Yet another stocking question, just want opinions :)

[Kilgore]

I currently have 33 fishes in a way overstocked 25 gallon which I plan to upgrade to a 46 gallon bowfront as soon as I can convince my mother to spend two hours driving it up.

After I move them and let things settle for a few weeks, I plan to add some more fishies. Now, I can't add everything I want, so I need your help. Assume at least biweekly water changes (weekly if I am not out of town). Also, this will be a heavily planted tank.

Personally, I think the "1 inch of fish per gallon or six square inches" or whatever it is is rather conservative when it comes to smaller, less messy species like neons and hatchets. So how large of a tank would I realistically need to house these fish? To match the general rule, it would have to be a 94 gallon tank. That seems utterly ridiculous given these fishes. What are your thoughts?

So here is my ultimate fishy wish list (for one community, anyway):

12 Neon tetras
6 Marbled hatchets
6 Zebra danios
6 Sterbai cory Cats
6 Otocinclus
4 Black phantom tetras
4 Dwarf chain loaches
3 Appistogramma vjieta (1 male, 2 females)
2 German blue rams (pair)
2 Pearl gouramies (pair) - unless these will kill my hatchets?

Now, thats a total of 51 fish, most stay under 2 inches long. The total fish length will be about 94 inches when all occupants are fully grown, if I am not mistaken. So how large a tank would I need to comfortably house this community? What if I want to add some cherry barbs? I can't wait to hear the results...

 

[MiamiFishy]

Wow, that's a lot of fish!

I'm still kind of new to the hobby, but with that new tank your planing to get, I'll say just make sure you have a really good filtering system to handle ALL the bio-load your 33 fish produce and keep and eye on your water quality and keep up the PWC.
Im setting up a 29 gal this weekend and got a Penguin 350b power filter for it, its rated for tanks up to 75 gal, so it should keep up with my mear 9 fish, oooppps, forgot the fry ... 24 fish total !... : )

 

[Guest]

be warned... it may be able to be done but with that much stocking a system can be very very easily upset. One dead fish can cause a massacre.. i learned the hard way.

You would need at least a 55 gallon to succeed with that stocking.

See this post:
http://www.aquariumadvice.com/viewtopic.php?t=72977

 

[bosk1]

Yeah, that's a lot of fish. Although the 1"-per-gallon guideline can more easily be stretched with smaller fish, that really is too many fish for a 46, in my opinion. Aside from the guideline, let's take a look at each level of tank:

Top: 6 hatchets; 2 pearl gouramis. A little crowded for a 46, but probably not too bad as long as the middle isn't too crowded. However, in this case, the middle is crowded.

Middle: 12 neons, 6 danios, 4 black phantoms. Fairly crowded. These are all mostly schooling fish, and that's 3 separate schools at about the same tank depth. I would not crowd these fish that much in such a small tank. And remember, these fish will be only inches away from your top and your lower-middle fish.

Lower middle: 3 apistos, and 2 blue rams. Okay in and of itself, but you will have major crowding issues with your middle and bottom fish. Due to their temperment, I think these five fish will feel very crowded and stressed.

Bottom: 6 cories, 6 ottos, 4 loaches. The bottom of your tank is going to be very busy.


What I would do: Primarily, I would scrap the idea of 10-12 of your middle-dwellers. I would either get rid of the neons, OR the danios and black phantoms. Because of the termperment of the pearl gouramis and your lower-mid fish, if it were me, I would get rid of the latter since danios are so active.

Next, I would probably strike one of your bottom groups. The cories and ottos together would make a great cleanup crew, so I would probably strike the loaches if it were me.

Optimally, the top is still a bit crowded, and best practices might dictate either getting rid of the hatchets OR the gouramis, but you should be able to get away with keeping both groups if you really wanted to.

That's my suggestion. Good luck.

 

[DepotFish]

These fish can survive in this tank. But a dog can survive being house in a cage that has an inch of extra room on each side. And a human can survive in a cage. So long as they get food, water and breathable air (and chemical free water for tanks) anything can survive. But it doesn't make it ok to house them like this.
You've got too many bottom dwellers and schools of little fish for comfort in this tank.

 

[Kilgore]

Ok, I am really sorry and I should have been more clear. I don't intend to keep all those fish in my 46 gallon. I am going to start with the 33 I already have and add just a few more - like the rams and appistos. Right now I have the neons, hatchets, zebra danios, cories and otos. I wanted the Pearls but only if they won't disturb my hatchets, and I wanted the loaches for snail eating purposes.

I agree that keeping that number of fishes in a 46 gallon would be cruel and unusual punishment. But I would like to keep all of those fish at some point in the future so I was wondering how large my next upgrade would have to be, and which ones I coould comfortably add now. AshleyNicole suggested at least a 55 gallon for these fish. Is that the consensus?

I think most people would agree that a 90 gallon is not called for, correct?

BTW, thanks for all your input.

 

[Guest]

did you read the post about my 10 gallon at all?? even with a 55 gallon you are on thin ice as far as water quality.

 

[bosk1]

For that many, I would go with at least a 75.

As far as compatibility, I don't really see any issues, but I'm not 100% certain on the temperment of apistos and that particular type of loach. The gouramis should not bother the hatchets, in general. However, if you get a male/female pair, and they get ready to spawn, you may see some aggression toward other surface dwellers since gouramis are bubble nest builders.

Again, given the temperments of the gouramis and rams, danios are probably not the best choice, since they constantly dart around. But if the tank is big enough, you will probably be okay if you really want to do that.

 

[trotty]

From my experience i've found that the smaller fish actually produce more amonia per inch!
Make sure you have enough air and filtration and i suppose you can do anything. I know of a person that has a weir the same size as the tank, and has no problems overstocking.

Ther will still be competition for space, and you can never tell the temperment of a new fish!

 

[greenmaji]

Unless you have some plans about making this tank an open system that changes 80%-100% of the water in your tank daily for you; I dont think this stocking plan is near an option for you without serious problems.

 

[Kilgore]

Unless you have some plans about making this tank an open system that changes 80%-100% of the water in your tank daily for you; I dont think this stocking plan is near an option for you without serious problems.

Perhaps I need to re-emphasize that the stocking plan listed in my original post was not what I planned to have in a 46 gallon. Let me reiterate that I am asking for opinions on how large a tank I would need to comfortably house my "wish list." So far I have heard 55 gallons as an absolute minimum and 75 gallon ideally. No one has proposed yet that I would NEED a 90 gallon tank, although that would match the 1" per gallon rule.

I have no doubt that the 33 juvenile fish I currently have in a 25 gallon, which already include the zebra danios that some other fishes may find disruptive, and who all get along quite well together, will be much happier in the 46 gallon. I might leave some of them in the 25 if I can find a suitable spot for it in my house, thus reducing the load even further - particularly, as was suggested, in splitting up the schooling fishes.

Since I cannot at this point afford a 75-gallon tank, I will have to wait before I can get my dream community set up. In the meantime, I will settle for the 4 tanks I already have.