Got the setup but need the help

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Magma

Aquarium Advice Freak
Joined
Sep 29, 2010
Messages
339
Location
Calgary, Canada
So I have had FW tanks for years now and well like everyone I have talked to had mentioned, they are fun but Salt Water just seems to be more involved and fun in the long run.

So we (wife and I) after looking around picked up a Red Sea Max 130D. Its the all in one package and seemed like a great starter package, it was between the JBJ LED Nano Cube (26G) personally I wanted a little more space just in case.


I havent setup the tank yet but will be starting a cycle very soon I plan on running the cycle for probably a month just due to time constraints from work. So we need to know a few things before we start and we came here to find out.

1. Best salt to use, and how to add the salt to the water.
I know it sounds like a funny question but really how do you add the salt? premix your water and them dump into the tank? or fill the tank with fw then add the salt? and how about when you do water changes?

2. What kind of sand should I be picking up? we would like maybe white or black but so far we have only really seen a few choices and most are white.

3. What would fit best in a 33G tank for livestock? we wanted to do a shrimp or 2 and some crabs, maybe a snail

4. Live Rock....how do I know its cured? (or ready I guess) and how long should it cycle before adding cleaners/fish to the tank

5. Should I add corals before or after the fish?


What we wanted was some clowns (1 or 2), fire shrimp, crabs, starfish and probably some kind of sea anemone to start, probably some more soft corals later.

Thanks in advance we want to get some ideas from hobbyists before we went out and got all the wrong stuff or the wrong fish for our tank.
 
Welcome to AA! Kudos to you for coming and researching first before doing anything.

1. Salt - Salt is highly a matter of personal preference, but in some part salt selection depends on your tank type (FO, FOWLR, Reef). It appears you want to work up into a reef scenario. Again, it's highly a matter of opinion but I use Reef Crystals with great success.

For your initial fill (when the tank is empty) you can do whatever is easiest for you. FW in the tank, then add salt is okay for this if you want. For your water changes, though, you'll need to store the FW and mix the salt in a spare container with a powerhead and heater for at least 24 hours before adding new water to the tank.

2. Dry Aragonite sand is really good, and pretty cheap. Don't waste money on "live" sand that's been sitting on a shelf somewhere. The sand will become live over time. There's a few different grain types to aragonite, and that's mostly personal preference too on how you want the bed to look.

3. You'll want eventually to add some snails and maybe hermit crabs as your clean up crew (CUC). You could have a shrimp in there, and probably a pair of clowns would be okay, but that'll be about it for fish.

4. If you get LR from an LFS, they should be able to tell you if it's cured or not. If you order it online (often cheaper) you'll have to cure it after shipment anyway. Since you need to cycle your tank anyhow, you can cure the LR and cycle the tank at the same time, so don't worry too much about getting cured rock. Adding LR to an established system is where you have to be careful about ensuring the rock is cured to avoid an ammonia spike.

5. Corals first, fish first, doesn't really matter. Typically fish will come first, you'll need to wait a little while for your system to really get established and stable before adding corals as they're much more sensitive than fish are.

The only other comment is on your anemone. Anemones need a really stable environment, so most recommend that you wait 1 year or so of having your tank setup before attempting one of those.

Again, welcome to AA!
 
ok so now my next question, about the saltwater in a bucket..

What do you use to get your SW ready in? Would a giant rubbermaid container work? or should I get a small tank?

Also how many snails/crabs should a CUC consist of for a 33G tank?
Are starfish considered CUC? if so what kind should i be looking for?

we just want to do it correctly and if it takes a few months of prep so be it. Its better to have it all ready to go than to lose an expensive fish or coral I think.
 
I mix about 20-25g at a time using a 30 or 33g Brute trash can that I got from home depot. Rubbermaid tubs would work, or a small tank would work. Whatever you have easiest access to.

For your CUC, someone else will need to answer in terms of quantities, I'm not good at that stuff.

Im not sure you can keep a starfish in a 33g. What I do know about them is that they are very sensitive to water paramter changes, especially sg, so you'll have to have an auto top off system to maintain your sg perfectly in order to keep them.
 
The only star fish that are really ever considered part of a clean up crew is a sand sifting star. Your tank would be too small for one and you don't really need it anyway.

For CUC i don't usually like to suggest a set number because what is right for one persons tank may be way off for another. I usually start with a small amount (for you probably 3-4 snails and 3-4 hermits) and let them do thier thing. If after a couple weeks they still don't seem to be getting the job done then you can just slowly pick up more until the tank is staying clean. If you pick up to many at once they can run out of food and start to die off.

I would stay away from turbo snails. They are great cleaners but in my opinion they are to big and clumsy. They tend to get suck in rocks and die. They are also really annoying if you have coral frags bucuse they will knock them around.

Last, pick up a few nassarius snails. They are good at cleaning up left over food. they also bury them selves in the sand when they are not looking for food and help to keep it turned over.
 
So nassarius snails then are a better choice for snails than turbos. Do crabs and snails mix? or would the crabs attack the snails for there shells?
what kinds of crabs are best for reef tanks?
 
Sorry i should have been more clear. Get a few nassarius in addition to your normal snails (cerith, turbo, margarita, astraea for example). The "normal snails" will stay in general on your rocks and glass and consume algae. Nassarius snails consume left of food and not really algae.

I like getting either blue or red leg hermit crabs. Those are the only two i trust to be in my reef tank because they stay small enough that they can't do any harm. They may try to attack your snails for their shells but if you just ask the LFS for a few empty shells they will usually give you some. With the empty shells around they will leave your snails alone. Some of the larger crabs sally light foot, or emrad crabs can occasionally get a bit aggressive or cause problems.
 
ahh so the nassarius snails focus on left over food.

Now since the CUC is first into the tank should I be throwing in some food for them right away and if so what should I use?

Once i get the fish in the tank they could use the left overs but until then they need something.
 
If it is really going to be a while before you put fish in you can put in a little bit of food for them. You really only need a small amount. Any food will do they are not picky. As for the algae eating snail you will have plenty of diatoms and algae from your cycle to keep them happy. Make sure you add your CUC after your cycle is finished though.
 
oh of course im just getting all the info before I even start I dont want to have problems down the road and rush through google to find out why my tank isnt stable or something.

so how many corals could you keep in a small tank? or do they affect the bio load as much as fish?
 
Most coral have little to no effect on bio-load. Some people choose to feed their LPS or softies meaty foods, in which case the left over food is more of a bio impact then the coral, but its still there.
 
good to know that it wont affect the tank much, how fast do they grow though? I have seen in some LFS little tiny frags maybe the size of a quater some even smaller.
 
Depends on the species. Typically the lower the price, the faster it grows :p

Your soft corals like zoanthids, xenia, and clove polyps will usually grow the fastest.
LPS like acans, and duncans are a little slower.
SPS like acro's are usually the slowest.

That being said, there are always things that break the rules. Chalices will usually grow superrrrr sloowww, but some SPS like orange cap and birdsnest will grow super fast.

This all is dependent on how ideal your tank water is and your lighting setup as well.
 
so those ones about the size of a quater could grow to be large corals at a fairly good pace then?
 
All coral are going to grow at a different rate. It will depend on not only the coral but the tank conditions as well. As a really general ball park figure you could expect the quarter sized coral to become about tennis ball sized in somewhere around 6-7 months. This is assuming it is a moderatly fast growing coral under optimal water/lighting/feeding conditions for that specimin.
 
Ok another question I was looking through some online stores and some sell reef plugs to but frags of corals on and they look exactly like what some LFS sell, they also mentioned pre drilling some 1/2" holes into your LR to make for future frags.

So I was just thinking before I go ahead and get the LR into the tank and aquascape the tank should I take the time to drill a few holes for future rock? Or is that going to harm the LR to much.
 
No it won't do anything to your LR at all. I drilled mine to help me aquascape. I would suggest putting all your rocks where you want them and then take the pieces that are on top and drill some holes where you think you would like to have coral.

If you try and drill some pieces before hand then it will make it very difficult to place your rock with those pieces on top. They just have to kind of fit and you make the best of it.
 
what did you use to drill it?

Im an electrician so I have hammer drills and some mansonary bits but never drilled into a natural rock before, mostly just concrete and red brick.
 
Okay, you are really getting ahead of yourself. Do you have a liquid test kit? You mentioned a month for cycling....Not so...It all depends on how fast your bio-system can convert Ammonia to nitrites to nitrates and the only way to know this is to test your water. Read up on cycling and get more information on it.
 
the tank isnt even setup yet I just want to have the understanding of the whole setup before I start anything.

And it will be a month of cycling just due to work constraints I wont be able to do much other than get the sand in and have the LR setup I have a fresh water test kit right now from my FW setup but I will be adding to it with a SW kit and Reef kit before I start the cycle.

Once I get the sand and LR setup I might be able to add a CUC but fish wont be able till probably Mid Nov early Dec.

But like i said I want to know what to expect what to do for prep and what to expect in the first month, 3 months, a year down the road so im caught off guard about something that might pop up. Finding out how to get my LR ready seems like a pretty good start since it would be easier to do during the cycle than later on.
 
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