Spiking Ammonia Levels

[meegosh]

A lot of things I see wrong here... First, the cycle could not take 3 weeks, that is nearly impossible. Second, cycling requires some type of ammonia source (food, fish, pure ammonia) and it appears you didn't provide the bacteria with food. Basically you were testing tap water.. which is why you got "good" readings from the LFS, the only thing that should show up would be nitrates.

When you said you set it up 3 weeks ago and "let it run" was that just an empty tank?? No fish or ammonia? If yes, your tank is not cycled and you will NEED to do water changes daily until the cycle completes. Just letting the water run through the filter with no ammonia source is useless. The bacteria needs some sort of ammonia to grow.

I would get rid of the test strips and get an API freshwater test kit (liquid). It is far more accurate. If you get nitrites above .25ppm I would do water changes until it is below that level.

I would read up on the cycling process so you can better understand it for your other tank. Also, do water changes!!!!! The effects of having high levels of ammonia or nitrite is far worse than having them deal with a water change.

Read this

http://www.aquariumadvice.com/articles/articles/24/1/Nitrogen-Cycle-/Page1.html

 

[Fishkid]

Well, I definitely pulled a rookie mistake. I did not use a bacteria seed.

I went and had the water tested again and as expected the Nitrites and Ammonia were still very high. I have added a bacteria supplement, but he suggested I wait a few more days to do any more water changes and cut back to feeding every other day until the ammonia levels get down to zero.

My rookie mistake was thinking my brand new tank was the same as my older tank. Of course the old tank had good bacteria built up in the filter and the gravel as well as the walls and plants, so it kept everything in balance. The new tank could not do that and adding 6 fish in three weeks, plus over feeding cause this to happen. And as stated above, it had not really cycled at all, just wasted time and possibly fish/money.

I feel so stupid and bad for the fish. Just have to hope they make it through. I have ammonia detox and will use if I lose one, but I am going to wait as I don't like the roller coaster it puts them on once the detox wears off.

Does all of this sound about right?

 

[CaptainAhab]

You should be doing frequent testing, water changes and using the ammonia detox. The rollercoaster of which you speak is nothing compared to living in a continually (and ever increasing) toxic environment.

Your in for a long road, next the nitrite will climb markedly and they are even more toxic to fish than ammonia is. Testing/water changes/detox (recommend Prime) are what it's all about as long as you have fish in there. Possibly multiples a day.

BTW: Your LFS is doing you no favors here. Your ammonia isn't likely to be going to go down to 0 in the 'next few days' on its own. Since they have been such a 'help' here, why not ask them to take the fish back for credit and cycle the tank properly?

 

[meegosh]

Do not wait a few more days before doing water changes.... that is the worst advice your LFS could have given you. If those levels get too high your fish will suffer, whether it is short term or long term. Keep up on the changes!

 

[Fishkid]

So, I should do a fishless cycle?

 

[Fishkid]

Adding to my previous post. Are daily water changes enough or should I do twice per day?

Also, given that I have added a bacterial supplement now, will I be counter acting it with doing water changes?

 

[CaptainAhab]

Would be my recommendation. If you choose not to, as was said before, you have to test test test, PWC PWC PWC and detox when the test requires.. Lots of time and work while the fish suffer more than necessary

Bacteria supplements are crap (with few exceptions). You need to have a test kit and PWC when the levels are high

 

[Fishkid]

Just did a water change and then added the nitrite. I could care less on the time this takes. An obvious learning lesson and something I should have known better with more research, like coming here.

 

[meegosh]

What specifically are you talking about when you say "I have added a bacterial supplement"? I would most likely stop adding it and let nature take its course. Get a liquid test kit and test daily, and do water changes when ammonia or nitrites get above .25pmm. This is the only (safer) way to cycle with fish. Period.

 

[missileman]

If you really want to do it right and quick take your old filter media and a handfull of gravel from your other tank, (that is by far the best, active, live bacteria source you have) Put as much of the filter media as you can stuff in your new filter and either put the gravel directly in the bottom of your new tank or put in an old nylon if you want to take it back out after your tank has cycled.
With that live bacteria you already have you can get that tank cycled in under a week.

 

[Fishkid]

The bacteria supplement was suggested to help bacterial activity get a jump start. As Ahab said, properly just crap, but I got in a panic this morning when two water changes did not drop the levels significantly.

I have my test kit now and will continue to monitor, use the detox if necessary, feed sparingly and continue with daily water changes. Hopefully this does it over the next few weeks to a month and my fish survive.

It really is strange though, as they seem to be very happy, swimming fine and not stressed. I know it is early and will keep on it, but given the levels I thought I would see some issues by now.

 

[Fishkid]

missleman,

can I do that even if the other tank is a goldfish tank?

 

[missileman]

Sure, the bacteria is the same

 

[CaptainAhab]

Agreed, actually it's the best thing you could do. As much as you can, if you have more than the filter will hold.. ball it up, wrap it ina rubber band and throw it in. That's where a large amount ofl the good stuff your missing is located.

When I read your post, i assumed your goldfish were super small in a tank w/ a sponge filter. So much for reading comprehension

 

[Fishyfanatic]

What bacteria suppliment did you use? Not all are a waste but most are. I'm just curious what you used.

 

[Fishkid]

Top Fin Bacterial Supplement

 

[CaptainAhab]

K-wrap

 

[Fishkid]

Figured as much. Question about cycling with fish. Do people expect to lose their fish when cycling the first time or do they stand a chance? Just wondering the pros and cons of the two forms for my next tank and just in case the gouramis and mollies don't make it.

Also, would getting an airstone help them? I keep reading that laboring for oxygen can be a main contributor to them dying.

 

[meegosh]

Pros of a fishless:

Faster
No Water Changes
You don't kill/harm fish

Cons of Fishless:

Umm... have to wait for fish?

Pros of cycling w/ fish:

You add fish right way and that's about it!

Cons:

Longer Cycle due to...
Lots of water changes
Possible harm/death to fish
More work (testing, water changes, etc)

An air stone will help speed up the cycle slightly. If you don't have an air stone/pump handy I wouldn't rush out and buy one. I never used one but I did use a power head to add some air and chop up the surface when I cycled my 30g. Other things would be turning up the temp, speeds process up. I'm not sure the exact temp, I think somewhere in the low 80's.

Just buy a test kit, liquid. Test your water daily/twice a day. Do water changes daily or as needed to keep levels of ammonia and nitrite below .25ppm.

 

[CaptainAhab]

I'll answer you honestly then offer my opinion.

Yes you can successfully cycle with fish. It has been done for many many years. Some fish survive, some don't, some may be forever harmed from the process. Cycling with fish (assuming you care about the fish) is all about testing ALOT and doing water changes ALOT when the parms are high. When I say ALOT.. I mean at times multiple times a day.

IMO it's just cruel when there are other options available. You wouldn't put your dog/cat/child in an environment that was harmful to them when you knew doing so was harmful to them would you? I think of fish the same as my other pets. I am their steward and care taker.

An airstone can't hurt, could help. In the end it's the poison in the water that's the killer.