Wow they can't be serious

[PassengerTN]

Yep. Taiwan, HK, and other Asian countries seem to love sb & balloon variety of fish. There are quite a few on MFK.

Jesse

 

[Dallascowboys16]

I just googled it, it's horrible.
Here's a stubby Asian aro

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I honestly think that in terms of creating fish outside of their natural form (Ballon versions, long fin, etc.) by far the worst offense is intentional hybridization. Flower horns, blood parrots, and red Texas cichlids are commonly sold hybrid CA cichlids that muddy gene pools of wild type versions of their parents in captivity. It is ask becoming increasingly hard for hobbyists to locate true un-hybridized versions of many fish nowadays. While a ballon version of a fish or a long fin version of a fish that struggles to swim are bad in and of themselves they do not pose a threat to the survival of their species. Hybrid fish do in some way or another threaten their wild counterparts. For these reasons I believe that more attention should go towards the persecution of intentional hybridization instead of the creation of Ballon, Dyed, Unnatural forms of fish even though I find these practices rather unethical as well. While many of us here would never own a dyed/tattooed fish many people here embrace the intentional hybridization of fish and support the practice by purchasing and maintaining these man made fish. Ill get off my soapbox now.

 

[mikem691]

I just googled it, it's horrible.
Here's a stubby Asian aro

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Unreal!

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[TMRC Exotics]

I honestly think that in terms of creating fish outside of their natural form (Ballon versions, long fin, etc.) by far the worst offense is intentional hybridization. Flower horns, blood parrots, and red Texas cichlids are commonly sold hybrid CA cichlids that muddy gene pools of wild type versions of their parents in captivity. It is ask becoming increasingly hard for hobbyists to locate true un-hybridized versions of many fish nowadays. While a ballon version of a fish or a long fin version of a fish that struggles to swim are bad in and of themselves they do not pose a threat to the survival of their species. Hybrid fish do in some way or another threaten their wild counterparts. For these reasons I believe that more attention should go towards the persecution of intentional hybridization instead of the creation of Ballon, Dyed, Unnatural forms of fish even though I find these practices rather unethical as well. While many of us here would never own a dyed/tattooed fish many people here embrace the intentional hybridization of fish and support the practice by purchasing and maintaining these man made fish. Ill get off my soapbox now.

Really? Its worse to breed fish that form healthy hybrids than to breed odd shaped monsters that can barely swim? Get off the hybrid bandwagon and realize that any form of breeding that creates these monstrosities is wrong!

 

[RedDevil83]

Is there such thing as wild hybrids?

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[Dallascowboys16]

Really? Its worse to breed fish that form healthy hybrids than to breed odd shaped monsters that can barely swim? Get off the hybrid bandwagon and realize that any form of breeding that creates these monstrosities is wrong!

Yes, breeding ballon versions of fish who are physically deformed is wrong and should stop. But I believe that it is worse to breed hybrid cichlids for several reasons. Blood parrots usually can't close their mouths and have very oddly shared bodies and often are afflicted by physical deformities. Just about the same as that Arowana (Horrible by the way ) but to add insult to injury hybrids are a threat to the survival of many cichlid species who are not only becoming increasingly rare in the wild but are only maintained in their pure form by very few responsible hobbyists. Causing the gene pool to become a giant blob of several different species is threatening the survival of many cichlid species who are endangered in the natural habitat as their aquarium kept counter parts are crossed with other species causing the pure form of the species to go extinct, both in captivity and potentially in the wild. I'm sorry but you cannot call yourself a real, informed aquarist if you support intentional hybridization. Not only does it sometimes create deformed physically feeble fish but it also threatens to doom many species who rely on aquarists to keep them alive albeit in captivity. I don't want to fight over this. I am done talking about it on this thread. If you want to continue this conversation PM me.

Is there such thing as wild hybrids?
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No, occasionally fish can naturally hybridize but it is very rare.

 

[TMRC Exotics]

Yes, breeding ballon versions of fish who are physically deformed is wrong and should stop. But I believe that it is worse to breed hybrid cichlids for several reasons. Blood parrots usually can't close their mouths and have very oddly shared bodies and often are afflicted by physical deformities. Just about the same as that Arowana (Horrible by the way ) but to add insult to injury hybrids are a threat to the survival of many cichlid species who are not only becoming increasingly rare in the wild but are only maintained in their pure form by very few responsible hobbyists. Causing the gene pool to become a giant blob of several different species is threatening the survival of many cichlid species who are endangered in the natural habitat as their aquarium kept counter parts are crossed with other species causing the pure form of the species to go extinct, both in captivity and potentially in the wild. I'm sorry but you cannot call yourself a real, informed aquarist if you support intentional hybridization. Not only does it sometimes create deformed physically feeble fish but it also threatens to doom many species who rely on aquarists to keep them alive albeit in captivity. I don't want to fight over this. I am done talking about it on this thread. If you want to continue this conversation PM me.



No, occasionally fish can naturally hybridize but it is very rare.

There typically are variations present in hybrids that identify them, only two come to mind as a threat to a gene pool with unidentifiable hybrids(though a few more may exist). Personally I think crosses that result in fish that are incapable of living normal lives as more cruel. I understand the hybrid debate but I kept a healthy happy flowerhorn that had no idea it was hybridized. On the other hand most balloon species lack some control in their movements and bob like well, bloated balloons. I get your standpoint but disagree with what is allowed as the final result. I have less problem with a normal flowerhorn or parrot than a mutated ram.

 

[Gillie]

Is there such thing as wild hybrids?

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If they find a population of natural hybrids, like redtail/tiger shovelnose cats, they will likely at some point be classified as a new species, just because of the unlikely occurrence and that it is a productive population. Don't forget, many wild cichlids now were likely once the product of natural crosses.

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[RedDevil83]

That's why people are fascinated by hybrids, it's a product of what could be...

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[Gillie]

That's why people are fascinated by hybrids, it's a product of what could be...

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Not necessarily, a lot of hybrids are the crossing of species that would never run into each other in the wild.

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[Castillo]

Did you say anything to those selfish store owners?

I know life can be hard and especially in the fish store space. However, why even bother if you are going to abuse the very thing that that made you want to own a fish store in the first place!


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[RedDevil83]

Not necessarily, a lot of hybrids are the crossing of species that would never run into each other in the wild.

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That's what I'm getting at is that's why some people are fascinated by hybrids, not for me anymore, I used to have red devil flower horn hybrids and they might as well have been piranhas destroying everything, I respect pure breds even more now than I ever have.

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[LayzorBeams]

Ive debated about hybrids before, but i feel that its fine to buy, sell, and breed them as long as they are marketed truthfully and sold to intelligent people... As I've said before, if people want a for-sure pure fish, they usually don't just go to the LFS to get one. So even if these fish aren't marketed properly, they will only hurt other fish that are known to be pure by stupid people who will go and buy a fish that is usually a higher price and a known pure-bred, and breed it with a fish that is more than likely a hybrid...

Not sure if that makes sense? Thats my opinion on it, if anyone understands that mess of words i just created.


If money cant buy happiness, that why do I need a job? I mean, I should be getting these fish free, since I don't have to pay for happy...

 

[RedDevil83]

I understand that and agree

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[Dallascowboys16]

Ive debated about hybrids before, but i feel that its fine to buy, sell, and breed them as long as they are marketed truthfully and sold to intelligent people... As I've said before, if people want a for-sure pure fish, they usually don't just go to the LFS to get one. So even if these fish aren't marketed properly, they will only hurt other fish that are known to be pure by stupid people who will go and buy a fish that is usually a higher price and a known pure-bred, and breed it with a fish that is more than likely a hybrid...

Not sure if that makes sense? Thats my opinion on it, if anyone understands that mess of words i just created.


If money cant buy happiness, that why do I need a job? I mean, I should be getting these fish free, since I don't have to pay for happy...

That's fair. My problem is that it just puts more hybrids out there that may eventually mix with untouched genetic lines.

 

[Ricky 1]

Are we all doing wrong even keeping fish in a glass cage that
doesn't resemble anything like their proper freedom, and so it goes on and on.......so what the heck do we do, we are in the sh## anyway......

 

[Gillie]

Keeping a fish properly in a comfortable enclosed environment is on the complete opposite end of the spectrum from injection with harmful dyes and breeding deformities and most fish have never seen the wild so I'm not quite sure where you're trying to go with this.

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[Ricky 1]

Sorry I'm going off topic again..........umph!!

 

[Dallascowboys16]

Are we all doing wrong even keeping fish in a glass cage that
doesn't resemble anything like their proper freedom, and so it goes on and on.......so what the heck do we do, we are in the sh## anyway......

I promise you that in a properly sized tank with adequate care most fish can live a 100% normal healthy life. Notice that I said most. Some fish are just better off left in the wild but the vast majority of fish can life perfect lives in aquaria. I used to think like you did. But after thinking more I came to the conclusion that there is nothing wrong with keeping fish in aquariums under a few circumstances:
#1) Keeping a certain fish in a tank is not harming the wild population significantly.
#2) The tank is large enough for the fish to exhibit somewhat natural behavior.
#3) The fish is offered a proper diet and care.

Under these few rules you can usually tell if a fish is going to live a good life in an aquarium. But I get were you are getting at. There have been several threads about the ethics of the hobby that have reached 20-30 pages of replies.

 

[ImACoolguy]

I promise you that in a properly sized tank with adequate care most fish can live a 100% normal healthy life. Notice that I said most. Some fish are just better off left in the wild but the vast majority of fish can life perfect lives in aquaria. I used to think like you did. But after thinking more I came to the conclusion that there is nothing wrong with keeping fish in aquariums under a few circumstances:

#1) Keeping a certain fish in a tank is not harming the wild population significantly.

#2) The tank is large enough for the fish to exhibit somewhat natural behavior.

#3) The fish is offered a proper diet and care.



Under these few rules you can usually tell if a fish is going to live a good life in an aquarium. But I get were you are getting at. There have been several threads about the ethics of the hobby that have reached 20-30 pages of replies.

I agree with this. I mean if we are having fish breed in captivity obviously we are doing something right..

Let's keep this civilized before the mods have to do a cleanup


Caleb