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Old 08-17-2006, 01:22 AM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by catfishface
now one sample will go in the freezer and another in the fridge for a week and we will see what is alive at the end.
I do hate to be pedantic... But I can't help myself 8O

How did you go catfishface???

Should this experiment be earmarked as success or failure
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Old 08-17-2006, 01:41 AM   #12
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swimmer, this is off topic, but i am guessing you are an avid swimmer? I swam the gauntlet (200 free, 500 free 200 free relay, 400 free relay) all thru high school and college =)
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Old 08-17-2006, 08:01 AM   #13
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the results are in

Quote:
Originally Posted by Swimmer32
Should this experiment be earmarked as success or failure :
hmmm, i will let you decide.

keep in mind, im only a layman and my house isnt exactly laboratory condidtions, but here goes.

the frozen sample was completely...dead. trying to replicate the tests exactly like i did before using plain media, then with red dye, i could not find any signs of life. the sample was thawed and back to room temp, but i could not find any organism moving at all. before i put this sample in the freezer, it was buzzing with activity, so freezing kills without a doubt.

now the refridgerated sample. i removed the sample after completely leaving it alone for one week without touching it or bothering in any way. under a plain slide, i could only find the whip like skinny worm organisms. they still seemed agitated by the light, but i think everything is.

with red dye, i found what appeared to be single cell organisms that like to go in circles along with the same skinny whip worms. the larger worm creatures with cilia must have died becuase i could not find them. it was my guess that these organisms that survived might have lived off of the ones that died and the ones that died probably ran out of their food source.

i thought about trying to isolate one of the single cell's and magnify it further, but this would be hard because they run from light and at high magnifications it would be like trying to find pluto in the milkyway, for me anyways.

i might be wrong, but maybe if you refridgerated media and kept it supplied with food sources, it's plausable that it could be stored. but as was suggested above, another tank might be a better option.
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Old 08-17-2006, 12:27 PM   #14
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The 2 factors that have to be supplied for these bacteria to grow are an adequate (but reduced due to temperature) food supply (ammonia), and oxygen. When you store a liquid, regardless of where, it becomes anaerobic in a set period of time (faster the warmer the liquid).

I've thought of ways to try to preserve media and most are not an option due to cost/equipment.

The best cheapest way I've come up with is to have a small bucket (or betta tank) with an air pump bubbling inside, and weekly dosing ammonia. You basically have the environment of a small tank, and if ever needed, based on your dosing of ammonia you would have an instantly cycled filter. This would be much better done in a dark refrigerator since the metabolism of the bacteria will slow down, but again not really feasible.

I still don't understand why LFS' do not have a 10-20 gallon sump tank that contains the filter inserts for filters they sell and when you purchase a new tank, or need a new filter offer at a slight premium the "conditioned" filter. The only thing I can come up with is that it would seriously lower the number of fish they sell....
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Old 08-17-2006, 01:23 PM   #15
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The only thing I can come up with is that it would seriously lower the number of fish they sell....
You have it right there. They don't teach fishless cycling or even acknowledge it as a valid method of cycling because if they did, then they would sell less fish. Instead they prey on amateurs to buy a tank and 5 to 10 fish in the same visit. Then when the fish die of ammonia poisoning, they expect to see them back to buy replacements.
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Old 08-17-2006, 06:33 PM   #16
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The 2 factors that have to be supplied for these bacteria to grow are an adequate (but reduced due to temperature) food supply (ammonia), and oxygen.
is this how they store bio spira? if i took a sample of bio spira and placed it under the microscope, what would i see?
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Old 08-17-2006, 09:10 PM   #17
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Most of the time, labs preserve specimens (for revival) using one form or another of flash-freezing. There isn't much that can survive a slow freeze. Your cell rupture thought was dead on. (pun intended?!?) Who's up for some LN2?
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Old 08-17-2006, 10:16 PM   #18
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swimmer, this is off topic, but i am guessing you are an avid swimmer? I swam the gauntlet (200 free, 500 free 200 free relay, 400 free relay) all thru high school and college =)
Nope... I'm like a cat when it comes to water...

Quote:
Originally Posted by catfishface
Quote:
Originally Posted by Swimmer32
Should this experiment be earmarked as success or failure :
hmmm, i will let you decide.
Didn't work that way I had hoped Really appreciate your time and effort though!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Alshain
Quote:
Originally Posted by 7Enigma
The only thing I can come up with is that it would seriously lower the number of fish they sell....
Instead they prey on amateurs to buy a tank and 5 to 10 fish in the same visit. Then when the fish die of ammonia poisoning, they expect to see them back to buy replacements.
Bingo!

That's why I gave up the hobby to begin with. This time around, I was more prepared and patient and tonenes and tonnes wiser. :mr green:
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