UGF connected to Cannister filter???

[jgc8fan]

I've had a freshwater aquarium for 15 years with the exception of the last four when I kept a marine aquarium. Failing to successfully maintain (after sinking several thousand $$$ in equipment) it I decided to go back to freshwater.

So now I've got a 40 [acronym:dca4444996="Gallon"]gal[/acronym:dca4444996] tank with power compact fluorescent lighting (120 Watts) with a Magnum 350 Bio-Pro cannister/Bio Wheel filter. What I'm noticing are the same problems I had with the marine setup seem to be coming back in fresh (uncontrollable green hair algae). I have algae eaters working overtime right now to get it under control.

I always had a [acronym:dca4444996="Under Gravel Filter"]UGF[/acronym:dca4444996] in my freshwater tanks, and never had algae problems... Matter of fact... When I first set up my marine tank I used a [acronym:dca4444996="Under Gravel Filter"]UGF[/acronym:dca4444996] for 6 months and the algae problem didn't develop there until I removed it (just a couple weeks after I removed it to be precise), so now that I'm back to freshwater I'm thinking of putting one back in, but I don't want lift tubes, and another electrical piece of equipment (air pump/powerhead). I had an idea about how to get around this and wondered if anyone else has tried it... I'm thinking of adapting a [acronym:dca4444996="Under Gravel Filter"]UGF[/acronym:dca4444996] to connect to the intake of the Magnum. It seems simple in theory, and the Magnum is powerful enough that it should keep the [acronym:dca4444996="Under Gravel Filter"]UGF[/acronym:dca4444996] plate fairly clean underneath while filtering out the garbage that I suspect is building up in the gravel. Yes... I know I should be vacuuming the gravel more often, but remembering my old setup with a [acronym:dca4444996="Under Gravel Filter"]UGF[/acronym:dca4444996] to a powerhead it never seemed to be a problem.

Anyway... Any opinions?

P.S. I know all of the [acronym:dca4444996="Under Gravel Filter"]UGF[/acronym:dca4444996] controversy already, but as I've had better results with one I choose to ignore it.

[FancyGuppyGuy]

I think it would work really good. And I might try it sometime because thats even more bio filter!!!!! awesome idea.

[jgc8fan]

Originally Posted by FancyGuppyGuy

I think it would work really good. And I might try it sometime because thats even more bio filter!!!!! awesome idea.

That's what I was thinking... A piece of hose from the gravel vac, and a barb fitting from the hardware store that would adapt the hose to the lift tube of the [acronym:513781d502="Under Gravel Filter"]UGF[/acronym:513781d502] (Either a perfecto or undertow with a one piece filter plate). I'm thinking it would improve circulation as it would pull water from the bottom of the tank rather than 6" from the bottom, and the filter plate would probably allow more flow (and less prone to clogging) than the intake strainer would. It would also pull the waste that comes through the plate right through the carbon as well, so more waste getting to the filtration.

Of course... I'm checking here because I figure if it's such a good idea then why haven't any of the manufacturers put one out. Wonder if there may be any issues that this might cause (improper flow to filter, circulation, etc...)

[czcz]

Great experiment. If you proceed I'm interested in your results. Maybe try a reverse [acronym:7627673514="Under Gravel Filter"]UGF[/acronym:7627673514], where output keeps detrius out of the substrate and free floating for canister intake.

[docrak]

I’ve been running a similar experiment in a 10 gallon tank. I have a under gravel filter that is operated by a Penguin [acronym:22892b664a="Hang On Back"]HOB[/acronym:22892b664a] without a bio-wheel. I’ve had this setup running now for about a year. I get almost no algae, in fact I’ve only started to get some recently because some of my co-workers have been accidentally overfeeding the fish. The really weird part is that with only 8 1� fish in the tank it takes 3 month for the nitrates to get over 40ppm. We practically never have to clean the tank.

Now that being said I had a 29 gallon I was running with a under gravel filter with 2 power heads that provided 300 per hour gallons of flow. That under gravel filter was so dirty and hard to maintain, mostly because the bio-load on the tank was very high. I even had two auxiliary [acronym:22892b664a="Hang On Back"]HOB[/acronym:22892b664a] filters and that tank was always dirty and hard to maintain.

I switched the 29 for a 40 tall and took out the [acronym:22892b664a="Under Gravel Filter"]UGF[/acronym:22892b664a] and put in plants. I put in a Ehiem canister filter (2026). I now use it as my sail fin mollie breeding tank. The bio-load is down significantly. I also have 7 ottos in there for algae control. The only algae I get is those little green spots that you can’t do anything about.

My point is I don’t think you have a problem with filtration as much a bio-load and feeding. You’ve got the same light setup I do on my 40 tall planted tank, are you going to put live plants in your new tank? If not you may have too much light. Another question is how may fish to you have and what kind? How often do you feed your fish and how much? I think these factors will control algae more than your filter setup.

I was also having an algae problem in my 40 until I reduced how much I fed my fish. I realized that the uneaten food was causing excess phosphates which caused algae to grow quicker than the pants could control the excess nutrients. I’ve found controlling algae is a matter of balance more than any kind of magic setup. My 60 gallon with 36 watts of light never has any algae. Now granted I have 9 plecos in there, not all of then eat algae, and several adult sail fin mollies. Once again it’s just a matter of balance, the right fish, the right food, feeding the right amount and the right amount of light.

[malkore]

You have algae because you have a ton of light, and a nutrient imbalance. And I see no mention of plants.

I'd suggest getting a [acronym:8867da4112="Carbon dioxide"]CO2[/acronym:8867da4112] system, and adding plants, and starting to watch your nitrate and phosphate levels, dosing fertilizers when necessary.
A [acronym:8867da4112="Under Gravel Filter"]UGF[/acronym:8867da4112] isn't going to change anything if you keep your current lighting system...you'll still have enough light ot fuel algae, and no plants to compete for the nutrients that the algae is thriving on.

[BrianNY]

I agree completely with malkore. No filter is going to remove the nutrients in the water column (except plants), and that won't work without a substantial amount of [acronym:133cd2e644="Carbon dioxide"]CO2[/acronym:133cd2e644] to help the plants. Throwing that much light in the tank is a creating an algae factory.

A simple and cost effective solution is to replace your current light with a 1wpg strip light.

[FancyGuppyGuy]

back to the topic at hand great idea!!! And I have never had a problem with any [acronym:6180e9c3f6="Under Gravel Filter"]UGF[/acronym:6180e9c3f6] ive ever had.

I think either flow will work. All depends on what you want.

[docrak]

Originally Posted by BrianNY

I agree completely with malkore. No filter is going to remove the nutrients in the water column (except plants), and that won't work without a substantial amount of [acronym:9e9da82b9c="Carbon dioxide"]CO2[/acronym:9e9da82b9c] to help the plants. Throwing that much light in the tank is a creating an algae factory.

A simple and cost effective solution is to replace your current light with a 1wpg strip light.

Yah, that's what I was trying to saw. I agree with both you guys.

[TomK2]

here's another consideration, I thought the outflow strainer for a filter was supposed to be 6 inches from the bottom so that if the filter ever leaked, it could not siphon or suction all the water out of the tank. There would always be 6 inches left to keep the fish alive till you discovered it. If your external filter sucks from the bottom, a leak could suck it dry? Just a thought. I never had a malfunction like that.