Wild Caught V Tank bred

[Ricky 1]

Do you think it is ok to take a wild fish from a river and put it in a tank, or, now that most are tank bred why have wild caught, my question is, how many of you have wild caught fish..........or had them, and why?

 

[Delapool]

If the freshwater laws permit I'm ok with doing it. Used to catch gudgeon, small rainbow fish and crayfish to keep in a tank. Also perch but thinking back they were really too large for the tank I had.

Edit - at the time when I did keep them, it was mainly because I had no funds.

 

[Luananeko]

I think catching wild fish is fine as long as the fish is not endangered in it's habitat, and so long as the catching is done humanely. Note: species that do not have a good survival rate between being caught and going home with someone don't fall under the "humane" category for me.

Even fish that are widely captive bred can benefit from being crossed back with wild specimens, so as long as it's not hurting the wild group, it's still beneficial to collect more. Many fish species would have gone completely extinct had they not been caught for aquarium trade and bred. Having a thriving and genetically strong captive population helps ensure that species can survive when the wild population has problems.

 

[dalto]

Unless they are endangered I typically prefer wild caught fish.

Here's why:
- While there are exceptions, they tend to be more hardy than their mass-produced brethren
- Many fish lose their defining characteristics though generations of captive breeding
- Behavior in wild caught fish is often different than captive bred specimens
- Many fish are not captive bred and so wild caught are the only option

As a side note, I truly doubt that people realize how many of the fish in their local stores are wild caught. For example, during parts of the year, it is far less expensive to import wild caught tetras than the farm raised variety if the store cares about quality stock. A huge portion of catfish are still wild-caught. Last I checked, all clown loaches were wild caught, etc...

 

[Luananeko]

Unless they are endangered I typically prefer wild caught fish.

Here's why:
- While there are exceptions, they tend to be more hardy than their mass-produced brethren
- Many fish lose their defining characteristics though generations of captive breeding
- Behavior in wild caught fish is often different than captive bred specimens
- Many fish are not captive bred and so wild caught are the only option

As a side note, I truly doubt that people realize how many of the fish in their local stores are wild caught. For example, during parts of the year, it is far less expensive to import wild caught tetras than the farm raised variety if the store cares about quality stock. A huge portion of catfish are still wild-caught. Last I checked, all clown loaches were wild caught, etc...

I think it depends on the species on whether they're more hardy wild caught vs tank bred. Cardinal tetras tend to be much more adaptive and hardy when tank bred in my experience. Wild caught fish have trouble adapting to water parameters that don't fall in the range of what they're used to in their natural habitat. Tank bred also tend to be more used to tolerating tank mates than their wild brethren because the wild ones are used to having far larger territories. There's pros and cons to both types depending on your situation and how you plan on keeping them.

 

[dalto]

I think it depends on the species on whether they're more hardy wild caught vs tank bred. Cardinal tetras tend to be much more adaptive and hardy when tank bred in my experience. Wild caught fish have trouble adapting to water parameters that don't fall in the range of what they're used to in their natural habitat.

Cardinal tetras are actually a great example. If you are planning to keep them in conditions far removed from their natural habitat such as hard water than captive bred fish raised in hard or even moderately hard water will be better for you. However, if you are planning to keep them in water aligned with their natural habitat than the wild caught fish will have far lower mortality rates in my experience.

There's pros and cons to both types depending on your situation and how you plan on keeping them.

I can certainly agree with that

 

[bettaowner]

From an ethical standpoint I suppose it is ok to collect certain fish from the wild in a sustainable manner. I live in Hawaii and many of our tangs and wrasses are mass collected for the hobby. I'm in favor of wild caught freshwater fish as long as there's a limit as to when to stop.

 

[Andy Sager]

Do you think it is ok to take a wild fish from a river and put it in a tank, or, now that most are tank bred why have wild caught, my question is, how many of you have wild caught fish..........or had them, and why?

When I first got started keeping fish, wild fish were more common because there were very few that were being commercially bred so there was little choice. I believe this made us, back then, better aquarists because in order to have these fish survive, we needed to know how they lived in the wild and had to duplicate those conditions.
As a breeder myself, I know that it is important to re-introduce wild genes back into lines in order to correct genetic flaws that happen from generational inbreeding. Too much of that decreases the vitality of the line. So having wild fish is important for line survival.
"Is it okay to take fish from a river and put it in a tank?" For some species, it's a good thing that happened. Take the red tail shark for example. From what I've read, wild stocks have plummeted and the fish is almost extinct in the wild. Same for a number of new fish that came from the old country Burma. The hobby may have caused the depletion of the specie in it's natural habitat but can also save it from extinction. Keep in mind that habitat destruction will cause more extinctions than overfishing will. If there is no place for the fish to live, being wild doesn't help them. I believe this is the case for many wild rainbowfish.
Having said all this however, you have to realize that most fish sold in shops are man made and not found in nature. For example, only Silver Angelfish are found in the wild but look how many varieties there are of this fish. Same with Swordtails and Mollies and Guppies. Only one color ( 2 for Mollies) exists in the wild yet how many different colors are found in the stores. Another example is in the Gourami Family. Blue (3 spot) gouramis are natural but Golds, Opalines & Lavenders are all man made color morphs of the blue and not found in nature. Same with Dwarf Gouramis. Neons, Sunsets, Flames, Powder Blues are all non natural colors of the fish and not found in the wild. And we should bring up bettas here as well. Maybe 1/2 of 1% have any similarities to their wild ancestors. However, if wild ones were not taken and kept in tanks, these other fish wouldn't exist. And this is a very short list of non wild fish that we keep today.

There is a line however (IMO), that mustn't be crossed when it comes to taking wild stock. Sustainable harvesting must be done and not generalized harvesting. A strong breeding population must be left alone to continue the specie's survival. This is what's been found in collecting cardinal tetras in the wild. In a recent documentary I saw ( I forget if it was on TV or Youtube) the collectors of cardinals manage multiple pools where these wild fish are found. Fish are collected from pools up to the point where the remaining fish can still repopulate the pools. No further harvesting happens until the population has rebounded. So these are wild fish in natural pools that are man managed and still thriving. Neon Tetras are mostly tank bred as they have not been as well managed in the wild. I believe I read that only 5% of neons in the trade in America are wild stock and these are mostly green neons.

So is it okay to collect wild fish and keep them in tanks? I believe it is if the collector is collection friendly, the hobbyist is a concerned hobbyist trying to learn about their fishes and keep them in the best conditions possible and the specie can survive with the depletion of those collected. I also believe that it's necessary as well that fish ( as well as other animals) be selectively collected in order for us to better learn how to properly care for them in the wild while we humans seem to overtake their habitat in a seemingly limitless way.

That's my take on the subject

 

[Masha]

There's also the problem of tank decor and substrate, live rock, coral and so on, being harvested from the natural environment.

Wild caught fish is one of the reasons I hesitate to get into salt water tanks. I don't have a problem with public aquariums, who do research and education, having wild caught fish, but I'm not sure if I can justify it for myself.

It makes me uneasy that there is an industry built around this hobby. That is hypocritical of me, as I benefit from it as a consumer.

Sent from my GT-I9190 using Aquarium Advice mobile app

 

[Ricky 1]

Very interesting read.........

 

[Brookster123]

Andy... never ceases to amaze.. I feel smarter having read that post, I'm going to celebrate with eggs and bacon!

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G900A using Aquarium Advice mobile app

 

[Delapool]

Andy... never ceases to amaze.. I feel smarter having read that post, I'm going to celebrate with eggs and bacon!

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G900A using Aquarium Advice mobile app

Lol lol lol

 

[Luananeko]

There's also the problem of tank decor and substrate, live rock, coral and so on, being harvested from the natural environment.

Wild caught fish is one of the reasons I hesitate to get into salt water tanks. I don't have a problem with public aquariums, who do research and education, having wild caught fish, but I'm not sure if I can justify it for myself.

It makes me uneasy that there is an industry built around this hobby. That is hypocritical of me, as I benefit from it as a consumer.

Sent from my GT-I9190 using Aquarium Advice mobile app

That's why they have aquacultured corals and live rock now. There's quite a few SW fish that have been captive bred as well. There's been a lot of great strides towards making the saltwater tanks have less of an impact on the wild populations of coral, fish, rock, and substrate.

 

[dalto]

There's also the problem of tank decor and substrate, live rock, coral and so on, being harvested from the natural environment.

Wild caught fish is one of the reasons I hesitate to get into salt water tanks. I don't have a problem with public aquariums, who do research and education, having wild caught fish, but I'm not sure if I can justify it for myself.

It makes me uneasy that there is an industry built around this hobby. That is hypocritical of me, as I benefit from it as a consumer.

Marine is a whole different answer for me.I don't really have a working knowledge of what needs to be considered there.

The original question was around fish removed from rivers and the reality is that there are only a handful of riverine fishes that are overfished. The danger to the worlds riverine fish is primarily caused by habitat destruction.

 

[Mebbid]

The danger to the worlds riverine fish is primarily caused by habitat destruction.

As is the danger to anything related to wildlife. The wild collection of coral, fish, inverts, and whatnot doesn't come close to the destruction brought on by other sources. The big difference is that there aren't any big lobbyists for the aquarium trade like there is for tourism, fishing, oil drilling, water sports, polluting companies, and a dozen other things; so aquarists are getting picked on for what happens to the wildlife.

 

[jetajockey]

I'm fine with it. I do it, myself, in a long term effort to popularize native fish species in the trade. But I agree completely with the sustainability aspect. It's not a bad idea to have a practice that involves returning some of your harvested stock back to the point of capture at the end of your sampling session.

As for tank raised vs wild caught, I have seen with many species that feeding tends to be far less difficult in captive bred fish. Also, captive bred fish have already spent a lot of time looking at humans through the glass, so they quickly catch on to the human = food connection (rather than human = fear), if they don't have it already from their time being raised.

 

[Ricky 1]

Good point jet.....

 

[Andy Sager]

Andy... never ceases to amaze.. I feel smarter having read that post, I'm going to celebrate with eggs and bacon!

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G900A using Aquarium Advice mobile app

I sure hope those eggs came from cage free chickens and the bacon from free range pigs!

 

[Andy Sager]

I'm fine with it. I do it, myself, in a long term effort to popularize native fish species in the trade. But I agree completely with the sustainability aspect. It's not a bad idea to have a practice that involves returning some of your harvested stock back to the point of capture at the end of your sampling session.

As for tank raised vs wild caught, I have seen with many species that feeding tends to be far less difficult in captive bred fish. Also, captive bred fish have already spent a lot of time looking at humans through the glass, so they quickly catch on to the human = food connection (rather than human = fear), if they don't have it already from their time being raised.

You raise a couple of good points. In fact, the whole issue of returning fish to their natural habitat after being in a fish tank was the topic of discussion, many moons ago, at aquariums clubs I belonged to and the department of the fisheries frowned upon doing this as it was a concern that diseases not normally found in the native water COULD be transported to the habitat from aquarium fish not found in the location. The issue was that in an aquarium, there would need to be only fish from a particular location to ever have been in the tank ( which no one could reliably confirm) and since it would rely solely on ones " word of truth", it was not an acceptable answer so returning fish was a no no. You could argue that it's a money issue for the state run hatcheries but I doubt that's the case as these normally are underfunded and not a profitable enterprise in many places. So before anyone takes fish to return to the water, check with your local fisheries dept.

As for ease of feeding tank raised, yes that was always an issue when we were dealing with wild fish "Back in the day". Many a Discus and knife fish, etc. starved because the "right" food was not offered. With tank bred fish, they are already used to the prepared foods ( almost instinctively.) Great strides have been made in the fish food industry so it s a lot easier to find a food that will be accepted by a wild caught fish but the hobbyist needs to be prepared to possibly need to try a few different foods to find just the right one. So there's a plus for tank raised fish for sure


( Brookster, you feel any smarter now?? JK, just having some fun with ya. )

 

[jetajockey]

I actually meant that at the end of a sampling (collection) session out in the wild, to return a portion of the caught fish back to the body of water they were collected from. It's a sustainability practice that is thankfully getting more popular with regular collectors.

On that note, getting ready to spend a few hours in the swamp tomorrow to see what I can drag up.