Does any store really know?

[Rob0504]

I purchased a 40 gallon Eclipse and a Fluval 404 (older version, 1/2 price)on June 1st, from a local fish store. The owner, who has been in business for over 10 years told me I could put in as many fish as I liked after the the initial set-up.

Another fish store owner, who I bought the stand from, said I could put in fish as well. He did mention the "new tank cycle" and to buy hearty fish. He also said "do not" change the water for 4-6 weeks until the tank completed the cycle. He said the ammonia levels will go sky high...off the charts. He said dodo notorry about testing. Some fish will die, it's part of the cycle.

Petsmart, where I purchased some miscellaneous accessories from, said to wait 5 days before putting in fish. They did not mention the cycle.

As a result, I waited 2 days after putting water in the tank and bought fish, lots of fish: 2 4" gold severums, 2 baby green severums, one angel fish, 3 tetra skirts, and 5 neons.

Well, a week ago I was in a Pet Co store and pick-up the famous yellow fish book for dudummies I read about the new tank cycle/syndrome and it was different then what the so called store experts were telling me. As a result, I have purchased a test kit, Aquarium Pharmaceuticals (no strips), and have been monitoring the water levels. Confused and not wanting to loose all the fish, especially the severums (they are cool and smart fish), I started researching the subject more and learned that a fishless cycle would have been better, I bought to many fish, and I need to do daily water changes (top level gravel cleaning only). I have been doing just that except I think I am running higher then recommended ammonia levels...per this site. The last ten days the tank has been running ammonia levels between .8 and 3.5, 1.5 right now after a 1/3 water change. Nitrite has been running between .15 and .25. Nitrate is going up slightly, starting at 2.5 and now at 7.5.

With what information I have supplied, what is the expected time to go through the cycle? 8 weeks plus due to the partial water changes? Isn't the water changes taking out nitrate as well and stopping the appropriate nitrate build up or does most of the nitrate reside in the filter?

Last piece of data, the fish are fed twice a day for 5 minutes each feeding.

Great site! Great info!

Thanks!

[tropicfishman]

Well I can tell ya this, I never lost a single fish during my cycle, and I had all new equipment and tank, so nothing was established, since them I have only lost 2 fish and thats been 9 months so far, I also did water changes almost every day and it never hurt anything, I didn't tst for levels since I didn't have any kits or anything, everything turned out fine for me, welcome to the site BTW lol

[Hara]

The water changes will slow down the cycling process, but if you want to save your fish, you have no alternative. You need to cut down on feedings. Once every day, or even every other day until the cycle is complete. You want the water changes to be removing nitrate, unless you have a naturally planted tank. High nitrate levels are toxic to fish, high nitrite and ammonia can become deadly to fish in a short amount of time.

[MarkP]

You mention "The water changes are removing the nitrate", which makes me beleive that you may have misunderstood the cycle a bit.

You don't actually WANT Nitrates in your tank. Nitrates are relatively harmless, but you still want to keep those levels low.

What you WANT is the Bacteria, which may be referred to as Nitrobacter or, more proper as Nitro-Spira and another name that escapes me at the moment. Or you could just call them the "Good Bacteria". The bacteria live mostly in your filter and gravel. The bacteria take the very toxic ammonia, convert it to the moderately toxic Nitrite, and then to the less toxic Nitrate. The Nitrate is then removed from your tank during your water changes.

It gets more complicated then that- If you used a dechlorinator, you might have extra ammonia. If you don't use a dechlorinator, I just found out that your test kit might read high on ammonia, depended on the test kit and exactly what kind of Chlorine your water supply uses- If they use Cholarmine like mine, that can be a factor. As mentioned, you might want some level of Nitrates if you have live plants... and so forth.

Now, to answer your question- My 45 gallon tank took about a month to really, fully cycle. You already have Nitrates appearing, so you should be closing in on the end.

[hulkamaniac]

It takes about a month to cycle a tank. It's a real pain in the butt too IMO. I was dumb, stupid and ignorant when I started my first tank and killed a bunch of fish in the process.

The good thing about it is once you get the first tank cycled you never have to do it again unless some horrible disaster strikes. Future tanks are easily cycled by simply using media from the old tank. I use Penguin bio-wheel filters and I make sure they all use the same size filter cartridge. If I need to cycle a new tank, I just grab the new filter, throw in a used filter pad from a cycled tank, add a light bio-load and I'm done.

[newfound77951]

You already have Nitrates appearing, so you should be closing in on the end

Not necessarily, since this is a "with fish" cycle....the nitrates could be coming from the fish or fish food. I'd keep up with the water changes and watch the ammonia and nitrite levels more closely...until those start going down on their own (ie in between water changes) I would say the cycle is still in progress. With large partial water changes, nitrate won't build up to anything near a dangerous level (>60 ppm or so). Having fish in there shouldn't speed up the cycle, and the water changes will slow it down some.

[supermazz9]

Don't the severums get kinda, you know, big? Can a tank this size hold them for long?

For that matter, what the heck, Paris Hilton is starting a singing career?!?! What?

[DepotFish]

Well, the more fish die on you, the more possibility that you'll spend more for new fish and more expensive equipment.

[SCFatz]

Welcome to AA!

Try to keep the ammonia around .5 with 1ppm being the absolute top.

Cut the feeding to once per day,or even once every other day as excess feeding will drive the ammonia up faster.

I cycled with fish because like you I just didn't no any better.Its a challange and requires lots of water changes to keep your levels down.There is no harm in changing the water out,just be sure to declorinate and match the water temp.

Test the water daily.

[Rob0504]

Thanks everyone for your input. I'll keep on changing the water and cut back on feeding. So far no casualties and everyon appears OK...they just want to eat, eat and eat. Some of the fish seem to be breathing a little fast, but I do not know what normal is.

Thanks again!