjusts to its new bio load level. I do extra water changes during this time to allow the Bb colony to catch up while keeping the fish safe. Its just my opinion but I figured I'd offer it.

 

[Andy Sager]

As per the following article ( Nitrifying Bacteria Facts ), the nitrifying bacteria in freshwater is different from the saltwater bacteria. It sounds like since you are converting your tank to a brackish water tank, you are going through the bacteria transition as well. So basically, what you did prior to your transition doesn't count.

I would suggest you continue as if you were doing a "fish in " cycle and do your water changes with clean brackish water ( not plain freshwater) and continue with the PRIME until it gets established. Remember, you do not have to add PRIME daily. It can be done every 48 hours. If you can get some established material from an established brackish water tank, that will help you finish cycling your tank faster than the other products.


One note: The article I listed is from a company that makes a biological product (which I have used in the distant past quite successfully) and has some sales pitch to it. I offer it for the science in it not as a product endorsement.

 

[GallonsOfFun]

Cheers guys, I forgot to mention that as it was cycling with the tiger barbs, I did add a large amount of established filter media.

Only just read this, but I have been following the advice you guys provided since my post, so I'm glad we're on the same page!

If it was an issue with the bacterial colony not being able to cope with the puffers, why would that have taken 3 weeks to manifest?


Sent from my iPhone using Aquarium Advice

 

[Andy Sager]

Cheers guys, I forgot to mention that as it was cycling with the tiger barbs, I did add a large amount of established filter media.

Only just read this, but I have been following the advice you guys provided since my post, so I'm glad we're on the same page!

If it was an issue with the bacterial colony not being able to cope with the puffers, why would that have taken 3 weeks to manifest?


Sent from my iPhone using Aquarium Advice

How long has your transition to brackish water been going on?

 

[GallonsOfFun]

Started it about a week after they were put in the tank, currently sits at 1.004-1.005. So two-ish weeks.


Sent from my iPhone using Aquarium Advice

 

[larochem595]

I have 3 thoughts:
1. I had attempted to purchase bottled nitrifying bacteria to help cycle my tank. For some reason, they did not want to colonize my tank. The ammonia levels would go down when I initially added it but after 5 or 6 days, the ammonia levels would creep back up. I had terrible luck with these products but tried anyways.

2. Perhaps the bacteria that cycled your tank were not fond of the brackish conditions. There's quite a few types of nitrifying bacteria out there and not all of them may be happy in brackish conditions.

3. You may have stocked the tank too quickly and the bacteria didn't have a chance to catch up.

Also, I think it wouldn't be a good idea to rinse your filter when trying to establish your biofilter.

Those are my thoughts...
Michelle

 

[Andy Sager]

Started it about a week after they were put in the tank, currently sits at 1.004-1.005. So two-ish weeks.


Sent from my iPhone using Aquarium Advice

Which goes along with my thinking. It takes a bit to have enough salt present to kill off the freshwater nitrifying bacteria and in my experiences, it takes about a week for ammonia to start showing up on the liquid test kits. So now you are going to be recycling the tank. It's as if what you did before didn't happen. So if you can get some cycled filter material from an established brackish water tank to add to your tank, the cycle time will be shortened just as before with the tiger barbs.

 

[GallonsOfFun]

Well I really hope it isn't that because my lfs only stocks freshwater and brackish tanks, and puffers are extremely sensitive to ammonia & nitrite — so I'm screwed if that's the case.


Sent from my iPhone using Aquarium Advice

 

[Andy Sager]

Well I really hope it isn't that because my lfs only stocks freshwater and brackish tanks, and puffers are extremely sensitive to ammonia & nitrite — so I'm screwed if that's the case.


Sent from my iPhone using Aquarium Advice

How are you screwed? Just get some material from your LFS's brackish tank(s) and use PRIME until you do.

 

[GallonsOfFun]

Sorry, meant to say they only stock freshwater and saltwater tanks! They don't have any brackish tanks.


Sent from my iPhone using Aquarium Advice