Well I am an *beep* and didn't do my research. someone help!

[MattP725]

This is probably the most made NOOB mistake of all time... I overloaded the tank before it cycled... here is my info:
I am new to saltwater and just started my 55g about 2 weeks ago. I obviously was not very fluent in my terminoligy because I thought that cycling meant let the thing run for a week with the substrate until all the tests check out. OK I know I am stupid so here is the problem...
I bought a maroon clown and a shrimp (forgot the name but he was small and a translucent red). Everything was cool... all the tests were ok... PH was a tad high (8.4-8.5) but aquarium pharmaceuticals fixed that. So what do I do when I see that everything is going good but I have all this empty space? I buy a Niger Trigger... everything is still great... fish look happy... (btw he showed no interest in the shrimp in fact they were buddies it seemed). So now that that is going well two days ago I buy a Foxface Puffer (I think he is a foxface but he is yellow with stripes and dots). The puffer never seemed to take to the tank very well. Mind you I had been checking the salinity, temp, ph, ect before the puffer came. Last night I check the stats and the AM has skyrocketed. It is almost off the chart. I do a partial water change and add some more ammo lock. The Nitrate is also a tad high (I believe 10ppm) but not as big a deal as the AM. Anyways I awake this morning and the shrimp is dead... not surprising because the salinity was a bit towards the lower of the safe side combined with the high AM. All the others are still alive and don't seem to be in awful condition but I can tell they are not right. The Trigger is constantly sitting under a log.. the maroon clown looks not to bad although he seems to be fond of the top of the tank (he has always been though), but the puffer is kinda just floatin around mainly. I know that they don't eat everythign they get even when it is in small amounts so I am sure that contributed to the spike as well as the cycling.
Here is what I have done so far:
I added Stress Zyme, Ammo Lok, and Cycle (just got that today) to the tank. The Cycle I put in the canister as well. I added some Zeolite media in addition to new carbon but I left the foam media alone. I changed a good deal of water in small steps today also. I vacced the substrate (which is part sand bottom with crushed coral on top... sand is dead btw). The ammonia levels are still off the chart.. I know this isn't an immediate thing but I changed about 35% of the water... shouldn't I notice some difference? I refrained from feeding them today... it is better that they are hungry for a day than die (they had brine yesterday anyways so they should be fine).

Sorry this was so long but what do I do? I don't want to lose any more animals. Thanks in advance.
Matt

 

[fishman]

Im really confused by your posts in some parts but will make an attempt at answering it....If all of your levels were 0 after 1-2 weeks, then I would say your tank was cycled. BTW what did you use to cycle it? If you didnt use dead shrimp or LR and just put the fish in the tank, then I see where your coming from.
But if your tank never cycled and NOW is, I would say do water changes. Or do you have another tank (or friends tank) that you can get some LR or something to seed your tank??
The only other thing is to take the fish back to the place you bought them and see if they will hold them until your tank cycles...sorry I cant be more of a help..

 

[phases99]

Unfortunately now is the wrong time to be doing your research. But in order to best try to save your animals you need to somehow get an established filter system on that tank. See if your LFS (who should not have sold you these fish if you talked to them first) will give or sell you enough well established filter media to pack in your canister. Buy premade salt water from your LFS as using large amounts of just made saltwater will be bouncing your new tanks water parameters all over the place. You could also use at least 50lbs of 100% cured LR to quickly establish a biological filter. Do not feed at all as this will only increase the ammonia rate. Please do not buy any more living creatures before you do your homework, OK.

 

[quarryshark]

Yes agree with fishman, see if you can return your fish until you can get a cycle. They are just going to stress out big time, or possibly die in the process.
If you cannot do this, see if you can locate some "cured" live rock and I emphasize "cured". Uncured rock would just make matters worse. In the mean time, keep with the water changed.
Also do some reading on qt proceedures. This will help you with future purchases.

 

[MattP725]

I understand what you are saying. I never cycled it with live animals or rock before. Unfortunately I don't have much of a resource where I live. My only resources are petsmart (obviously not that helpful) and a really nice marine store that believe it or not is also not any help. They are like more of a theme park than a fish store. The only suggestion the guy could give me (and I asked about purchasing live rock or media to help with the process) was to buy stress zyme or cycle... when I said I had been using them and asked about the media he just directed me to a bag of live sand/water which is the same thing that petsmart sells. I could purchase that if it would help. Other than that I think I did everything I could... the fish seem to be doing better. I really would rather not move them back because they came from a petco (probably not the best place) about 45 min away and I am afraid that they won't take the distance too well in this condition. Despite the levels they seem to be doing ok for the moment. I did plan on doing the live rock thing though but I def want to read up on the curing/cleaning process before I go that route. Thanks for the help.

 

[quarryshark]

You can get LR here. With overnight shipping, an ammonia spike is not usually an issue.
http://www.liverocks.com
Great stuff, myself and many others on this board have used them. This would be a great fix to your problem.

 

[darb2]

I lived in brigantine in the early 90's. There was Arnolds on tilton rd, (near acrat)Where I bought my first setup. And a place on 40 in Pleasntville (I think) that only sold fish. I loved the place on 40.
Read thru the articles, and be ready to do frequent water changes.
Good luck

 

[Atari]

What are you using as a biofilter? Can you list all your equipment and water params?

 

[tmcpeek]

Take the fish back and start over. In my opinion a QT is a necessity and not an option. I was new to this and read this site daily for over a year and bought books to learn. I highly recommend the Concientious Marine Aquarist. This site is also a great resource. I know it is hard to have a tank with nothing in it but patience is so rewarding in the long run. Your tank will be much nicer if you go slowly and do your research. Good Luck

 

[Nitrate]

The maroon and trigger might actually survive the cycle, but will probably have long-term problems due to the stress. The puffer is probably doomed if you don’t get him out of the tank or get an established biofilter. If nobody will hold your fish for you then you should follow Quarryshark's advice and get at least 50 lbs of Liverocks.com rock shipped overnight.

 

[MattP725]

I lived in brigantine in the early 90's. There was Arnolds on tilton rd, (near acrat)Where I bought my first setup. And a place on 40 in Pleasntville (I think) that only sold fish. I loved the place on 40.
Read thru the articles, and be ready to do frequent water changes.
Good luck

The place on 40 is where I went... it is really nice looking but the guy just didn't seem to want to help much.

 

[MattP725]

I was looking into the rock thing. Is there a write up on how to clean or prepare the rock? Do I want to subject any inverts that may come with this to the high ammonia levels? Won't they just die and make things worse?

 

[lando]

At this point in time I think the best thing to do is remove all livestock and start over. I would stop waisting money on chemicals and additives, let the tank cycle naturally and properly. It does not seem like you have a lot invested in livestock right now so that is a good thing. Start over, start slow. Remember that when you add a fish you increase the bio-load of the tank and the bio filtration needs time to catch up. In a new tank introudce one fish, then wait a few weeks before adding another. Too many too fast will casue you big headaches (as you are finding out). Keep us posted and good luck...Lando

 

[electrikat]

Just my opinion from my own experience and others that I know, but I highly recommend NOT buying fish from Petco. They are well known around here for having bad problems with ich and consequently they keep copious quantities of copper products in their tanks to help control it. Just a thought.

 

[nodoubt471]

the petco where i live must be different, because some of my most long lived and beautiful and health fish have come from petco. in fact, i accredit the infestation of my tank with marine velvet to a specialty marine store (i learned about the value of QT fast on that one!). just make sure you know what your looking for in a fish, no matter where you buy it...

i agree that returning the fish would be the best idea for everybody. the petco probably wont be able to take them back, but maybe the other fish store you spoke of could.

also definitly go with the liverock, if you get liverock from most places you have to let it cycle but that doesnt seem to be an issue with LR from liverocks.com

i agree with lando, the fewer chemicals you add to your tank the better. natural is the best way.

good luck, keep us posted!

 

[quarryshark]

I was looking into the rock thing. Is there a write up on how to clean or prepare the rock? Do I want to subject any inverts that may come with this to the high ammonia levels? Won't they just die and make things worse?

The invert that live through the shipping will do fine. You ammonia level should level off soon after adding the rock. Of course you will continue the water changes until it levels off on its own.
I know the best thing for Matt would be to start over, but his fish are already stressed and moving them might make matters worse.
If you keep changing the water and get the rock, this may work out for you.