Goldfish chasing

[jlk]

Your ph is the lowest level on the strip? Does your tap look the same on the strip? This may be part of the issue here because your good bacteria can not process ammonia in a very low ph range. Once you have a decent test kit, we will be able to figure out what exactly your tap & tank are reading and address this. Check out amazon- their prices are usually $20-23 vs a lfs selling the kits for $35+.

I would also consider switching to Prime or Amquel Plus to help limit the toxicity of ammonia & nitrite between water changes- this will help your fish alot as well. A little Prime goes a long way so its a better value in the long run but either product will be more helpful than what your presently using especially while your tank is cycling.

Yes, the 'active' filters are shipped wet to maintain the bacterial colonies. If you consider this route, just make sure you purchase a filter labeled 'active' or you will just be getting a plain, new filter. We may have to address your ph though or the cycled filter will not work- I dont know this for sure because you dont have an accurate means for testing your water yet.

 

[tielai]

Good Morning jlk!

Well, I have some sad news...though I thought I was going to loose the oranda, when I came home from work I saw, our calico died. There was a thin white film covering the oranda as well. I quarantined the oranda, and a good deal of this white film came off. He's sluggish today and most likely will not make it. I remain hopeful. I brought the calico back to the petland discount and the manager said it was the ammonia that causes that thin white surface on the fish, basically burning them alive, terrible.

My wife and I frustrated by this, questioning our attempts to properly care for goldfish. After much thought we decided to give it another attempt. Hoping the oranda survives.

I have no fish in the 20g tank at this time. A good opportunity to cycle properly. The dead fish was in the tank approximately 6 hours before I took him out. He was fine that morning, so 6 hour window seems accurate enough as I took him out at 5:00.

So my question is...do I need to empty the tank? or just continue to cycle?

BTW, the tap water is 0. to .5 ammonia. In the tank after the fish were taken out the ph was 30. Nitrite and nitrate were 6.0 lowest reading.

This is most frustrating..how do these pet stores keep their fish alive? they had 6 fancies in a 20g tank, large fancies, and the staff just turned on a hose to fill with tap and then sprayed 6 spritzes of a dechlor and added a half cup of aquarium salt and done! as of yesterday there were 5 still in the tank, looking healthy!

Thanks for all your help!

tielai

 

[jlk]

Oh no! I am so sorry That is very sad to hear. Where is your oranda right now? Ok, did you get yourself a good test kit & a bottle of either Prime or Amquel Plus? I believe there may be a typo in the readings you posted- I dont know of any ph test that reads 30. Let me know how these numbers look!

You dont need to empty the tank if you want to do a fishless cycle. You will just need a bottle of plain ammonia (ammonium hydroxide & water- no dyes, perfumes, surfectants, etc). If you are in the US, try the Ace Hardware store locator & see if theres one in your area. They carry the Ace Hardware 10% Janitorial strength ammonia. If there isnt one, some Dollar Tree stores carry usuable ammonia as well amazon & few other places.

In respect to your lfs, you need to keep in mind most stores run their tanks on a huge filtration system so overstocking their tanks does not create the same issues as it does for a single home aquarium with a single filter. Let me know how I can further help!

 

[tielai]

thanks,
oranda isn't doing well. he's in a bowl, i change his water daily. he's not eating, or she rather as my wife noticed eggs in the bowl.

dumb question; when i purchase the ammonia how much do i put in the tank? what will putting the ammonia in the tank do? i'm guessing it will help promote a ph reading that will aid in a proper cycling of ammonia and nitrite to nitrate?

i did get the api master test kit. i did'nt open it yet, after seeing the dead fish and being discouraged we thought, let's stop think and maybe we need to return all this and give up. but we're going to give it another go. sadly ironic, i went to the petland store, bought all this stuff, api master test kit, starfish shaped aerator and pump, etc., only to come home and see one dead fish and the other dying.

what kind of reading should i see that will indicate my take is ready?

something like: ammonia 0
ph 0
nitrite 0
nitrate 5 ???

many thanks,
tielai

 

[jlk]

I am so sorry!!! Fish loss is devastating but do NOT give up yet!!! Ok, I will give you a few quick basics/links (hectic day today!) but will explain more later. Start by opening the API kit & carefully read the directions for the tests. Make sure you shake the bottles really well! Perform each test on your tap water & let us know the results. For the ph test, you will need to set out a container of tap water for 24hrs with an airstone or bubbler & then test ph after 24hrs. You then can test the bowl for ammonia, nitrite & nitrate.

Ok, for a fishless cycle, the hard part will be finding usuable ammonia. Dosing with amm will give your good bacteria food to grow & colonize. They will eventually convert the amm>nitrite>nitrate. When you can dose 4ppm of amm & your tank zeroes out the amm & nitrite in 24hrs with increasing nitrate, your cycled & your tank is safe for fish. The process of devloping bacteria does not happen overnight & it requires some patience. Ill post link to fishless cycling that will explain more!

http://www.aquariumadvice.com/forum...guide-and-faq-to-fishless-cycling-148283.html

 

[tielai]

Good morning, jlk

I opened the api master kit and took readings of tank and tap. i didn't do a water change yet. the readings are as follows:

Tank
ph 6.0
ammo 2.0
nitrite 0 ppm
nitrate 0 ppm

Tap
ph 7.0
ammo 0 ppm
nitrite 0 ppm
nitrate 0 ppm

so this is what we've got to work with. I believe the next step is to order prime, buy pure ammonia and do a water change.

question would you recommend using bottled water, though that's another cost?

no fish are in the tank.

I lost the oranda.

Thanks for your help!

 

[jlk]

Oh no!!! I am so sorry!!! Thank you for the numbers! Your tap water actually looks perfectly fine- no need for bottled water!! What I do suspect is that your KH (buffer level) may be on the low side because your ph drops very quickly. So, I would like for you to add one more thing to your list of Prime & ammonia. I want you to get one of the following: crushed coral (sw section), argonite (sw section) or crushed seashells (bird section or the beach). Just one, not all three! Your going to add this to your filter in a small mesh bag or piece of clean pantyhose to help stabilize your buffer levels & ph. Keep us posted & let us know when you have everything to start your cycle!

 

[tielai]

good morning!

i'm going to purchase the prime, ammonia and crushed coral, or argonite, or seashells today.

readings today:

ph 6.6-8
nitrite 0
nitrate 0
ammo 4.0

then i did a water change. stirred up the substrate, still lots of eggs left over, now they have a fuzz around them.

i found out petco has prime, and ammonia i could get any walmart, etc., pure ammonia.

"sw" i assume stands for 'salt water' ?

many thanks!

 

[jlk]

Yep, sw is saltwater! Finding a usuable ammonia is actually one of the hardest things to do! The walmart stuff has surfectants in it- you dont want this in an aquarium. Dont waste your time looking in grocery stores or the big chain home improvement stores (ie Home Depot, Loews, etc). Google the Ace Hardware store locator & see if theres one anywhere near you. I believe some Do It Best Hardware stores, possibly Menards (sp?) and Dollar Tree stores carry usuable ammonia. You want ammonia with no 'additives'- just ammonium hydroxide & water listed as the only ingredients.

If your ammonia is reading 4ppm right now, this is a good start! Just leave everything be! The eggs are rotting & likely providing your source of ammonia right now. Just keep monitoring your water for any changes in levels. And consider purchasing an active filter if you want to speed everything up.

 

[tielai]

good morning!

i hope you had a great weekend! i wanted to pass on my latest water readings.

Nitrite 0.50
Nitrate 0.
PH 6.6
Ammo 2.0

Some movement but real slow moving. I left the tank alone and have not done any water changes, nor did I add any Bbacteria.

are we moving in the right direction?

many thanks!
Tielai

 

[jlk]

Hi! Yep, you have some definite movement! Did you get a buffer yet? I suspect because your ph is on the low side, this is slowing things down a bit. Wait for your ammonia to drop down close to zero before adding anymore. Keep us posted!

 

[LyndaB]

The fish guy at Petland discount seems to think these four would be ok in the 20 gallon tank.

I would find myself a new fish store. This guy doesn't know what he's talking about.

 

[tielai]

Fishless cycle

Good morning

Here's the latest readings!
No2 5.0
No.3 20.0
Ph 6.6
Ammo 0

I never bought aragonite or coral because they only sold the big bags off it. 5 lbs bags.

So I did a 25% water change and added 30ml of bbacteria, after I took those readings.

Many thanks!
Tielai

 

[tielai]

Good morning

Here's the latest readings!
No2 5.0
No.3 20.0
Ph 6.6
Ammo 0

I never bought aragonite or coral because they only sold the big bags off it. 5 lbs bags.

So I did a 25% water change and added 30ml of bbacteria, after I took those readings.

Many thanks!
Tielai

 

[jlk]

Looks good! Continue to add ammonia when it zeroes out. Now, you just have to wait for the nitrites to zero and you will be cycled!