Eco complete users, I have some questions, please read

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MonsterfishGuy said:
Not very sharp explanation and nothing really precise and no proof... Only vague comparison!

Try it on 50 tanks with the exact same water, treated the exact same way with the exact same PWC, with the same filter and heater, log your test every day.

Then ask the company for the fact sheet of the product and ask them to speak to their specialist to know what bacteria there using and they shhould tell you.

Then you will be up to tell in public that your better in biology/chemistry/enginering that people who create everything that make our hobby better and easier as the years goes.

I think its not the goal of this site to speak over our competense to make people buy or dont buy a product or a way to think, the goal is to help people, help with the best we try not only know!

Remember, nowdays we are able to have bottle bacteria, and yes the nitrobacter and nitrosomonas!! They can even have it powder form!!!

Have a good night!
Click to expand...

Hmm...funny. I don't recall either promoting nor suggesting against any product...do you normally read that deeply into statements and draw conclusions that weren't remotely eluded to?

You're welcome to line up the 50 tanks and share your theory...so far I've only heard you attempting to debunk others...without providing any alternative ideas or evidence that there are flaws in the assumptions (which I've clearly states as such). If you have any remote ideas on what is causing these results...please share. I'm open to ideas...but at least I'm putting a hypotheses on the table.

You're right, the site is about helping people (which I like to believe I'm pretty well known for), and part of helping involves looking for causes and solutions to issues hobbyists face. That's exactly what's been happening on these numerous threads about the "new and improved" product...people asking questions, looking for solutions and trying to find a cause of the issue.

You're welcome to share your opinion (and hopefully some actual advice or ideas instead of simply debate)...but I'd ask that you try to present your thoughts without such a condescending tone...or at least provide a form of actual information.

Oh, and I'm super excited to see the true nitrifying bacteria that's found in powder form...that'd be new to me...and pretty much the entire hobby.
 
MonsterfishGuy said:
I read your article and they speak about sludge buster product!!! Not cycle helping priduct!
Bye
Click to expand...

What do you think the differences are? They're one in the same in this case. I think it's been clearly shown that heterotrophs, although not their natural or desired food source, are capable of short term nitrification. They normally serve to break down the organics in a tank (or wastewater treatment plant, pond, lake, river, etc...), but when put in a new aquarium will often accept the ammonia as a food source.

I'm not sure what you think the differences are between a "sludge busting product", and a bottle of a snake oil "instant cycling" product containing heterotrophic bacteria instead of the true aquarium nitrifiers.

Instead of posting links (which I've got a few handy)...hop on google and check for yourself. There is also a YouTube video with Dr. Tim Havonec (of Dr. Tim's One and Only Live Nitrifying Bacteria), who talks about how he discovered the true nitrifying bacteria strains as opposed to what is found in waste water treatment ("sludge") which is normally contained in bottled bacteria.
 
Difference is that sludge buster product are not cycling helping product.

In cycle helping product you dont have any heterotroph or anaerobic, they use nitroaomonas and nitrobacter and in some there is even nitrospira, there is the big uge difference.

Another exemple, nutrafin cycle is nitrospira, nitrosomonas and nitrobacter and in nutrafin waste control thats heterotroph.

Thats why i told you dont tell in public that cycle product does'nt have any other bacteria than the heterotroph as they exist in sludge buster product just as all your article and argument leads but not in cycle product!

Oh! And if you cant debate without beeing angry just dont do it then!

Bye
 
But everything you said is true about sludge buster product!!

Good point

Now go on cycle one! And speak with people who can answer to you, as sometime a person can help as internet and google are limited! Its like shcool its easier with the teacher that the book only. Call seachem they will tell you everythong you want to know!!

Bye
 
MonsterfishGuy said:
Difference is that sludge buster product are not cycling helping product.

In cycle helping product you dont have any heterotroph or anaerobic, they use nitroaomonas and nitrobacter and in some there is even nitrospira, there is the big uge difference.

Another exemple, nutrafin cycle is nitrospira, nitrosomonas and nitrobacter and in nutrafin waste control thats heterotroph.

Thats why i told you dont tell in public that cycle product does'nt have any other bacteria than the heterotroph as they exist in sludge buster product just as all your article and argument leads but not in cycle product!

Oh! And if you cant debate without beeing angry just dont do it then!

Bye
Click to expand...

MonsterfishGuy said:
But everything you said is true about sludge buster product!!

Good point

Now go on cycle one! And speak with people who can answer to you, as sometime a person can help as internet and google are limited! Its like shcool its easier with the teacher that the book only. Call seachem they will tell you everythong you want to know!!

Bye
Click to expand...

You might have forgotten that the topic of the thread is in regards to heterotrophic bacteria contained in bags of eco-complete...this is not a debate on cycling products in general. There are a few products which I believe do contain the correct nitrifying bacteria found in aquaria (Tetra Safestart, Dr. Tim's O&O, etc...), but I think it's fair to say the vast majority do not...they contain the same forms as in this particular substrate, hence why they can sit on a shelf for long periods without expiring. True nitrifying bacteria can not encase as spores and remain dormant (And that is well documented,tested and even used as an advertising point for the few cycling products that actually have a decent track record).

I'm still waiting for any ideas you can bring to the table. I have clearly stated that this is simply assumption and speculation on my part...but I have also shown that, in theory, it's possible. If you've got any thoughts or advice you can offer on the topic...I'd love to hear it.
 
Instead of just blatantly saying in public that mermaid magic is to blame please back up your claim with proofs, but do it without being angry
 
On a more serious note:
I just started cycling my 75g 4 days ago, and am already getting wicked high nitirite readings. The substrate in my tank? Flourite sand. Perhaps a correlation there somewhere?
I really didn't expect to see any kind of nitrite reading yet, but when I saw that my Ammonia was dropping from 4 to 2 figured I'd take a reading just for kicks. Quite a surprise.
I'll let the ammo come down a little bit today again, and then take readings tommorrow and see where it's at.
Just thought it was worth mentioning.
 
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