Hardwater, high pH, cheap solution?

[redwhiptailplec]

Okay well I have a new tank, its been up and running now for about three weeks and seems to be thriving. The problem is that most of my fish are Amazon varieties, and as such would prefer soft acidic water but my local water is hard as nails and very alkaline.

[acronym:d03ecf5858="Reverse osmosis"]RO[/acronym:d03ecf5858] is not really an option as for the moment I am on a pretty tight budget, I had thought about getting one of the Brita filter thingies but am not sure if it would work. I am also considering using rainwater, but as Jacksonville is an industrial city I am not sure about the quality...I have even considered using cheap spring water from the local super market.

Any advice guys?

Yeah go to your [acronym:01128b13b5="Local Fish Store"]lfs[/acronym:01128b13b5] or walmart and you can buy tablets or liquid to lower you [acronym:01128b13b5="power head or Measure of the concentration of hydrogen ions, depending on context"]ph[/acronym:01128b13b5]. For example bullseye 7.0 or whatever you want your [acronym:01128b13b5="power head or Measure of the concentration of hydrogen ions, depending on context"]ph[/acronym:01128b13b5] to be. Your [acronym:01128b13b5="Local Fish Store"]lfs[/acronym:01128b13b5] should also sell material that you stick in your filter to natually soften the water. They also make chemicals you can add to the tank to soften it.
hth

[sonoma2nv]

i wouldnt use any chemicals to lower the [acronym:b92b75b639="power head or Measure of the concentration of hydrogen ions, depending on context"]ph[/acronym:b92b75b639].i would go the natural route. but is your fish stressed?whats your [acronym:b92b75b639="power head or Measure of the concentration of hydrogen ions, depending on context"]ph[/acronym:b92b75b639] at now.as long as your [acronym:b92b75b639="power head or Measure of the concentration of hydrogen ions, depending on context"]ph[/acronym:b92b75b639] is stalbe i would leave it.maybe someone else will put there info in .

[frog girl]

Brita won't take out any dissolved solids so that won't really work. If the spring water is run through a distillery or [acronym:f2702862b0="Reverse osmosis"]RO[/acronym:f2702862b0] system which it often is to make it taste better then you can use that without a problem (in any case it will probably be softer than what you are getting out of the tap. I use rainwater sometimes but in Jacksonville I probably wouldn't & most folks tell you not to.

Driftwood & peat moss (in the filter) will both lower your pH but will make your water have a yellow brownish color (this is just the tannic acid given off by either of those & won't hurt the fish a bit). In fact many amazon fish like a bit of tannic acid in their water since it simulates their natural habitat (depends on the species though). If you collect your own driftwood be sure that you look up how to sterilize it before you put it in your aquarium. You won't want to soak it quite as long as the directions say to get out all the tannic acid because you will want some to leach into your tank. You can do part of the water logging process in the tank by weighting the driftwood down with rocks (this is probably not recomended but I have done it)

Another option is to go to your fish store & buy a couple bunches of hornwort & throw them in tied to something so they won't float all over (they are a rootless plant that takes up a good amount of fish wastes). Then you can run a [acronym:f2702862b0="Do it yourself"]DIY[/acronym:f2702862b0] [acronym:f2702862b0="Carbon dioxide"]CO2[/acronym:f2702862b0] system which will bring down your pH also. This is not a quick fix but perhaps ultimately a better long term solution since it makes for happier fish. [acronym:f2702862b0="Do it yourself"]DIY[/acronym:f2702862b0] [acronym:f2702862b0="Carbon dioxide"]CO2[/acronym:f2702862b0] to set up is dirt cheap. If you don't have too many plants I would reccomend using whole wheat flour instead of sugar in the generator so you don't overproduce the [acronym:f2702862b0="Carbon dioxide"]CO2[/acronym:f2702862b0] - this can cause your pH to go down to far if it overproduces). Directions for [acronym:f2702862b0="Do it yourself"]DIY[/acronym:f2702862b0] [acronym:f2702862b0="Carbon dioxide"]CO2[/acronym:f2702862b0] can be found easily with a google search or her by searching past postings in this forum.

You could also build a small solar still which would produce about 2 liters a day of very soft water if you are in a sunny area (which you are). Again directions can be obtained online by looking up homemade solar still.

The problem with using the tablets or additives is that it can cause pH swings in your tank & is not a permanent solution (so its pretty hard on the fish in the long run).

[xray]

pH swings are more dangerous to your fish than a high [acronym:2a610b624d="power head or Measure of the concentration of hydrogen ions, depending on context"]ph[/acronym:2a610b624d]. go the natural route like frog girl said.

[redwhiptailplec]

Thanks for the advise guys! I would prefer not to use pH adjusters etc. I would consider using driftwood but do not really want any in my aquarium. Do you think if I placed some driftwood in a holding container and let the water sit with it for a few days that would have a positive effect?

I have read that Amazon fish can be encouraged to breed by simulating rainfall, i.e by adding soft acidic water. Once I find an economical way to produce such I will introduce it slowly using a drip system to prevent shock and/or stress in the fish. Mind you some of my Neons have already spawned, although sadly the eggs provided a buffet for the whole tank.

[frog girl]

Instead of bothering with driftwood I would find some peat moss at the nursery & use & old sock to contain it & brew it a bit like tea. The problem is this will not reduce your water hardness it will only lower the pH. If I where you I would buy that spring water & use that to brew up your tannic acid tea.

[frog girl]

P.S. if you can't afford the peat moss things like fallen leaves (oak especially) will have a lot of tannins. I would pour boiling water over them after rinsing them to make sure you don't get any bugs or algae in your tank if you decide to go this route. That way you would really be making tea. Not neccesary to put them in a sock if you are doing this. Peat moss is really crumbly & would be hard to get out of the water but with leaves it will be easy.

[mattrox]

Most tank bred fish can tolerate a range of pH and harness values.

I know people who have discus thrive in hard water at high pH values. I don't want to advertise other forums here, but I could send you a URL of a discus forum and you can browse that to get an idea of what they do.

[shawmutt]

What I do is buy [acronym:c73d5f9c69="Reverse osmosis"]RO[/acronym:c73d5f9c69] water from Walmart. You know those big machines for drinking water? That water is actually [acronym:c73d5f9c69="Reverse osmosis"]RO[/acronym:c73d5f9c69]. The only expensive thing is the container, about $8 each for a 5 gallon, but then the water is .33 a gallon. I change my water about every 2 weeks, and buy 15 gallons of water. When I get it home I put it in a big plastic container and add the things I need to make my water good for the fish. Works out to about $10 a month for water plus a little cost for the additives. However, I only have a 30 [acronym:c73d5f9c69="Gallon"]gal[/acronym:c73d5f9c69] and 10 [acronym:c73d5f9c69="Gallon"]gal[/acronym:c73d5f9c69], I wouldn't recommend it for anything more. Unless, of course, those old kung-fu movies inspired you to carry gallons of water on your back up stairs :P.

That being said, here comes the really important thing. It's actually been said a few times already--basically it's more important to have a steady pH than a "correct" pH (unless you are breeding some species, in that case the pH value is important). Whatever route you decide to go, make sure you are consistent with that method--and check the pH level once a week or so.