Multiple Tank Syndrome V3.0

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grendelcat

Aquarium Advice Newbie
Joined
Jun 19, 2006
Messages
5
I'm a newbie so pls excuse missing relevancy . . . but here's the thing.

I have a 35 Gallon and a 65 Gallon stocked thusly:

35 Gallon
2 Tiger Oscars
2 Green Terrors
1 Kissing Gourami
1 Choclolate Plec

(Believe it or not this tank has achieved equilibrium - in a sense that nobody kills anybody at this point . . .)

65 Gallon (Green Tank with multiple live plants)
13 Glo-Light Tetras
4 Black Phantom Tetras
3 Rainbow Sharks (Babies - yeah I know they can't all stay here)
1 Bala Shark (6 inches and counting . . .)
1 Dwarf Blue Gourami
2 Blue Danios
9 Guppies
4 Cory Cats
1 Albino African Clawed Frog
2 Dwarf Frogs (Still crazy after all this time . . . living with the African)
2 Myster Snails
1 Very old an brainskinned looking Pleco

So here's the question.

I know I need to expand my MTS. I need to split up this crew and have some decently stocked tanks. I also really would like to get some Barbs and possibly other Cichlids in the overall crew.

I'm getting ready to buy a 120+ Gallon tank and am considering possibilities about how to split this up among 3 tanks - also having at least 2 of the tanks. The idea being to have a safish tank that guppy fry might live in, a medium tank for barbish varieties plus maybe the African Clawed Frog and a War tank for Oscars, Green Terrors, Insanely evil Kissing Gourami's and a tuff enough pleco to deal with it.

I am open to suggestions involving new fish definitely. But mostly I'm looking for a sensible approach to splitting things out in a 3 tier tank system so that death and strife are minimized (Other than excess guppies taking the high road to meet the Terrors and Oscars)

All ideas welcome.
 
I got to tell you that IMO you are already way overstocked, and the two tiger oscars almost fill the 120 when they are mature. Maybe tank 1 needs to go to a 120+ alone.

And the 65...The Bala really shouldn't be flying solo as I believe they enjoy company and 65 is probably pushing it with more than 1.

I could be wrong as I said IMO so hopefully these other very knowledgable AA members will help you out.
 
35g is overstocked. each of those cichlids can grow more than 6"+. the 65g isnt overstocked, but you are at cap. adding a 120, i would put the existing 35g fish in there until they outgrow the tank.
 
The 35 gallon is way, way, way overstocked. You'll need more than one extra tank to put all those fish in. You'd probably need two 120 gallon tanks just to fit all the fish from the 35 gallon in comfortably.
 
Thank you all for the quick responses.

It does seem like the best plan is for the 120G to be for the Oscars, Terrors and the Kissing G. Could anything else join them there from the current 65 Gal crew?

Do you think the Bala currently at 6+ inches might be able to survive in the 120 with the Oscars and Terrors (Both pairs of Oscars and Terrors are at about 5 inches currently) - or is that a losing proposition - would the Bala just get eaten or go insane? He's actually pretty happy for the moment though I'm sure if I ever get a really big tank he'd like to have some others - I have heard that about them liking to be in packs of as much as 6 or more if possible. That's a LOTTA fish :)


I also was thinking that the 65 currently was at cap or beyond especially once the Bala gets bigger - unless I can bring some fish out of there into the soon-to-be empty 35.

I really want to try to seperate out the African Clawed from the 65 Gal since I am worried he'll munch some of the others in there pretty soon if he gets any bigger, so I was thinking of starting up the 35 maybe with him as King of the Hill, and then adding some medium-tough guys to keep him company.

What else would be able to hold it's own with the African Clawed Frog? Open to ideas from the current 65 to thin out that population or possibly bringing in other fish too - maybe Barb types (Once all the current fish are setup in the big, medium and smaller tanks from among the current group)

Also on the Rainbow Shark problem . . . At this point the only thing I can think of to do for the Rainbow sharks is to try one in each of the 3 tanks since they apparently don't much like their own species a whole lot (2 of the 3 are already going at it pretty much constantly, so in that case the question becomes - can one of the Rainbow Sharks live with the Oscars and Terrors once it gets bigger? (I'm also considering just taking one back since they were a surprise father's day gift and the pet store told my wife - "oh yeah they'll be fine together - all 3 of them!")
 
it was already stated that even with the 35g inhabitants occupying only the 125, it would still be overstocked.

take back some of the stock. all will be happier.
 
The Bala has to be moved to the 120 and needs to be in a shoal of at least three (preferably more) Balas.
As you seem to be aware Rainbow sharks should be alone or in a shoal of six or more and most people agree one is better due to aggressive tendencies.
The African Clawed frog will become aggressive as he ages and will likely make a meal of the smaller fish and frogs in your tank.
I agree with Mike that the two Oscars alone about fill the 120 gln. and (I don't have personal experience) but believe that the Green Terrors won't fit (temperamentally) with most of the other fish you have. You will want to do more research on them.
I suggest you Google all the fish you have and do a lot of research on each of them so you can decided which fish will work with which other fish and which fish are going to be too big or not "safe" to keep with others. It will be the best for both you and your fish if you give some back to your LFS now instead of waiting for disaster in the future. I know it's hard to hear everyone here tell you all of the above but believe me they are truly wanting what's best for you and your fish. Good luck with your decisions.
 
I'm not really seeing how just what's in the 35 would max out stock for a 120 Gallon tank. I know the inch per Gallon approach is iffy especially for fat fish like Oscars, but taking that as a starting point:

2 Tiger Oscars (Avg full size 12 Inches) = 24 Fishy Inches
2 Green Terrors (Avg full size 6 Inches) = 12 Fishy Inches
1 Kissing Gouramin (Avg full size 12 Inches) = 12 Fishy Inches
1 Chocolate Albino Plec (Full Size 12 Inches) = 12 Fishy Inches

That's a total of only of only 60 fishy inches max adult size in a 120 gallon tank. Can this really be overstocking?

What am I missing - is there some other computation you are using to determine that this is overstocking?
 
All those fishy inches are very bulky, messy, big-eatin' fishies. If you computed the same number of inches into, say, zebra danios, and then compared the feces and food debris generated by both, you'd (disgustedly) see the difference!

I've only been on this list for a short while, but if you want the best shot at happy and healthy tanks, listen to what members are saying; they're a smart, experienced bunch. :wink:
 
grendelcat said:
I'm not really seeing how just what's in the 35 would max out stock for a 120 Gallon tank. I know the inch per Gallon approach is iffy especially for fat fish like Oscars,

What am I missing - is there some other computation you are using to determine that this is overstocking?

you have to also factor in other things:
territory space needed
swimming room

think about this: say you have a 6 foot fish (just imagine for a second). that would mean it "SHOULD" still fit under the 1" per gallon rule in a 120. but think about a 6 foot fish swimming in a 120g tank. pretty rediculous, right? same principle applies.
 
Wow. I really do appreciate and am listening to this advice - just having a tough time getting used to the idea that this monster sized (at least related to the size of my household) 120 gallon tank I'm getting would only be big enough for 2 foot long fish.

I'd hate to have to return anybody - particularly the Oscars since my 3 year old absolutely loves the "Jumping Oscars" as he calls them. (They have a tendency to hop to the surface and smack their tails when I feed them and I would swear they are actually purposely trying to splash me when they do it, and of course the lad rolls on the floor with giggle fits each time)

I am also seriously considering for this new tank using a pump/overflow system to setup a large refugium in the basement (there I'd have room for a 200G - I've been pricing them at Glasscages and they are really quite reasonable). So what you've got me thinking here now is that if the main Oscar problem is the messyness and not so much a territorial thing, maybe I could get a little better stocking out of the 120 by also adding a sizeable refugium.

As for the 35, right now they all get along - but I know - they're just kids . . . and that may well change. I've read alot about each of them, but getting a feel for how specific fish will behave with other specific ones is a bit challenging. There seem to be a lot of conflicting opinions out there. Honestly the meanest fish in that group right now is the Kissing Gourami. It's only about 2/3 the size of the Oscars and it still goes after them like crazy when they get in her way.

Anyway on the refugium idea - assuming I do a big refugium too, would that current stock in the 35 be ok in a 120 gal circulating through a 200 gal refugium do you think or would that still be pushing it?
 
Another proplum your going to run into with the oscar's is that they will more then likly kill the greeen tororr's over time. oscars are real aggrassive and there space is there space. Then if you get a breding pr of oscars there's no end to the meanness in them. Then anything else in the tank is either lunch or beaten up to the point of having to hide to survie.
 
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