Fishless cycling question

[jakeandwendy]

set the tank up on 3/21, raised the temp to 84F, added a bubble bar, dosed the tank to 4.0ppm amm. kept it at 4.0ppm for 4 days. got a filter pack off of an established oscar tank and added it at day 5. Now my numbers are 1.0ppm amm, 5.0ppm n2 and <160ppm n3. Should i do a water change now or wait until the amm 0's out? I dosed the tank back up to 3.0ppm amm this a.m but it was down from the 4.0ppm amm the night before. Also my ph is unreadable its so high. i use the api fw master kit. theres nothing in the tank except some slate rock i got from the lfs and some crystal geodes. is this just part of the cycling process? if not i'll have to pull the geodes out, but the tanks at the lfs have geodes in them and they don't mess with them at all. Any thoughts suggestions tips are welcome and appreciated!!!

 

[Marconis]

Wait until ammonia zeros out..if it's been under a week then there should be no need to do a water change. To buffer the pH you can add some baking soda. Your pH shouldn't be off the chart because of cycling.

 

[jakeandwendy]

thats what i thought. we had a seashell and a piece of coral in there but i took them out when the ph went skyrocketing. i left the ph high though to aid the bacteria growth. i age my water a couple of days before i do pwcs so the ph will come way when i do the water change. i'll also throw a little baking soda in there a little bit before i do the water change. sound right? thanks for the amm. answer. i was pretty sure about waiting, but i wanted to be sure. i have a 20g fw community tank that just now cycled(HURRAY!!!) and i lost 4 fish in the process. this time i want to get it right before i get the fish in there. Thanks for your feedback! One other thing, when should i stop dosing it with the amm? when it can convert say 4.0ppm amm to 0ppm amm in ...4 hrs,6 hrs, more, less?

 

[eco23]

thats what i thought. we had a seashell and a piece of coral in there but i took them out when the ph went skyrocketing. i left the ph high though to aid the bacteria growth. i age my water a couple of days before i do pwcs so the ph will come way when i do the water change. i'll also throw a little baking soda in there a little bit before i do the water change. sound right? thanks for the amm. answer. i was pretty sure about waiting, but i wanted to be sure. i have a 20g fw community tank that just now cycled(HURRAY!!!) and i lost 4 fish in the process. this time i want to get it right before i get the fish in there. Thanks for your feedback! One other thing, when should i stop dosing it with the amm? when it can convert say 4.0ppm amm to 0ppm amm in ...4 hrs,6 hrs, more, less?

Some people wait till it drops down around 1ppm, most just keep it dosed up to 4ppm daily. The main objective is to be able to turn 4ppm ammonia > nitrItes > nitrAtes in a 24 hour period. That means you're officially cycled. Remember to use a dechlorinator like Prime when you do a water change because chlorine/chloramines do not evaporate out of water as most people think, and the chlorine can almost instantly destroy your bacteria and ruin your cycle.

 

[eco23]

Also, if you're nitrAtes and nitrItes get REALLY high, you can do a pwc to get them to a readable level because if they get crazy high it can disrupt or stall your cycle.

 

[jakeandwendy]

the n2 and n3 are crazy high and the amm is dropping steadily so would a 25% pwc do it? less? more?

 

[eco23]

the n2 and n3 are crazy high and the amm is dropping steadily so would a 25% pwc do it? less? more?

The bacteria live on the surfaces of the tank, not really in the water. It actually took me two 75% changes to get my nitrIte and nitrAte down to readable levels. Just make sure you dechlorinate the water and match temperatures as chlorine can instantly destroy the bacteria and temp changes can kill it or stall it as well.

 

[Marconis]

Don't do a water change yet. You said it's been a week. Wait a few more days to see if things change.

 

[eco23]

Don't do a water change yet. You said it's been a week. Wait a few more days to see if things change.

It's fine to wait also. It won't ruin the cycle either way. The principle behind doing the pwc is to keep it in readable levels so you have an idea of what's going on in the cycle, and also because if the nitrItes got SUPER high it can stall it the same way that adding 40ppm of ammonia instead of 4ppm would stall it. But yeah, you're still early into the process.

 

[jakeandwendy]

went ahead and did about a 20% pwc which didn't make it readable but eased my mind enough to leave it for a couple more days and see how it goes. used the baking soda to get the ph down to 8.2 which is okay for me.

 

[eco23]

went ahead and did about a 20% pwc which didn't make it readable but eased my mind enough to leave it for a couple more days and see how it goes. used the baking soda to get the ph down to 8.2 which is okay for me.

One of the tricks people use to jump start their cycle is actually to add a few drops of PH down to add phosphates and other nutrients to the water. Some people swear it acted like a miracle to put their cycle into turbo. I've never done it, but if you're already having PH trouble it might be an idea to try out. Normally you want to avoid any chemicals whatsoever in your tank, but if it's a tried and true trick to help your cycle you should maybe experiment. Check out an article on this site called "Tips and tricks for your fastest fishless cycle". The guy who wrote it covers PH down and answers a bunch of questions as to how it works.

 

[Marconis]

One of the tricks people use to jump start their cycle is actually to add a few drops of PH down to add phosphates and other nutrients to the water. Some people swear it acted like a miracle to put their cycle into turbo. I've never done it, but if you're already having PH trouble it might be an idea to try out. Normally you want to avoid any chemicals whatsoever in your tank, but if it's a tried and true trick to help your cycle you should maybe experiment. Check out an article on this site called "Tips and tricks for your fastest fishless cycle". The guy who wrote it covers PH down and answers a bunch of questions as to how it works.

On top of that, be sure to read the step-by-step sticky in "Getting Started". It is comically written and very informative, as members post their own advice throughout the thread.

 

[jakeandwendy]

thats actually the thread i went off of eco but i dosed my tank higher, 4.0ppm and as soon as i started to catch nitrites i put in a small pinch of flake fish food for the phosphates and trace elements the bacteria might need. i'm pretty sure the ph issue was from the shells and fossilized coral and its been gone for about 5 days now. i used some baking soda and it came down just fine. my n2 and n3 are still high but the amm is still dropping. i dosed it back up to 4.0ppm tonight and i'll check it throughout the day tommorrow and see what happens. i'm learning that patience and research are valuable assets in this hobby! thanks for all your help!

 

[Marconis]

No problem, good luck!

 

[Amicus]

The other people who replied are correct, if you do a pwc then you will remove some bacteria as it is on surfaces and in the water. I would stop dosing, or any other additives and give the tank more time to cycle naturally.

Sent from my iPhone using Aquarium

 

[Marconis]

Listen, the bottom line is to have patience patience patience! I thought my cycle was stalled because I had initially dosed too much ammonia, and (if I recall) after like 2.5-3 weeks things finally got underway.

Just gotta be patient!

 

[jakeandwendy]

most definitely marconis!! and i'm just waiting. i don't like adding anything if i can help it. i learned some hard lessons on our 20g fw tank. not as hard as the poor fish that taught me but lessons all the same. its just now cycled and i'm still nervously checking parameters on it!!