cyano

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fishtender

Aquarium Advice Activist
Joined
Jul 7, 2003
Messages
173
Location
Park Rapids, Minn USA
HI all.

Ok, so if I manage to eradicate my tank of the dreaded "CYANO", then the problem should not reoccur as long as I don't introduce anything from a tank that has it, say, from my lfs. Is this correct?

I would think that since it is a bacteria, it is not created in the tank but rather enhanced by say overfeeding and raised Phosphate levels and poor water qualities.

What do you think?

Howard.
 
that is incorrect. It does not get "brought in" by anything. Your tank situation is what creates it, and ultimately, what will make it go away.
 
Very interesting. I have been fighting it for quite some time now and have changed or altered many things to combat it. I watch the Phosphates and never let them get to high before I do a water change. I have cut down on my feeding and have quit giving frozen brine. I now only feed flake. I don't supplement my Inverts as often as I did. I even cut down on the light duration each day. None of this seemed to have any effect on the Cyano.

I finallyresorted to using an additive. Definitely a last resort!! I used Chemi-clean. I treated once and my cyano went away. It had no adverse effect on my Fish or inverts or good algae.

I was hoping by getting rid of it and not reintroducing it , I would not see a reimmergence. Now you say that it is created in the invironment. I still haven't determined what started it in the first place. If I am to starve it out, I have to find what is feeding it.?.?.?

Do you think that regular flour light combined with actinic could be aiding in the problem? It only seemed to grow in the lighted areas of the tank, not under my LR or in the shadows of my colt coral and such.

Howard
 
cutting down on light will not affect cyano (except by shutting it off completely for several days.) and only then if the other conditions have been removed. If you have ANY phosphate reading, then it is enough to permit cyano to grow, same as nitrate. What started it in the first place were conditions to make it happy...nitrates, phosphates, low water flow areas...
 
What creates phosphates? When I do a water change I reduce my phosphates to 0.00 and in a few days they are up to 0.25 . They are never above this, but apparently that is enough to cause Cyano. My amonia, nitrite, nitrate levels all remain at 0.00 and my PH runs between 8.2 &8.6 . (That is as close as the PH tester I have will get).

What about the feeding? How much, how often? I only feed once a day, and I feed them only what they can consume. No food ever has a chance to reach the SB.
I am using Omega flake. I don't know much about the nutritional values needed, but I was told that flake food is healthier for them. I can't get live brine in my area and I learned that frozen has a lot of phosphates and very little nutritional value.

What are your thoughts?

Also....Thank you for all yout time and shared knowledge. Saltwater is not a very popular thing here in the "back of beyond" so there really is no local source of good info. We newbies appreciate all the great input you experienced "saltys'" have to offer. :fadein:

Howard
 
FYI, cyanobacteria is neither a bacteria nor is it an algae. It has traits from both types but is not considered a true type of either family.

Feedings will generate some of the phosphates, but IME flake foods contribute little or none. They are the primary source I feed my tank.

There are a few other things you could look into as possible causes. Age of lights, how long they run, do you have proper actinic bulbs? Cyano does not do well in the 420-430 nm spectrum and 50/50 or daylights can be quite a fuel source.

Water flow and chemistry will also come into play. It is hard for cyano to become established in high flow areas and tends to stick with dead spots. Increased flow will do wonders. As well it will not multiply as quickly if higher alk is maintained. This can be a key factor as the snails and such will have a much easier time at eliminating it if they can eat it faster than it grows. FYI, true turbo snails eat it like candy.

One thing I also discovered some time back, is that certain resin/carbon products if not replaced often enough will promote these types of blooms quite out of nowhere. I usually use it as a sign my chemi-pure needs changing. It will often clear up a day or two later.

HTH
Cheers
Steve
 
Most of the phosphates I have found came from me using tap water(city water) for top off water... The tap water from our tap has a little amount of phosphate in it... The thing that is most disturbing, is that the silicate content is very high... I believe that the Cyano likes that also, and when it cannot get the phosphate or nitrate it needs, it will eat silicates and thrive... This I found to be one of the main sources of my problem... I also wondered why I had so much sponge growing on the underside of my rocks and in the shadows.... Silicates.... If your phosphate and nitrates, are below minimum, and Cyano is still there strong, then I would test for Silicates... There may be a link there, and you can remedy the situation...

Also, having a refugium with ample amounts of the right kind of macro algae, will reduce the compounds that Cyano likes, and thus, reduce the likelyhood of it coming back..
 
I don't know that I have true turbos or not. I think they are really torchus. They spend most of their time on my LR and on the glass. They have never been on the SB that I have noticed. As for my water, I use my well water and it is very good quality. I test 0.00 on ammonia, phosphates, nitrates and nitrites.

I 2 PH's in my 55g. One blows like heck and the other is not as powerful but has a good airator.

I have not seen a tester for silicate. I have a LSB so I know that it is not silicate but I don't know what else might be in the tank.

I have new lights coming this week. They are PC 10,000K...460NM. I really don'y know what all that means, but I think they must be better than what I run now.
 
460 nm is the wavelength of the bulb measured in nanometers. It is actually a good rage.

nm of a 10 k bulb
smh10k.jpg


Cheers
Steve
 
I have a LSB so I know that it is not silicate but I don't know what else might be in the tank.

I have a LSB also, this does not mean that you would not have silicate in the tank. It can also be introduced to the tank by way of water changes and top offs...The theory that Sand leeches silicates into the tank, has been thrown around quite a bit, and if I am not mistaken, the results have been that little of not no silicates to a harmful degree leech out. Some silicate is ok to have in the tank, however, too high of saturation, can cause nuisance algae and organisms to appear..

Salifert makes a test kit for Silicates

I use my well water and it is very good quality

Coming out of the ground, if unfiltered through RO/DI process, I can almost guarantee that you have silicates present... this is where they come from mostly...
 
Is there a specific test on the market for silicates? I only have 2 pet stores to go to. Both are an hour away and they don't offer to much in the way of saltwater supplies. perhaps they could order me one or I could find it on the web.
 
red sea also maks one. had this problem in my 30 and 75 more then once. i turned up my skimmer to max and the stuff was turning brown in 2 days,gone in a week. this worked for me. and the best part is NO CHEM in the tank. :D
 
Excellent advice folks :DSteve I was under the understanding that cyano was both an algae and a bacteria living in a symbionic relationship. But it has been awhile since I looked back. Pretty much everything said here is good info. The way you have to look at cyano is that it is the ultimate Nutrient absorber (that and it fixes nitrogen, This is why folks Get it with DSB's as Nitrogen is the off gass on its denitrifing capability). It will out comsume its next best absorber (hair algae) by 500 times. It will take advantage of any situation that gives it an edge, SO as mentioned above, Aged lights (spectrum of a old bulb slowly turns red as it ages, cyano loves red), water flow (the bacteria will begin to fix nitrogen or any of it by products, then the algae feeds off the by product of the bacteria and forms a slime coat which in turn protects the bacteria from getting blown away), and nutrients (basically food, could be silicates, phosphatews or a whole host of things that fall inot the nutrient family)

The way to get rid of it, take away its edge, by eliminating the above.


Mike
 
mojoreef said:
Steve I was under the understanding that cyano was both an algae and a bacteria living in a symbionic relationship.

To be honest it is still open to much interpretation. I have saved a few links that you may find interesting. I warn you though, they are rather drole.

Cyano 1
Cyano 2
Cyanobacteria

Cheers
Steve
 
It sounds like cyano is posibly a form of higher intelligence. It eats anything and has incredible defensive mechanisms.

I seem to have eliminated most of it from my tank. I exists no as light brown patches on the SB. It hasn't grown is several days and the color has remained the same. Still, It also remains. Therefore there is still something, although not much , that is sustaining it. I had not heard that they love the red spectrum so much. I am hoping that since my lights are 6 months old and being replaced this week, it could be the crushing blow.

Thank you all for the terrific advice and the crash course in cyano 101.

Howard
 
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