Experience with tank dividers?

[7Enigma]

Hello everyone,

Today (or in the next week) I'll be getting some cherry red shrimp from a friend. I have the perfect tank for them, however currently occupying the tank is a dwarf puffer. Obviously these 2 species will not mix (rather they will mix in the puffer's belly). I cannot justify another tank, and thought splitting my puffer tank (10 gallon) using a divider would work perfectly. I had a bad experience with a tank divider on my 20 gallon (the aggressive fish got to the other side), but think it was more an issue of installation since I didn't remove the substrate to get a good proper seal. Since this is my tank at work I only have a single puffer, which I know cannot be good for her due to lack of interesting things to do (no social behavior, etc.), but didn't want to deal with aggression issues which would likely happen when I'm not at work. This would seem to fix the boredom, while still keeping both safe. I would have to cut back on the 50% PWC per week (likely 10-25% twice per week to avoid drastic changes which apparently are bad for shrimp), but everything else about the tank should be suitable for both species.

I would section the tank 75/25 puffer/shrimp.

Thoughts?

 

[atomiclord]

Wouldn't that be kind of cruel? Like a betta barracks. Just my thoughts...

 

[An t-iasg]

I divided a 10 gallon tank several years ago for two bettas. The dividers available for 10 gallon tanks work fine and it's nice that you don't have to make your own for that size tank. Yes, you do have to dig down into the substrate to get a good fit. My lid wasn't closing so I had to reposition it a little.

I remember problems with algae building up on the divider and a slowing of the water flow. I had a sponge filter on only one side of the tank, since it was a betta tank. For your tank, your filter is probably more powerful than a sponge filter so you may not have as much of a flow issue that I had. Maybe you could consider adding a sponge filter to the shrimp side if you feel the flow is inadequate. Monitor the temperature to make sure the heater is taking care of both sides, but this shouldn't be a factor if the flow is good. Overall I think it's worth a try.

 

[7Enigma]

Thanks for the replies.

Atomiclord, I don't think it will be cruel. On the contrary, I think it will give the puffer something to watch in an otherwise barren tank. I've always felt a bit guilty the last year with the boredom she must have except for the feedings and my (very) limited interaction.

An t-iasg, man is your username frustrating to type! My filter on the 10 gallon is an Aquaclear20, which is definitely a bit overkill for this sized tank. I normally keep the flow about 1/2 of what it is capable of, but will be putting a foam insert on the intake to prevent the shrimp from getting sucked up and secondly to provide a food source so they can graze on the buildup on the sponge. The heating won't be an issue either since the building is kept at a steady temp and my heater is a 50w (could be a 75 or 100w actually). If possible (it might not be due to installation of the divider), I'll split the waterfall between the 2 sides for best results, otherwise I'll give the puffer the larger section with the filter.

I just spent 3 hours yesterday tearing the entire tank apart, cleaning all of the plants, pruning, removed the substrate (PFS) and did a good cleaning. The tank looks like new (it had a really bad algae issue since I couldn't keep any typical cleaner fish and the several oto's I had purchased either died of natural causes or where bullied when I wasn't around), and I did a 90% PWC (one of the benefits of a puffer is they are so tiny you can drain the water down to near nothing, and they are fully submerged!

So any possible nitrAte issues due to the substrate or algae decomposing have been dealt with, and I'll do another 50% PWC tomorrow morning before the shrimp arive just to have the conditions pristine.

 

[An t-iasg]

An t-iasg, man is your username frustrating to type!

Sorry I think copy and paste will create a link which sometimes you don't want.

I'm glad your flow and temperature issues are taken care of. That's the only possible problems that I can see in this type of setup. If those are addressed, the tank, maintenance-wise, should be like any other tank. I agree with the 75-25% division. Just make sure the larger side is big enough to get your gravel vac down and around. You've done a few PWCs already - is that with the divider in place? You said you did a teardown but didn't say if you've started to build the tank again with the divider.

I just spent 3 hours yesterday tearing the entire tank apart, cleaning all of the plants, pruning, removed the substrate (PFS) and did a good cleaning.

Oh yes, I can relate!

 

[7Enigma]

Haven't bought the divider yet. So no. The nice thing is I originally had planned for the DP tank to have a bare bottom, but didn't like the look once built. So I have a "pseudo" layer of PFS which pretty much barely coats the bottom and so can easily be pushed out of the way to properly place the divider.

I may even shift all of the substrate to the puffer side and leave the shrimp side bare bottom. I was at my parents over the weekend and picked a handful of oak leaves. I've read one of the best "foods" for the shrimp is to soak the oak leaves for a couple weeks, changing the water frequently to leech the tannins out, and then "feed" the shrimp a leaf or 3 at a time. Apparently the natural flora/fauna that grows on the leaves is the perfect food source for them to graze on, and because it is living, you don't have to worry about contaminating the water from overfeeding with something like flake food or an algae wafer. It'll be a couple weeks until I can get the leaves ready, but I'll post back if it's successful.

For the gravel vac I no longer use the typical wide-mouthed unit. Instead I have a 3/4" piece of tubing that allows for MUCH higher suction which is nice for picking up left over snail pieces after a weeks worth of feeding. Because it's only 3/4", it is very maneuverable so no issues there. I've switched over to this type of vac on my main tank at home as well since it's densly planted and there would be no way to get any vac near the substrate without it.

Lastly, I just spoke with my friend supplying the shrimp and he was pleasantly surprised to find out just how many were hiding in his tank. It was densly planted, and so he never saw them, but after tearing the tank down said there are tons! I'm hoping a larger starer population will give me a higher chance for success, and of course breeding.

 

[7Enigma]

So this morning I installed the divider. What a PITA that was. Clearly the divider is meant to be installed on an empty drained tank. Well I have the dwarf puffer and wasn't going to drain the tank to install it. I used a piece of plastic as a scraper to gently move the sand to either side of where the divider would go. The DP kept getting curious and going into the wrong compartment (the 25% side was previously her "place"), or getting too close for comfort during installation. About 30min of frustration later it's installed almost exactly at 75%/25%.

I put 3 small rocks against the base to prevent it from moving into the shrimp area. I also (and this IMO is very important if segregating an aggressive fish from peaceful ones) made sure the smooth side of the plastic divider was facing the puffer (aggressive fish). It appears when they put the small holes in they are popped through from one side. You get a rough to the touch texture on one side, while the other side is perfectly smooth. Since I foresee the puffer trying to attack the shrimp for a while, I didn't want her to get scraped up while trying to get to the other side. The shrimp will not mind, and might enjoy the footholds, like a miniature rock climbing wall (until a leg gets through and gets nibbled off!).

The biggest annoyance but no true problem is now my glass top will not go down due to the clips holding the divider in place. The lid is not raised ~1/4" at the front and I was wondering if anyone has had success drilling a notch out of the glass hoods. I have a diamond circle bit I recently used to drill a hole straight through a ceramic tile, but am unsure if that is the proper tool for glass.

I then did a 20% water change with all tap water to bring up the hardness in the tank. Previously this was a very soft water tank due to lugging in gallons and gallons of water from home (I don't trust our work tap water, and so mixed previously 80% distilled with 20% of my home tap water). The great thing about the divider is I added all of my 100% tap water to the shrimp side (no shrimp yet), and due to the tiny holes it slowly diffused into the puffer side. This was almost like a slow change to harder water. From now on, all water changes will be 100% from my tap at home to slowly bring the hardness up to shrimp conditions.

I can't tell if it's the water hardness or just the new tank divider, but the coloration of my puffer's spots are very dark, moreso than I can ever remember. Maybe that means the harder water is appreciated? Dunno, but she is chasing her reflection in the newly razor-bladed glass, so maybe it's just an aggression thing.

I'll report back after the shrimp are added, and try to grab a picture tomorrow once everything has settled down.

Thanks again for everyone's input!

 

[An t-iasg]

When I had my divider installed, I remember that my lid did close almost all the way, but the front edge didn't really rest down in the lip of the tank anymore. So while I considered that closed, it didn't go down as snug as before. If it is annoying to you, try drilling a little notch in the glass. I don't know if your drill bit is the right one to use on glass too, but glass tops are relatively cheap compared to tanks.

How is the puffer doing now that she has been acclimated to the harder water? From what I read, the puffer will appreciate the harder water. The deepening of her color seems to suggest this too. Is she still chasing her reflection? I would think she should calm down soon - she is getting used to a "new" tank.

When the divider itself gets too dirty to clean, you can substitute a piece of plastic canvas from the craft store. I used to have a few pre-cut to the right size so I could swap them out when one became too algae-encrusted. The plastic canvas comes in a variety of colors and hole sizes.

 

[7Enigma]

When I had my divider installed, I remember that my lid did close almost all the way, but the front edge didn't really rest down in the lip of the tank anymore. So while I considered that closed, it didn't go down as snug as before. If it is annoying to you, try drilling a little notch in the glass. I don't know if your drill bit is the right one to use on glass too, but glass tops are relatively cheap compared to tanks.

How is the puffer doing now that she has been acclimated to the harder water? From what I read, the puffer will appreciate the harder water. The deepening of her color seems to suggest this too. Is she still chasing her reflection? I would think she should calm down soon - she is getting used to a "new" tank.

When the divider itself gets too dirty to clean, you can substitute a piece of plastic canvas from the craft store. I used to have a few pre-cut to the right size so I could swap them out when one became too algae-encrusted. The plastic canvas comes in a variety of colors and hole sizes.

Still waiting on the shrimp......hopefully tomorrow, but then I have the issue of not being at work during the weekend....

Anyways, I found out it's not just the clip but also the entire divider is a bit too tall (and so the middle is pushed up as well). I'm a bit worried about trying to trim it while installed for fear it will move and ruin my grueling installation the other day. But tomorrow morning I may do it.

The puffer seems pretty much the same as before. The dark coloration seems to come and go and seems directly related to "aggressive behavior" when it thinks there is another puffer. Certainly more active, but I don't think there is any actual health change (which is good because she was doing fine before). I did another 20% change this morning, and tomorrow will do another 20% change which should bring me within 10-20% of my home tap water conditions. Since typically the inverts are much more prone to problems with water change conditions, this way once they are acclimated to my tank they should be stable.

Also the water quality now has to be pristine due to all the cleaning and recent water changes, and the anubias will take care of any trace amounts that get produced by the puffer/inverts.

I'm going to snap a picture tomorrow regardless of whether the shrimp come in or not. I want to remember how nice it looks so in a couple months I can get myself to do it again.

I'm hoping the algae issues you describe are not going to happen (or at least occur slower), as I don't want to imagine trying to keep them separate when replacing the divider. I'm hoping the shrimp keep their side clean and I only have to occasionally wipe the puffer side. My plan is to get ~4 oto's for this tank once everyone is in place and hope the puffer plays nice with them, but that's in the future.

Right now I just want the shrimp!

 

[An t-iasg]

You already have the divider in, and I know how hard it is to get in the right place! My husband used a miter saw to shorten the frame on mine a little. As far as replacing the divider, I realize it will be harder for your situation - many shrimp to keep track of. When I had two bettas, it wasn't that difficult to catch and remove them to give the divider a good scrubbing or replace it. But your water flow will be better than mine was - I just had a sponge filter on one side - and I hope that will delay or reduce any algae issues for you.

 

[7Enigma]

You already have the divider in, and I know how hard it is to get in the right place! My husband used a miter saw to shorten the frame on mine a little. As far as replacing the divider, I realize it will be harder for your situation - many shrimp to keep track of. When I had two bettas, it wasn't that difficult to catch and remove them to give the divider a good scrubbing or replace it. But your water flow will be better than mine was - I just had a sponge filter on one side - and I hope that will delay or reduce any algae issues for you.

I can only hope. I used a razor blade and took ~1/8" off the top of the divider and now the glass top sits better but still not perfect. I didn't want to remove too much at once, but now I wish I had cut off a tiny bit more. I'm probably just going to leave it alone as it's a LOT of work trying to get the top divider back on since the plastic wants to flex and the whole thing wants to move.

Still no shrimp.....next chance is Monday....

 

[7Enigma]

Here's the tank setup (you can see the puffer on the far upper left). That will give you an idea of how small the dwarf puffer species is (she is full adult size):

closeup shot of the puff:

 

[atomiclord]

Looking good. Now you've got me considering doing the same thing...

 

[7Enigma]

Looking good. Now you've got me considering doing the same thing...

Thanks. You should have seen the tank before the complete renovation. Night and day difference! Do you already have a puffer? Or did you just mean to split up a tank? If not, they are an incredible species. Extremely intelligent, very unusual in the way they "hover" and use their tail as a rudder to steer, and also one of the longest lived species in the truly freshwater trade that I know of (10+ years not uncommon, have heard rumors of 15-20 when kept properly).

 

[atomiclord]

I don't have a puffer ... yet

I'm now considering splitting a tank since my cherry shrimps get eaten every now and then.