osmosis

[Guest]

another aspect of study is the use of salt in a fw aquarium, not only as a cure for ich but as a preventive measure as well. i have been reading mixed reviews on the use of salt and would like to gain a better understanding on the subject.

just reading the side of a carton of aquarium salt alone will claim certain benefits(of course they are trying to sell you salt), such as reduced stress, improved osmoregulation, and the speed-up of disease recovery. however, reading some posts will claim that salt is not needed and it is a waste of money while other posts will claim the opposite. even in the unhealthy fish section in the sticky on ichy, it says that salt can be used as a treatment for ich which kills the protozoan through osmosis, literaly dehydrating the cell immobilizing it and rendering it dead, which correct me if im wrong, but it is this same osmosis principal that kills a person if they are stranded in a lifeboat in the middle of the ocean and they drink saltwater because they are dying of thirst.

it also states in this sticky on ichy that contrary to popular belief, loaches and other scaless? (fish without scales) can live with and tolerate salt and this is something that i have seen personaly without any ill affects. and if salt can be used as a treatment for ich, i dont see why it cannot be used as a preventive measure as well to keep a tank healthy, which would not make it a waste of time or money. instead, it would save you hassles from dealing with unwanted protozoans like ich.

another matter is you should not use salt in a planted tank. why not? what happens if you add salt to a planted tank? is there any short or long term effects to plants in general? or only certain plants? i have used salt with plants before and really did not notice anything out of the ordinary. i did not get up the next day and find dead plants. they looked exactly the same as they did the day before so why shouldnt you use salt in a planted tank?

this brings me back to osmosis. i would think osmosis would affect plant tissues and cells and cause dehydration, but i never saw evidence of this unless it was so gradual that i simply thought something else happened. this would definatly qualify as long term damage but i do not know this for sure.

keeping salt levels below 1.002 specific gravity used to treat disease shouldnt hurt an aquarium including the plants but at the same time might help prevent nasty things from happening. if im wrong, please set me straight.

 

[Guest]

i'd be the wrong person to set you straight, everything I have read leads me to believe lightly salting the tank is beneficial, and i do. I agree with the belief that salt is a good prophalatic.

 

[coldmachineUK]

Yup, I'm in agreement with you both on this too and I keep loaches...
I don't salt my tanks as a preventative though, only when there is a problem (which includes stress among fish as well as ich) and the levels I use are very very small (around S.G. 1.001-1.002). I've found I only ever need to dose my tank once under these conditions.

 

[Jramatized]

Ive got a 55 gal and add salt every water change. Maybe 2-3 small handfulls. my fish are fine. Even when I had ghost shrimp they were fine. AS for plants I do believe it causes them to fall apart, or so it seemed with mine whenI had them. Leaves feel off pretty quick

 

[Fishyfanatic]

There is a difference between aquarium salt and the logic of being in the ocean and drinking salt water. In a saltwater environment (such as the ocean), MARINE salt is used. When you treat ich in a home aquarium, you use AQUARIUM salt. It is two totally different things and many people confuse the two. I am a believer that AQUARIUM salt has no benefits in a freshwater tank except when treated for diseases. I don't use it and do not even keep it on hand. I haven't had to treat ich in years but if I had to, I'd just use the heat method. Many plants can not handle salt, that is why it is not recommended to use it.

 

[coldmachineUK]

It would all depend on the levels of salt dosage tho (aquarium salt: I mean this in every post I make in freshwater topics about the use of salt!). At small doses, hardy plants would not suffer.
I have planted tanks, and none of them have had problems when I've upped the S.G. levels with aquarium salt. But, as I say, I only ever do this as a treatment and never as a preventative.

I think if it's tried and has worked for some people, it's worth giving it a go. Some people have obviously had success with using it, so it cannot be ruled out entirely as a possible method for tackling ich.

Some people use nothing but meds. Now in my humble opinion that is why we are seeing the increasing spates of 'super ich' out there which are resistant to medication. The 'quick fix' solution is not always the best.

 

[Jchillin]

I have read many articles and papers regarding the use of salt in FW. There are battle lines drawn and neither side will give in. Just try googling "Use of Aquarium Salt" and watch the hits fly!

What should be the deciding factor is: "Is it necessary for what I am doing?" I stopped using salt over two years ago. I have both a standard and a planted tank and have had no issues with ich or any other disease in that time.

 

[Guest]

the logic behind being in the ocean and drinking salt water is the basic principal of osmosis regardlis of the type of salt being used and the effect that salt has in it's natural state and has upon single cell organisms in regards to dehydration.

edit part:

so all types of salt cause osmosis and dehydration, marine, aquarium, table, etc.

 

[coldmachineUK]

There is a difference between types of salt though. They all obviously contain sodium chloride, but marine salt contains other mineral salts such as magnesium and calcium whereas 'aquarium salt' is generally a tonic and a more pure plain old sodium chloride. Marine salt will act as a pH buffer also, keeping water hard and alkaline.

If you wanted a 'brackish' water tank then you would need to use marine salt. If you want to treat for ich then you are best using aquarium salt.

This article is helpful and helps explain why tonic salt can be beneficial:
http://www.practicalfishkeeping.co.uk/pfk/pages/show_article.php?article_id=335

 

[QTOFFER]

The body of a FW fish is alot saltier than the water it swims in. The resulting osmotic pressure would cause the fish to swell up with water (think dropsy) if it weren't for the kidneys continuously pumping water out. Healthy fish don't have a problem dealing with osmotic pressure. However, stressed/sick fish - especially those with skin abrasions have to work extra hard to keep the water out.

At the miniscule amounts that we are talking about here, I can't see how it would harm most live plants.

I only use salt in my hospital tank when I'm medicating for scrapes. I've never tried using it for ich (heat alone always worked), but it would probably help the fish deal with the wounds caused by the ich.

Using salt as a preventative is a matter of personal preference. I don't use it simply because it's another thing that can be forgotten or overdosed. My tanks are stable, and I haven't had an unexplained death in months.

 

[Guest]

that is a good article coldmachineUK and i think everyone posting are making valid points. so maybe i am standing corrected to a degree as far as not using salt on a regular basis and this is a good thing, i am here to learn. but i do like the properties of salt and the things it can do for you and your aquarium pals when the need arises.