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Old 02-17-2006, 12:09 AM   #1
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Bought a 75 Gallon tonight instead of a 55... now what?

Well, went to the lfs tonight and bit the bullet.
A bigger bullet than I originally intended.

Bought a 75 gallon all-glass tank and stand and canopy.

Now what?

They have a sale going on right now that while it didn't reduce the price of all of that stuff did give me $125 in store credit. I figure I'll use that towards the... what will I use that towards?

Since I am now the owner of a bigger tank, all the stuff I thought I was going to use before has changed a bit. Right?

I figure I'll go with the Fluval 404 canister. Any other suggestions?

Heater, submersible - How many watts? 1x250w? 2x150w?

Power Head.. how many? what size?

UV Sterilizer - still debating this. If I use this and get pc lights in a few months will this need to be turned off if I want purple and pink colors on the rock?

Sand - 110lbs or so. Can you buy base sand? liveaquaria has live sand.. but no base... where would I find both?

Rocks - I figured 90lbs ought to work with half being base and half live
I was looking at a 60lb box of the best hirocks and a 30lb box of Tonga Deepwater (Show) from liveaquaria.

Airstone - What would you recommend? Do I really need one?

Do I need any sort of backflow prevention on this? Doesn't seem like anything could really go anywhere.

I'll stick with the no lights for now and believe I'll upgrade to pc near the end of the year.

Any other thoughts?

-elzool
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Old 02-17-2006, 12:35 AM   #2
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Quote:
Power Head.. how many? what size?
You should aim for a turnover rate of 10x your tank size (for yours 700gph). I would get 2 @ 350 and put them on opposite sides of the tank and direct them at each other to create a turbulent flow.
Quote:
Airstone - What would you recommend? Do I really need one?
What would it be used for?
Quote:
I'll stick with the no lights for now and believe I'll upgrade to pc near the end of the year.
IMO you should buy the PC right away if you don't already have the NO. Saves the $ in the long run.

One thing i would consider sooner than later is a quality skimmer.


GL and HTH.
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65 gal reef
EQUIPMENT:
2 PC's 192W each , 20 gal sump/fuge
LIVESTOCK:
4 false clowns, 2 firefish, cardinal, midas blennie, toadstool, zoos, shrooms, trumpet coral, torch, pagoda, frogspawn, poylps, red open brain, devils hand, hermits, snails, 3 cleaner shrimp, coral banded and a emerald crab.
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Old 02-17-2006, 10:22 AM   #3
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Don't forget the salt and ro/di water.

Think about a sump instead of the canister.

I would go with 2 heaters, incase one goes out the other can still maintain the temp.

I don't think you would need a UV sterilizer. What do you plan on keeping?

Yes you can buy dry sand as well as live sand. If money is no object than get all ls. To save money get dry sand and maybe 40 lbs of ls to seed the rest. I get my sand from a lfs as shipping can get cost prohibitive.

No you don't need an airstone.

From what you listed above I don't see where you could use a backflow preventind device.


Like Canyon 15 said, a skimmer is necessary. I like the coralife super skimmer. 10x turnover is good.

Lighting all depends on what you are keeping and your budget. If it will be a fowlr tank then no lighting is fine.

Good Luck,
Brian
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Old 02-17-2006, 10:35 AM   #4
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Re: Bought a 75 Gallon tonight instead of a 55... now what?

Canister filters and saltwater tanks usually dont mix well. If this is going to be a fish only tank than a few canisters will be ok but if your looking for corals canister filters will be a maintenance nightmare to keep nitrates low.

The other reason canister filters are not overly desirable with SW is that SW tanks need high water flow for the sake of the fish as well as to keep some forms of undesirable algae growing.

I always like two smaller heaters vs one large heater. The reason is that if the themostat on one heater sticks you wont have the issue of the water going way high quickly. You might want to think of 2 250W heaters though because saltwater tanks usually are set a bit higher than FW tanks and you really need to size the heater by how many degrees above room temperature you want to keep the water vs watts per gal. I recommend keeping the water at 80*F.

As far as powerheads thats somewhat dependant upon how much water flow your getting out of those canister(s). I have two Hagen 802 powerheads on my 75 gal in addition to a mag 7.5 sump pump. A good frame of reference is to get at leat 10 X water flow in the tank. So thats 750GPH movment in the tank itself.

Before you get a UV read our articles on UV and their benifital use and how to use them properly. They are by no means required items. You can have coraline alage and use UV. Not being able to have UV and corline at the same time is a myth of UV.

Any sand thats limestone based will be great for your sand bed. Your a bit to far south to fine yardright sand at home depot. This sand is excellent for tank use even though it has the disclamer on it that its not for aquarium use. The bagged live sand from the stores is only bactera enriched if that.

I would say 125-150lbs of rock will be better. Of course start out with 90 as you are thinking and move up once you aquascape and esablish how dense or poris the rock is. The more dense the rock the more rock you will need.

Airstones have no use in a SW tank other than to create more work on your end to remove the 'salt creep'.
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Old 02-17-2006, 11:00 AM   #5
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I’d use the store credit for fish purchases only. Everything else is quite a bit cheaper online. Also instead of the canister I would consider a sump or HOB refugium. With a little more base/lr as fishfreek said would provide all the bio-filtration you will need.

You didn’t mention anything about getting a ro\di filter which is also recommended over using tap, buying distilled, or ro water from your lfs. Using tap will introduce significant quantities of po4 along with other impurities which will lead to algae breakouts and other fish/coral/invert issues.

Buying distilled, ro, or ro/di from your lfs will be more expensive in the long run then getting your own ro/di unit and you have little control over the quality of that water which could also not be pure due to them not changing filters or storing improperly.

A lot of people get them from ebay for around $100. Below are the 3 most popular sites:
Filter-Direct-store (seems to be most popular on this site)
The-Aqua-Safe-Pure-Water-Shop
ROfilterDepot

Also airwaterice.com is a good place if you don’t want to deal with ebay.

I would get a unit that comes with a storage container personally so you have di water for top offs on hand at all times.

Research is key to successful SW fish keeping and I’d highly recommend reading all the saltwater articles on this site, the articles on liveaquaria.com, & picking up a good book so you have a better understanding of the basics.

Of course posting here if you have questions on anything specific is helpful as well and welcome to AA
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Old 02-17-2006, 01:24 PM   #6
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Ok...

Looks like I'll get the following:

Two Heaters instead of one. What size? The house temp in winter runs between 68-72(4 months) and the rest of the year it's between 74-82.

Pick up two powerheads. 350gph each?

Add an additional 45lbs of rock DFS Select Fiji Premium Rock from liveaquaria in addition to the 60lb box of the best hirocks and a 30lb box of Tonga Deepwater (Show) from liveaquaria. Total: 135lbs

Sand - If it's not live sand and I get it from the lfs, is it all the same?

Since the tank doesn't contain anything, can I set up all the sand and rock in the tank at once?

Drop the UV

Drop the airstone

I'm not sure about the Filtration.

Since I don't understand it all, I have read the articles, but that doesn't mean I 'get' it. I'm tempted just to listen to whatever someone tells me. The lfs pointed me at a canister filter, you folks say sump. Whatever it is, I'd be buying it and not making my own.

Get both?

If I go with a sump, is this all the filtration hardware I need?

With a sump, the lfs says I would have a better chance of flooding. Is this true or is there 'technology' available to keep that from happening?

With a sump, could I place the heaters in there?

What size sump?

Can a skimmer be setup below or must it hang on the tank? Looks like the Coralife unit has a sump hook up.. do they all have this?

I'll end up installing an ro/di unit somewhere at some point soon.

canyon15 mentioned buying pc now saving me money in the long run... how?

thanks everyone!
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Old 02-17-2006, 03:01 PM   #7
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Two 200w heaters would work for your tank size and temps needed. I would buy a titanium heater and not glass personally.

For ph the following are good choices: Maxi-Jet 1200, Penguin 1140, or the Seio Super Pumps. The Seio pumps will give you the most gph and personally I use two of these.

Sand is not all the same and it’s important to get some sort of aragonite sand and not silica sand. The “live” stuff sold in bags is not worth it imo and I would just buy whatever kind of aragonite sand you like at the best price. The yardright sand fishfreek mentioned is the cheapest way to do it if you can find it and it is aragonite sand. The advantages of aragonite sand is it will help buffer your tank and maintain trace minerals and PH.

Any articles you don’t understand just ask here and I’m sure tons will clarify it for you.

A sump or canister isn’t needed since you plan on using lr as your bio-filtration.

The advantages of a sump are that it makes it easier to house equipment though ie: skimmer, heaters, chemical filtration. It also provides additional water volume to help maintain quality parameters. It can flood but taking the rights steps to allow enough room in the tank should the siphon on the overflow stops and not filling your sump too high will reduce that possibility greatly.

A 20 gal long tank usually fits nicely in a 75 gal stand and is the most economical way to do it. This thread goes into more detail. Or you could spend $150+ buying one online. You will also need an overflow since your tank isn’t drilled. I use a CPR CS102 overflow hooked up to a Mag 9.5 pump for return from the sump. Some people prefer the U tube overflows so I would review both.

Some skimmers are HOB units only and if you do want to place in the sump make sure its designed for either both or for just the sump. Keeping it below is what’s preferred if you have a sump to both keep it out of site and to reduce the noise.

Reason you would want to buy for example a 4X65W PC unit now is because it costs about $200. A single NO fixture for your tank runs $60+ and a double about $120 so that’s why he recommend just buying the PC fixture now so you don’t end up spending $260+ on lights. If you want to turn this into a reef at a later date spending $400+ on a MH/PC combo light would make more sense then “wasting” $200 on PC lights now.

The startup is the most expensive part of this hobby and most spend $1500+ just to start and average anywhere from $30-$100 a month just to maintain the systems ie: lighting costs, food, supplements, salt mix, filters, ect.
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Old 02-17-2006, 03:56 PM   #8
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elzool,

Whatever you do, do not buy something because someone tells you too. This forum has alot of helpful and knowledgeable members. No one here knows everything. Ask questions, alot of questions. Read and do research on anything you plan to purchase. Once you have done that then make an informed decision. You need to decide what will be best for you little eco-system. I say little compared to the world, not tank size. You will get differences of opinion but that is what makes this place so great. You have gotten some good replies in this thread by some very knowledgeable people. In the end though it is your choice how to set up your tank.

Good Luck with your tank. It should be fun and educational. I personally get just as much enjoyment of keeping a tank sustained as I do out of learning what keeps it healthy and why.

Brian
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Old 02-17-2006, 04:53 PM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Macrosill
Whatever you do, do not buy something because someone tells you too.
I hope everyone would try to understand this hobby before jumping in. Just like you would research other purchases ie: car, electronics, etcetera. You have to do the proper research on products or else you will end up spending wasted money on inferior/unneeded equipment.

Also unlike FW fish SW fish/inverts/coral need more specialized equipment.

I know I’m guilty of putting out hundreds of links to products and try to give at least 2-3 options for what I or others consider “decent” equipment to choose from. I know when I first started a SW tank it took TONS of research to even figure out which brands were decent and which equipment I even needed. If everyone just said get a sump, skimmer, pump, light, etcetera without at least pointing people in the right direction then what’s the point of even mentioning it?
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Old 02-17-2006, 05:33 PM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tecwzrd
A sump or canister isn’t needed since you plan on using lr as your bio-filtration.
But using a sump in addition to lr is not a bad thing right? Especially since it can house all of these other itmes like heaters, skimmers, etc.

Quote:
Originally Posted by tecwzrd
It can flood but taking the rights steps to allow enough room in the tank should the siphon on the overflow stops and not filling your sump too high will reduce that possibility greatly.
Could you elaborate on this please? The part about reducing the possibility appeals to me.


Quote:
Originally Posted by tecwzrd
Some skimmers are HOB units only and if you do want to place in the sump make sure its designed for either both or for just the sump. Keeping it below is what’s preferred if you have a sump to both keep it out of site and to reduce the noise.
How much noise are we talking about when it's below?

Thanks again!
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