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Old 04-10-2010, 04:15 PM   #71
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Ah I think I found it...

Tetra Half Moon - 10 Gallon Glass Aquarium Kit - 3reef Forums

I must have that kit, same light, filter, and tank.

Think an of this stuff will work once I get the 24.5 x 24.5 x 14 tank? Or just keep it all for qt tank?
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Old 04-10-2010, 05:01 PM   #72
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Bonnie, ["P.S. Is there a level of Nitrates that will kill them? It's possible that it's actually off the chart. It's hard for me to tell but its pretty red. I have to pick up salt today so I'll take a sample to him."]
Nitrates really start to bother fish at ~80ppm and kill them at ~100ppm. What it does is speed up the fishes metabolism causing them to use more oxygen then their body can get by normal breathing. This causes them to die from lack of O2.
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Old 04-11-2010, 08:02 PM   #73
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So I bought a better thermometer today. The tank is running at 76.7, that's pretty low isnt it? I tried to adjust the heater and I don't see anyway to set it. No knobs or anything. The only thing I see on it is "01f31" Im pretty sure this is the tank I have: Product Catalog

Anyway for me to adjust the heat? Do you think that could have been what killed the fish?

Also noticed, when doing a water change, the water dipped down to 174. Should I buy another heater to put in the saltwater bucket for water changes?

ETA: The heater felt slimy, is that normal? How soon can I test my water again after doing a water change?
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Old 04-11-2010, 08:56 PM   #74
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The heater is probably pre-set at 77 degrees and cannot be adjusted. I have a few of those I use for small PWC's in gallon buckets. The fish are fine at that temp.

I bought those preset Tetra heaters at WalMart. They are aprox $14 for the 2-5 gallon rated heater. Yes, get one and a small powerhead to mix your salt in a gallon bucket. Let it mix overnight.

The heater feeling slimy is the coating of bacteria living on the surface. It's noraml and I alway clean the heater from the salt mix tank after a water change.

You should wait a few hours after a PWC to test the water. Waiting 24 hours is best, but in that size tank a few hours will suffice.
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Old 04-11-2010, 09:53 PM   #75
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As always, thank you sir! Ive learned so much in the last week.

Why a power head in the PWC bucket? (Im buying premade saltwater from the LFS if that makes an difference.)
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Old 04-11-2010, 10:54 PM   #76
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In that case just bring it to the same temp as the tank and do your pwc. I thought you were mixing your own.
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Old 04-11-2010, 11:13 PM   #77
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No, I havent gotten that brave yet, lol. Still trying to save what's left of this tank. When I get the new tank Im going to start from scratch and do the works (which is why I was asking about ro/di units yesterday). Saving one tank and researching the other, lol
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Old 04-13-2010, 01:08 AM   #78
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Okay, Im confused. I took a water sample to the LFS today at noon. He asked me to leave it and then called me back with his results tonight at 9:00pm. Can leaving the water a long time make a difference?

I still get 80 on nitrates...he got 0. How can that be? I asked him about it, and he does it exactl like I do. We both use API test kits. I told him Id come down tomorrow and we'd test together. But how could I get 80 and he 0?


He did say my phosphates are elevated, they were all the way. I dont have that test since it's in the reef kit and I have no coral yet. Would that kill my fish? Why is it so high and what do I do to fix?
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Old 04-13-2010, 02:24 AM   #79
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With fish deaths, there normally isn't a "smoking gun." Unless it's an obvious parasite or disease, or an obvious poisoning of the water, folks will never really know what exactly killed their fish. But there are a two things - at least to me - that wave a huge red flag about this tank:

1. You shifted the SG from 1.027 to 1.021 in one water change.
2. You had 8 fish in a 10g - one of them being a damsel that was harassing the other fish.

It seems like you're still trying to find a reason as to why your fish died... some concrete reason. But to me, the items I listed above seem reason enough. Even though we can't give you an *exact* cause of death, I wouldn't say that no one here doesn't know why the fish died.

Regarding the nitrate test kit, well... someone is wrong. 80 *does* seem pretty high for a tank that has only been set up for a couple weeks, or even a month, but it doesn't seem like it should be zero either with the bioload you had. I'd be more apt to believe you though... since this is the LFS that screwed you up to start with, right? The water sitting around shouldn't effect the nitrate test. The only thing it *will* effect is pH. You want to do pH tests right after you draw the water.

High phosphates is a little unexpected, but if you've been overfeeding flake food, I could see that you'd have some present. It won't kill fish... at least at levels that we normally see in our tanks. It will slow or stop calcification of coral though... that's why it's a concern in a reef tank. It also fuels algae growth.

For a 10g FOWLR tank, I'd just let your normal water changes bring down the phosphates. There are sponges and media (GFO... granulated ferric oxide) and chemicals that you can buy to suck up the phosphates, but if you're not having an algae issue I'd just let the water changes deal with it for now. I'm sure that your LFS will want to sell you some "phosphate remover" of some sort though.
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Old 04-13-2010, 03:11 AM   #80
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LOL thanks Kurt. I guess Im still trying to find exact causes so it doesnt happen again in the future. I totally get the bioload thing, but I havent had any issues with ammonia at all (at least since I got the test...but who knows prior to that). So that's why I keep searching. But even more importantly, I want to not have the few remaining die. Though Ive had a few days with no deaths now. I just keep posting here in this thread because it's been a very good learning process.

I suppose there could be any number of reasons why they died. I didnt have a good thermometer so couldnt judge the temp well, I had that crappy hydrometer so who knows what the salinity really was or how much it changed, I didnt have a testing kit so who knows if there was a big ammonia spike prior to that. I was just flying blind!

I havent gone back to the store that sold me this tank. I finally just gave up on them because like you said, they just keep trying to sell me more stuff. I found another LFS that seems to care quite a bit more and they did the last test for me. Ill go back tomorrow to see who's wrong.

Overfeeding the flake is quite possible something Ive done so it wouldnt shock me. I think all the flake eaters are dead so mostly just doing frozen now and trying to go very light.

Im definately not having algae issues so will keep doing water changes. Any idea how many it takes to start seeing a difference in the numbers?
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