Cherry shrimp keep dying

[Vladka]

Back in December I bought a used 10 gallon and put a clear
Lid and some LED lights on it, some sand, some gravel, threw some plants in from my 29 and decided a quarantine tank is just too boring.
So I thought I’d get back into cherry shrimp bought like 10 of them in January and they started becoming lethargic and are now all dead except for one young one, most of the ram snails died too but the pond snails seem just fine.
The tests I can do are all great so I don’t understand what the problem could be!
I also made the bad decision of bidding on 2 packs of 20 shrimp on aquabid and one of them is arriving tomorrow so... help!
I don’t have a tds kit and can’t find a lfs that tests for it, or copper.
My parameters:
10 gallon
Ammonia: .25 (have never gotten it lower in any tank)
Nitrite: 0
Nitrate: 0
Ph: 8.2
Kh: 10
Temp: 76 F
Lights on for 10 hours a day
Lots of Duckweed
Sponge filter
Water changes like once or twice a month 30% because nothing is happening.

 

[Fresh2o]

The sudden death of the shrimp and ramshorn snails makes me think of copper. However, the pond snails doing fine does not add up.
This might be a shot in the dark, but perhaps the addition of a pouch of CupriSorb to remove any copper in the water. However, since it is not being tested, this is a shot in the dark.

 

[TMaier]

My substrate was full of heavy metals and all my shrimp and Ramshorns died. They were grazing thru the sand. Copper never showed up on any of my tests.

 

[Vladka]

How can I test just my substrate? My shrimp come today and my copper test is coming tomorrow and I’m worried.... perhaps an 80% water change before they arrive will hold them over until I can figure it out?
This is my first time using these small black rocks as substrate but I’ve never had an issue with the titanium moon sand and the white rocks idk about I never used in large quantities, the blue gravel is very old and has been used in many fish tanks by me only. I think I’ll take out the black rocks for today as well just in case.

 

[Autumnsky]

Run some activated carbon perhaps.

Try more frequent pwc but small ones.

What are you feeding the shrimp?

What is your pH, TDS, GH/KH (still 10?)???

8.2 is pretty high for your average Cherry shrimp. Is that from the tap water?

Also just refilling the tank after evaporation with more high solids and high pH tap water (you might want to use RO water), will just continue to make the environment for the shrimp worse, and more concentrated.

TDS and GH would be good to know if you can get someone to test it.

Can you ask your seller what the tank parameters were for them in their tanks???

Also were these shrimp imported recently, or tank raised in the country you live in and if they were imported how long were they at the sellers tanks before shipping.

Also what were they eating where they came from?

Did the shrimp have any worms in, or on them?
Did they have any hanging green things on their shell?

So if you can do fresh water and then add RO to top of for evap, and then change about .5-1 gallon 2x per week that may help.

 

[Vladka]

Run some activated carbon perhaps.

Try more frequent pwc but small ones.

What are you feeding the shrimp?

What is your pH, TDS, GH/KH (still 10?)???

8.2 is pretty high for your average Cherry shrimp. Is that from the tap water?

Also just refilling the tank after evaporation with more high solids and high pH tap water (you might want to use RO water), will just continue to make the environment for the shrimp worse, and more concentrated.

TDS and GH would be good to know if you can get someone to test it.

Can you ask your seller what the tank parameters were for them in their tanks???

Also were these shrimp imported recently, or tank raised in the country you live in and if they were imported how long were they at the sellers tanks before shipping.

Also what were they eating where they came from?

Did the shrimp have any worms in, or on them?
Did they have any hanging green things on their shell?

So if you can do fresh water and then add RO to top of for evap, and then change about .5-1 gallon 2x per week that may help.

Would activated carbon really help a lot? My testable parameters look good and most cherry shrimp and good with a sponge filter, would the carbon be a temporary thing?

I feed the, Hikari shrimp pellets (though I just took a look at them and they expired 2years ago, do they actually expire?) sometimes I supplement with blanched zucchini or an algae wafer.

Yes my kH and pH are high from the tap water here, I used to have a gH test but it’s all gone, when I had it the gH was always pretty high as well; and in my readings I saw most people saying rcs can tolerate a wide range of tds on the high end, though if the copper test doesn’t tell me anything I may have to look into buying a tds test kit. I have peat moss and leaves I can add to the tank to lower pH if it seems important.

I generally do actual water changes and don’t just top off, I do just top off my 29 heavily Planted tank with RO so I could start adding some RO to the shrimp tank at the same time.

Yes the first seller’s parameters were 7.4 pH and 5 kH, 10 gH, TDS 210/250 tap water. I drip acclimated, they dropped all their eggs, but they see, fine now.
The second batch said they don’t test parameters but they use well water and weekly water changes so I would think they’d be used to hard water.
The original shrimp were local from craigslist from someone with good lines, so same water and sponge filters and they all became lethargic and died off.

No worms, no importing, could maybe do more Smalls after changes but how is this different from larger once a week or less? I will also be going out of the country for 20 days in a couple weeks so I’m expecting they will be okay with no water changes while I am gone.

 

[Vladka]

So got the copper test....
0 in the tank
And 0 in the 4 containers of different rocks I left overnight in RO water.
So I guess copper wasn’t the issue. Is it worth getting a tds test? Could the expired food be the culprit? I just ordered some new food for them that will be here soon hopefully.

 

[Autumnsky]

Would activated carbon really help a lot? My testable parameters look good and most cherry shrimp and good with a sponge filter, would the carbon be a temporary thing?

I feed the, Hikari shrimp pellets (though I just took a look at them and they expired 2years ago, do they actually expire?) sometimes I supplement with blanched zucchini or an algae wafer.

Yes my kH and pH are high from the tap water here, I used to have a gH test but it’s all gone, when I had it the gH was always pretty high as well; and in my readings I saw most people saying rcs can tolerate a wide range of tds on the high end, though if the copper test doesn’t tell me anything I may have to look into buying a tds test kit. I have peat moss and leaves I can add to the tank to lower pH if it seems important.

I generally do actual water changes and don’t just top off, I do just top off my 29 heavily Planted tank with RO so I could start adding some RO to the shrimp tank at the same time.

Yes the first seller’s parameters were 7.4 pH and 5 kH, 10 gH, TDS 210/250 tap water. I drip acclimated, they dropped all their eggs, but they see, fine now.
The second batch said they don’t test parameters but they use well water and weekly water changes so I would think they’d be used to hard water.
The original shrimp were local from craigslist from someone with good lines, so same water and sponge filters and they all became lethargic and died off.

No worms, no importing, could maybe do more Smalls after changes but how is this different from larger once a week or less? I will also be going out of the country for 20 days in a couple weeks so I’m expecting they will be okay with no water changes while I am gone.

The parameters are significantly different in a couple areas. Especially if you have increased KH or TDS or pH.

pH Scale

So the reason you change the water in small amounts is because the shrimp prefer a very stable environment, but clean water. The 2 weekly 5% (or 7% or 10% ) changes would keep the water parameters cleaner and with less fluctuation.

This is not the case if one uses RO or RO/DI remineralized to specific parameters each time there is a water change. Then you make the water exact all the time. (refill evaporation with RO daily or every other day depending on how much evaporates.) This would be more critical with sensitive and highly bred species.

If you have an RO system or can inexpensively purchase RO water and having a smallish - 10G it is not too expensive to use RO remineralized.

You could also opt to cut the tap water with 25% RO to begin with or 33%
or 50%, you could test the water to make sure which is best for the shrimp preferred parameters or most similar to the water they were raised in.

As for the copper test in the substrate, just take out a good scoop and let it sit in the cup for a week and then test the water that is left in the cup. The evaporation will increase the saturation of copper if there is any in there to get a possible reading on the test sample.

 

[Autumnsky]

If the food was kept sealed, cool and very dry not a huge deal, but oils turn rancid over time and possibly not good any more. You can kind of smell if there is too old food.

But glad you got new food. And using a variety of kinds will help to get them different nutrients and hopefully not miss anything important.

 

[Vladka]

If the food was kept sealed, cool and very dry not a huge deal, but oils turn rancid over time and possibly not good any more. You can kind of smell if there is too old food.

But glad you got new food. And using a variety of kinds will help to get them different nutrients and hopefully not miss anything important.

The food smells oily, I’m not sure what it used to smell like. I’ll start giving them algae wafers as well then.
I will also keep the rocks in the water for a week and test substrate again, is copper the only thing that would be harmful from the rocks?

 

[Autumnsky]

Any heavy metals.

What kind of rocks? The white one look like they could be marble (may add carbonate hardness) or maybe quartz which would be fine.

Are the bits of black substrate magnetic at all???

How about the cracked "clay" pot? Is it a garden ornament or specifically for aquariums? Is it a brand name aquarium company or from an unknown company? As sometimes happens things can be made with cheaper materials than they should which can be the wrong kind of thing, think possible scenario like the lead based paint found to be in baby toys from China?

Otherwise possible over feeding or contamination of a spray in the room, anything from a room deodorizer to under arm deodorant, bug spray, suntan spray, cologne, window cleaner or other dusting or surface cleaning spray...etc.

How are the shrimp doing?

 

[Autumnsky]

Oh and activated carbon for a time and maybe then just periodically as a precaution.

It only works optimally for around 7 maybe up to 10 days and then doesn't really do anything after that - useless. I have heard the more stuff it is removing the faster it is spent.

And think about how small a shrimps stomach is.

Just feed tiny amounts or bits of algae wafer.

 

[Vladka]

Any heavy metals.

What kind of rocks? The white one look like they could be marble (may add carbonate hardness) or maybe quartz which would be fine.

Are the bits of black substrate magnetic at all???

How about the cracked "clay" pot? Is it a garden ornament or specifically for aquariums? Is it a brand name aquarium company or from an unknown company? As sometimes happens things can be made with cheaper materials than they should which can be the wrong kind of thing, think possible scenario like the lead based paint found to be in baby toys from China?

Otherwise possible over feeding or contamination of a spray in the room, anything from a room deodorizer to under arm deodorant, bug spray, suntan spray, cologne, window cleaner or other dusting or surface cleaning spray...etc.

How are the shrimp doing?

I just tested and yes the black sand is a little bit magnetic.
The white rocks..... are whatever Home Depot sells I haven’t been able to find it, but I rinsed I get white powder on my hands from them.
The pots are the terra-cotta pots recommended for African dwarf frogs from crafts stores, the frogs seem pretty good with them (though one of them is always bloated) I could take it out if there’s a chance it’s causing issues.

They are right next to where I spray perfume body spray or sunscreen.

So far they seem fine, they’re eating, not extremely active around the tank but I usually see about 10/20 hanging out in the plants or on the driftwood.