Can I remove bioballs?

[Nitrate]

I’ve had a 150 running for about 8 months with a wet/dry as primary filtration. A couple of months ago I added 100 lbs of Gulf LR and 40lbs base rock. Two weeks ago I added another 35lbs of Fiji LR and last week I added 12 lbs more. Total of 147 lbs not counting base rock which probably hasn’t seeded yet.

I'm tired of fighting nitrates, I don’t want to do 30 water changes weekly and that’s what I have to do to keep it in check. Can I safely remove the balls? or safely clean them and put them back?

I have cc substrate, which I'm seriously considering changing and all my other levels are fine. I use RO water and the membrane is fairly new. Anyone with nitrate problems that changed their substrate and got good results please chime in.

Maybe remove the balls and keep them wet so that if I get a spike I can put them back in?

 

[jackdp]

Removing the bioballs in stages over time would be the way to go. Maybe like 10-20% a week and after a month or so you'll be free of them. I think that would prevent any ammonia spikes assuming you've got good flow through your rock, I think adequate flow is one of the keys to nitrate removal via LR and LS. A DSB would also create a better enviroment for denitrifying bacteria to remove your trates. If you decide to make the change, replace your CC with LS and just put some of the CC in pantyhose or mesh bags and set on the bottom to help seed the sand. HTH

 

[ClamKnuckle]

How old is your base rock that you dont think it has seeded yet?

i would change out the substrate and remove the bioballs eventually if it were my tank

1 1/2 lbs/gal LR and a DSB you'll have no need what so ever for the bio balls


I would change out my substrate first like this http://www.aquariumadvice.com/showquestion.php?faq=2&fldAuto=27
The get rid of the bio balls about 1/3 at a time allowing time for the tank to stabilize

 

[ellisz]

When I removed my bioballs I did as stated above. With CC and a puffer, you might have nitrate issues anyway. Maybe a refugium could help with this.

 

[ambulocetus]

I will outright admit i know not much when it comes to sw, however my understanding of the nitrogen cycle was that unless you have green plants to take up nitrate, it will always be present. lr and ls only convert the ammonia -> Nitrite -> Nitrate. I always had been under the impression that nitrate would only be removed through water changes (unless the tank is planted). Please correct me if i am wrong (i am a noobie after all!). As for the bio-balls, they do need to be cleaned to avoid detritus build up, and with the amount of lr in the tank (base rock seeds relativley swiftly) you should be fine - as with all things saltwater do it slowly, 1/3rd or a 1/4 ever other week or so until empty! (but that is just my opinion )

 

[quarryshark]

I have slowly removed mine with no issue. Just like jackdp illustrated above.

 

[lando]

I am fighting the same nitrate war. Before I had a sump my nitrates where zero. Now they are 5 to 10. I am in the process of removing my bioballs slowly and replacing them all with LR rubble. Hope this will help. Do I need to still do it slowly if the LR rubble is fully cured? I have about 50/50 rubble to bioballs right now.

 

[jackdp]

my understanding of the nitrogen cycle was that unless you have green plants to take up nitrate, it will always be present. lr and ls only convert the ammonia -> Nitrite -> Nitrate

The bacteria that complete the first two steps of the nitrogen cycle are aerobic bacteria, meaning that they use oxygen in respiration. That being said, these bacteria grow on the surface of most everything in your tank. The purpose of the bio-balls, sponges, LR, LS etc is to provide even more surface area for these nitrifying bacteria to fluorish. There are bacteria that breakdown nitrates into nitrogen gas and oxygen, and these bacteria are anaerobic and populate areas that are lower in oxygen. The deeper layers of a DSB and the deep pores on some LR are ideal places for these denitrifying bacteria to grow and thrive. So, in conclusion, there is a bacterial mechanism that can be in place to export nitrates without the use of macroalgae harvesting. Although, harvesting macroalgaes is a proven means of nutrient export.

 

[snookface]

You do not need bio-balls or rubble in the sump. Your LR will be enough to take care of all our bacteria needs. You do how ever need a good protein skimmer, the best you can afford. Run it 24/7. In addition get a 25 micron sock that needs to be installed at the intake to the sump. This needs to be changed at least once a week if not sooner depending on your load. I have five and change them out twice a week.

My nitrates were at 25ppm and after removing my bio-balls it went to 0.0

They need to be removed slowly, I took 2 months to completely remove mine. You need to remove all the settlement in the bottom of the sump. Sipon it off with water changes. The goal is to remove as much debre as you can, this is why you change the 25 micron sock so much. I also run carbon 24/7 and replace it ever week. I am very religious about water changes too. I do 20% every saturday.

 

[Nitrate]

Thanks for the help guys, the ball removal has begun.

Next question....
LFS buys LR by the box and once it is all sold he discards all the rubble, sometimes as much as 2 lbs of it. Theres got to be something useful I can use it for, any ideas?

Lando is replacing his balls with such rubble, sounds like a good idea?

 

[lando]

I am getting mine for free from the LFS. They just throw it in and cure it with the LR so it ready to go when I get it. It is just a couple pounds at a time but for free, t can wait. I figure it does not have to look good in the sump. Rubble will do the same as LR in the tank.

 

[johnkristie]

Does live rock need to have light? Or can it but put in a dark sump underneath the tank?

 

[snookface]

You do not need rubble, as long as you have LR. The rubble will collect the same trash as the bio-balls. Just use the 25 micron sock, protein skimmer, carbon and do weekly water changes.

 

[ellisz]

If the LR rubble is free, why not add it. A filter sock is great but like you said it has to be changed. More LR or LR rubble the better, IMO.

I would love to have some for my fuge if it was free. Rubble is good for pods.

 

[lando]

It is my understanding that the bacteria that break down nitrate do not need light. With out light in your sump you get the benifits of biological filtration, just won't grow coraline and other stuff that require light.

 

[snookface]

The principal of the sock it to remove bio load. That is how you reduce nitrates. Changing the sock only takes a few minutes, the same as cleaning the protein skimmer cup. The more material you remove the less your bacteria has to eat. The principal is to get the load equal to the bacteria digestion, that how you balance the system and get your nitrates to 0.0.

 

[lando]

I just picked up the last of the rubble I need from the LFS. About another 10 ls. Added it yesterday so I will see if it helps. I will wait a day and do another water change then test nitrates to see if they go down. i am down to about 5 right now, but would like to see 0 to 2.5.

 

[FishyMel]

Seems like the rubble would be the same as small pieces of liverock and useful. I wanted to add that I set a refugium up on my oceanic 150. I have predator fish tank with a few stealthy inverts. Lots of mess at feeding time. My refugium is doing well at holding my nitrates at zero. Here is how I did it. It really was simple and not too expensive.

I bought an 18 gallon cube tank and had a glass company drill a hole in the side. I then put a bulkhead on it and attached tubing that goes into the sump. I purchased cinder blocks at Home Depot to raise the tank 4 inches off the floor under my cabinent. Gravity takes the water back into the sump. I pump water from the sump slowly with a maxi-jet into the refugium over the top. The glass company also fashioned half a glass lid for the tank to set my shop light on top of leaving the other half open for my return line. It only cost around 200 dollars for the whole setup and it works like a charm. I kept my bioballs and I also run a protein skimmer. So far so good.... I think this is a good option if you want a heavily stocked tank. Then you don't need to get rid of your wet/dry filter.