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Old 06-17-2008, 12:32 PM   #31
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What I'm trying to say is that it's possible that everything you say is accurate but that with only the 2 fish in such a large tank (using them to cycle) your water sample appears 'cycled' when it hasn't gone through anything yet.

Fresh water poured into a tank will appear cycled unless you know that it hasn't been through the cycle. 'Cycled' water appears fresh because of the bacteria action.

Unless you always talked to the same person at the LFS and they understoof your timeline (and assuming they care) your water may test as cycled when it's really not even started.

If you never detected any change in your amm/trite/trate (esp nitrate) from the beginning then that further confirms my suspicion.
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Old 06-17-2008, 12:42 PM   #32
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What is your feeding schedule/ammount?

It does sound like you're going through a delayed cycle.

If you can find temporary housing for the critters, you can start a fishless cycle and get it over with. If not, then you need to start doing extra water changes to attempt to preserve the fish. A product like Prime that detoxifies ammonia/nitrite will also help. (Check the labels, not all ammonia detoxifiers affect nitrite. Prime also detoxifies chlorine, if you're using tap water instead of RO.)

Cycling with fish without killing the fish will take much longer and be more work than cycling without fish. It is not the prefered option.
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Old 06-17-2008, 01:25 PM   #33
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What I'm trying to say is that it's possible that everything you say is accurate but that with only the 2 fish in such a large tank (using them to cycle) your water sample appears 'cycled' when it hasn't gone through anything yet.

Fresh water poured into a tank will appear cycled unless you know that it hasn't been through the cycle. 'Cycled' water appears fresh because of the bacteria action.

Unless you always talked to the same person at the LFS and they understoof your timeline (and assuming they care) your water may test as cycled when it's really not even started.

If you never detected any change in your amm/trite/trate (esp nitrate) from the beginning then that further confirms my suspicion.
Hi,

I just got back from LFS after they tested the water. Eveything is zero except the ammonia that is between 0 and .25. The color is a shade darker than the 0 tab but too light to be at .25. He told me that there is no way the tank is not cycled at this point. The person I spoke to is the person who advises me from Day 1. I read in Tullock book that with LR and LS, one may not see the normal ammonia, nitrite spike of the cycle. Dai
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Old 06-17-2008, 01:33 PM   #34
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Yep, it sounds like you are about to start your cycle. I would not take that guy's advice. He is there to make money, we are here to help for FREE. I believe I read something about you getting water from the store. You have to be aware the water column has very little amount of beneficial bacteria. The beneficial bacteria is what converts ammonia to nitrItes to nitrAtes and it will reside in your substrate, nooks and crannies in your LR, filter media and anything else it can stick to.
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Old 06-17-2008, 01:35 PM   #35
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Yep, it sounds like you are about to start your cycle. I would not take that guy's advice. He is there to make money, we are here to help for FREE. I believe I read something about you getting water from the store. You have to be aware the water column has very little amount of beneficial bacteria. The beneficial bacteria is what converts ammonia to nitrItes to nitrAtes and it will reside in your substrate, nooks and crannies in your LR, filter media and anything else it can stick to.
What I am supposed to do now with the two clowns and some corals (false corals), mushrooms and finger feather corals? dai
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Old 06-17-2008, 01:40 PM   #36
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I think it would be best for you and your animals to give them to some one that has an established tank or take them back to the LFS. Check your regional forums for folks close to you.
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Old 06-17-2008, 02:15 PM   #37
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Here's an out of the box suggestion. I'd ask others to weigh in.. You have a skimmer in you sump, right? Sooo.. move everything to the sump that you can. turn off the pump and maintain everyone in the sump. Cycle the tank, get the water parms back and move everyone back.

Luckily the clowns are known to be hardy. Their sad lot in life as people then choose them as the guinea pig of the cycle. The others might not make it anyway. Your cleanup crew (or what you can't catch) will be on their own.

Don't know if you ever said how big the sump was. Move the rocks with the shrooms and corals to the sump. Run that skimmer..

Unless you have a QT setup
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Old 06-17-2008, 02:37 PM   #38
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No where in this thread have I seen mention of the tank's temperature or heater(s).

What is the current tank temp? How stable is the temp during a 24 hour period?
Do you have a glass top or other solid cover on your tank?

You have a 125 gallon tank with 60 pounds of LR. The recommended amount of LR is 1 - 2 pounds per gallon. I have 180+ pounds of LR in my 125 tank.

You added a clean up crew for a 125 all in one shot. A clean up crew needs to be built up slowly as you increase the bioload in the tank.

You have attempted to instant cycle the tank, which has never worked to my knowledge. It's not your fault, you were just taking the advice of your lfs.

Now that you are here you are getting some very good advice from people who have no monetary incentive. The best adivice I ever got here was that 'Nothig Good ever happens fast in a SW tank".

You really should step back now and look to start your tank properly.
Take the remaining livestock back to the lfs and tell them they need to hold it for you or refund your money for now.

Get more rock. Base rock will do. Cycle your tank. Then start to add livestock slowly. I was advised to add just 1 fish a month, though there were times I added 2 at a time.

Step back, start over, go slow, and you will end up a succesful show piece aquarium.
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Old 06-17-2008, 02:42 PM   #39
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No where in this thread have I seen mention of the tank's temperature or heater(s).

What is the current tank temp? How stable is the temp during a 24 hour period?
Do you have a glass top or other solid cover on your tank?

You have a 125 gallon tank with 60 pounds of LR. The recommended amount of LR is 1 - 2 pounds per gallon. I have 180+ pounds of LR in my 125 tank.

You added a clean up crew for a 125 all in one shot. A clean up crew needs to be built up slowly as you increase the bioload in the tank.

You have attempted to instant cycle the tank, which has never worked to my knowledge. It's not your fault, you were just taking the advice of your lfs.

Now that you are here you are getting some very good advice from people who have no monetary incentive. The best adivice I ever got here was that 'Nothig Good ever happens fast in a SW tank".

You really should step back now and look to start your tank properly.
Take the remaining livestock back to the lfs and tell them they need to hold it for you or refund your money for now.

Get more rock. Base rock will do. Cycle your tank. Then start to add livestock slowly. I was advised to add just 1 fish a month, though there were times I added 2 at a time.

Step back, start over, go slow, and you will end up a succesful show piece aquarium.
Hi,

The tank does not have the heater since it is during hot blazing summer. I will get the heaters once fall kicks in. I have the glass tops on my tank. Regarding putting corals in the sump, I am confused since the water in the sump is the same as in the main tank right? Regarding the fish death, why did he die when ammonia is not even close at .25? Dai
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Old 06-17-2008, 03:00 PM   #40
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Any amount of ammonia is toxic to fish.

Glass tops on a SW tank is not the best idea. They prevent O2 exchange which helps keep your PH stable. Heaters are always a good idea to have running in your system . Do you check your water temp daily? What is it? What does it go down to at night?

You have been provided some very good suggestions. It sounds to me like your LFS is not as up-to-date with their information as they should be. Take the advice you have been given here and slow down some and start over. It will be much easier to do now rather then later.
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