High Nitrates - Overstocked?

[pygocentrus]

That's almost right. Its actually lengthxwidthxheight of the fish. You have to take the whole fish into consideration. If we lived in a 2d world that would be correct.

 

[Elitehunter1]

http://www.howmanyfish.com/#page=page-1

 

[meloyelo]

Remaining 3 Zebra loaches dead when I got home yesterday. All other fish swimming around happy as can be. Loaches had been in there for 2 months and totally fine until few days ago. This can be a really frustrating hobby.....

 

[bs6749]

The reason you cycle your tank is so you can establish denitrifying bacteria. When you do a high volume water change you are eliminating that necessary bacteria.
You can expect a ph change when you flush your whole system like that.
Just my thoughts anyway

The beneficial bacteria live 90+% on surfaces and not in the water column of the tank, so large water changes are NOT the problem.

The problem is this: YOUR TAP WATER. How is this so hard for everyone to figure out? The OP said that there are 30ppm of nitrate in the tap water, so if the OP were to do a 100% water change and add tap water to the tank, the tank would read 30ppm of nitrate...simple as that. Fish, decaying food, dying plants, etc. add to the amount of nitrate in the tank, so the OP's tank will never be below 30ppm of nitrate unless fast growing live plants are added to the tank or unless purified water from some source is added to the tank in place of the well water. I would shoot for a nitrate reading of no more than 20ppm ever, so you will need to add lots of purified water and mix with a small amount of well water to accomplish this.

 

[boadams87]

The beneficial bacteria live 90+% on surfaces and not in the water column of the tank, so large water changes are NOT the problem.

The problem is this: YOUR TAP WATER. How is this so hard for everyone to figure out? The OP said that there are 30ppm of nitrate in the tap water, so if the OP were to do a 100% water change and add tap water to the tank, the tank would read 30ppm of nitrate...simple as that. Fish, decaying food, dying plants, etc. add to the amount of nitrate in the tank, so the OP's tank will never be below 30ppm of nitrate unless fast growing live plants are added to the tank or unless purified water from some source is added to the tank in place of the well water. I would shoot for a nitrate reading of no more than 20ppm ever, so you will need to add lots of purified water and mix with a small amount of well water to accomplish this.

I was thinking the same. Adding a R/O system would be to much and adding bottled distilled water would cost to much

 

[adadkins1]

Don't mess with bottled water or RO/DI water because of the cost. Plus, you would be running the risk of having pH crashes. I think if you get your tank to a proper stocking level, and add plants, you should be in good shape.

 

[meloyelo]

Got some live plants this past Friday, 3 bunches Combamba and a nice big bunch of Hornwart. The Hornwort was a very nice one. That is until this morning when I got up and went to check the tank. Holy smokes what a mess. The hornwart was nothing but stems and all it's leaves had shed. The intake on my two filters was covered in the leaves. So, no new casualties on the fish side, but now I'm killing plants. Good thing is when I checked my Nitrates tonight, they were at 40. Still not great, but an improvement. Thanks for all the input.

 

[aqua_chem]

I suspect the ph drops & jumps in your fish stress & demise rather than the water changes. A drop of .1 is enough to sicken & stress fish- a .8 drop is immense. Keep in mind the ph scale is logarithmic- each ph unit is a tenfold difference. So, a ph of 6 is 80 times more acidic than a ph of 6.8. Big difference! Then, the large water changes are raising the ph from 6 back up to 6.8. This has been more than your fish can handle at once

Just so we're clear, this is incorrect. A swing from 6 to 6.8 is about a 6-fold change in acidity, not 80x. My pH swings 1 pH every day from CO2 and I don't have any problems. I personally thing TDS and KH issues are more important than pH in most fishkeeping circumstances.

You need to remember that nutrient uptake is driven by light. Insufficient light will lead to poor uptake. What kind of light do you have?

Also, if that hornwort was shipped to you, it might have gotten cold in transit. Mass melts can also happen when changjng environment. You can try floating it for a bit instead of planting it right away to let it get a foothold. I also like wisteria or water sprite for nutrient sucking. Both are more attractive looking imo than hornwort.

 

[sammybelle]

It's my understanding that the BB live primarily in the filter media, not the water. I believe the problem with the huge water change is that it alters the pH too drastically.

 

[randy86]

I used to live by the inch if fish per gallon rule for the longest time. I agree with it full heartedly for beginners but I have to say that if you do your frequent water changes and keep up with your filters and cleanings you can push this rule to it far limits. But if you are having a hard time with what you have and strongly feel that it could be due to over population then you should stick to the one inch rule

 

[meloyelo]

Just so we're clear, this is incorrect. A swing from 6 to 6.8 is about a 6-fold change in acidity, not 80x. My pH swings 1 pH every day from CO2 and I don't have any problems. I personally thing TDS and KH issues are more important than pH in most fishkeeping circumstances.

You need to remember that nutrient uptake is driven by light. Insufficient light will lead to poor uptake. What kind of light do you have?

Also, if that hornwort was shipped to you, it might have gotten cold in transit. Mass melts can also happen when changjng environment. You can try floating it for a bit instead of planting it right away to let it get a foothold. I also like wisteria or water sprite for nutrient sucking. Both are more attractive looking imo than hornwort.

My lighting is LED.

 

[aqua_chem]

What kind?

 

[meloyelo]

What kind?

They came with a 55 gal "kit" that my wife got me for Christmas. They are Marineland and have the moonlight function as well as normal lighting. They are just a bank of LED's that snap into the top of the hood, one on each side of the tank. Link below:

Marineland® BioWheel® LED Aquarium Kit - Fish - Sale - PetSmart

Thanks,
Meloyelo

 

[jmpgop]

Meloyelo~

I'm sorry but you made me laugh at the "not only am I killing fish but plants too".

Sorry... I hear ya'! It is SOOO hard for me to keep trates down too. I have tested my tap water and it is zero. It must be me. I change change change. Once all my danios died (sigh) and I am down to only 3 large fish in my 36 gallon, I'm able to keep them at 40ppm. Surprised. Filthy danios (uh... okay... not... really...)????

Anywho - I understand that the LEDs are not powerful enough for plants. I have the Hagen Glo system on order. I have the bulbs and the fixture should be in this week. (I'm a retailer of pet supples though so it is much cheaper for me).

I'm setting up a 72 gallon that is just now ready for fish. Vacuuming and waterchanging to get the trates down for fish add. I'm adding 2 from my 36 gallon (the gourami and angel) and only small fish will go in my 36 from now on.

I also sometimes use ice mountain drinking water - I get it delivered. I add 1 5 gallon bottle every other week to my 36 gallon. I have ammonia from my tap and very high ph.

It isn't outrageous to get delivered. I would do the drinking water vs. distilled imho - but if you're mixing the two (tap and bottled) distilled is fine, though more expensive.

Good luck!

Janelle

 

[meloyelo]

Meloyelo~

I'm sorry but you made me laugh at the "not only am I killing fish but plants too".

Sorry... I hear ya'! It is SOOO hard for me to keep trates down too. I have tested my tap water and it is zero. It must be me. I change change change. Once all my danios died (sigh) and I am down to only 3 large fish in my 36 gallon, I'm able to keep them at 40ppm. Surprised. Filthy danios (uh... okay... not... really...)????

Anywho - I understand that the LEDs are not powerful enough for plants. I have the Hagen Glo system on order. I have the bulbs and the fixture should be in this week. (I'm a retailer of pet supples though so it is much cheaper for me).

I'm setting up a 72 gallon that is just now ready for fish. Vacuuming and waterchanging to get the trates down for fish add. I'm adding 2 from my 36 gallon (the gourami and angel) and only small fish will go in my 36 from now on.

I also sometimes use ice mountain drinking water - I get it delivered. I add 1 5 gallon bottle every other week to my 36 gallon. I have ammonia from my tap and very high ph.

It isn't outrageous to get delivered. I would do the drinking water vs. distilled imho - but if you're mixing the two (tap and bottled) distilled is fine, though more expensive.

Good luck!

Janelle

Yes, it does appear that I have the "brown thumb" of fish keeping.

I may have to redo the lighting on my tank so that I am able to keep some fast growing plants. Thanks for your input and help.

Meloyelo

 

[jmpgop]

I do too! it is a challenging hobby but I think that is why I like it. I hope to be able to go 6 months w/o killing a fish someday!

 

[boadams87]

I do too! it is a challenging hobby but I think that is why I like it. I hope to be able to go 6 months w/o killing a fish someday!

Its a piece of cake once it gets cycled.

 

[meloyelo]

Ended up ditching the LED's and redoing my canopy and lighting to a more "plant friendly" set up. Got several more Cobomba and some Water Wysteria. Hopefully if I can get things moving in a more favorable direction as far as Nitrates go. One question though, plants that are sold in bunches need to be separated and each one planted individually, correct? The bunches I got yesterday have a lead band around the bottom of the stems.

Thanks,
Meloyelo

 

[aqua_chem]

It depends on the plant. With wisteria I definitely would, and probably would with the Cabomba as well.