6 weeks in and need lots of answers

[bman]

I have recently started a fish tank six weeks ago. It is a 20 gallon tank with an over the wall filter(apparently big enough to handle a 30 gallon tank - guess I miscalculated the gallonage before buying the filter) 150 watt heater, and 4 inch long bubbler, double 4 foot fluorescent light 8 hours on, black the remaining hours.

After having the water circulated for a week, I added 2 mickey mouse platys, 2 - maroon swords, and an angel fish (yes I already know the angel fish is in a small tank, but I don't plan on having tons of fish)

Since the tank was not cycled, I thought this would be a good bio-load to get things rolling. Well, about three days into it, I lost 1 Mickey mouse. Tested the water and the ammonia level was very high. The next day one of the swords was lost. I did a water change to lower the ammonia level.

The water change was filling up a sterilized 5 gallon bucket with tap water, adding about 6 grains of sodium thiosulfate (To neutralize the Chlorine), and maybe 1/2 of a 1/4 teaspoon of pH Down to get the pH to 6.8. The water is COLD tap water. I used one of those gravel sucking siphon tubes and cleaned the bottom. Then used the siphon tube to put the water change water back into the tank.

Anyway, after week one the ammonia level started going down super slowly, and the nitrite level started creeping up. 1-1/2 weeks from the start date, my other sword died. At two weeks, I bought some more fish. Two more mickey mouse platys, and two mollys. Three weeks went by, and after weekly water changes, the nitrite level continued to rise.

Four weeks and one of the mollys got the ick. I called the LPS and they said to come in and but Quick Cure. They told me to use this for 7 days. I did my own research on the web and decided to do the treatment for 12 days and raise the temp to 82. (Was 80 normally) And to remove the carbon from the filter.

Sadly enough the Molly died and week 5, about 1 week into the treatment. I finished the treatment and did a water change at week 6. My readings on the tank are now(Present day)
pH - 7.0
Ammonia - 0
Nitrite - 4
Nitrate - Between 20 - 40

Now my remaining Molly has got ick on his eye. I looked into some posts in here, and have decided that I am going to try to kill the ick by raising the water temp to 86.

Now for the questions!!!!
Should I have a light come on at night?

For water changes, can cold water be added, or should I warm it to tank temp before adding?

When will my Nitrite level go down, it's been two weeks with elevated levels?

Did the Quick Cure kill my bacteria I was trying to establish?

What pH and tank temp should I be shooting for? 6.8 and 80deg?

Any suggestions are well appreciated!

 

[rich311k]

Do not put the light on at night. Fish like a day night cycle just like we do. Your nitrites should start coming down soon. I would do a water change 25% or more for the next several days, 4 is way to high for fish. A temp of about 80 is just fine. Do not worry about maintaining a certain PH level, steady is much better. Do no use those PH adjusting chemicals, they just make your PH bounce which is much worse for the fish. Add water to your tank which is the same temp as what is in the tank. You do not want to add cold water.

 

[Zagz]

I don't use a lite a nite, fish need a break from light IMO.

Water should be as close to tank temp as possible when adding.

The quick cure may have affected the bacterial cycle, best treatment for ich is slowly raise temps to 86-87 for 2 weeks past seeing the last ich spot.

A steady ph is better than messing with ph swings, leave your ph at whatever it is out of the tap.

Do water changes more often throughout a cycle. You may have to do them every 2 days to keep ammonia and nitrite levels from killing your fish.

Good luck.

*edit* Rich you type faster than I do LOL.

 

[bman]

Many thanks

Thank you two for responding so quickly.

How do I heat up the water for water changes?

So tap water pH is fine? I'm talking 7.4.

Will the Molly with ick on his eye die?

 

[rich311k]

Add hot water from the tap. Just mix hot and cold for the right temp. If you raise the water to 86 the molly should be OK. 7.4 is fine for most fish.

 

[dskidmore]

A light at night is not useful. In fact you are likely to get algae blooms if you provide too much light.

Warming the water first, or adding it very slowly (over a couple hours) will keep from temperature shocking the fish.

Your Nitrite level should go down. A cycle can take up to 8 weeks. Sounds like you're actually ahead of things on that score. Your bacteria are not dead, or else your ammonia levels would be rising again. You just didn't have many to start with.

Rather than using lots of chemicals to try to balance the pH of your water, you might be better off just letting the fish acclimate to the conditions you have. If you use chemicals, you will have to keep fighting the battle every time you do a water change, and if you make a mistake you get a sudden water chemistry change. Unless you're trying to breed a difficult species, or have really bad water, don't worry about it.

As for temperature, you may want to leave it up during the course of treatment. It increases metabolic rates, so it speeds up the course of the disease and the growth of your nitrite eating bacteria. Later you may want to look for fish profiles that give the tolerance ranges of all the fish you wish to keep, and pick a temperature they will all be comfortable with.

Is your nitrate going up yet? That is the final product of the cycle.

I suggest you don't get any more fish until the nitrite goes to 0. When you're ready, add a fish or two every week, to let the bacteria keep up with the increased bio-load.

You may wish to add to your 86 degrees treatment some non-iodized salt. (Aquarium, kosher, or sea salt.) 1 tsp per gallon, every 12 hours for 3 treatments, with 1 Tbsp per gallon in water change water. (It is especially important in your case to add the salt slowly, you don't want to shock your overloaded bacteria population.) The salt will help the fish with it's protective slime coating. This is safe for most fish and invertebrates, but is bad for many plants. I just cured one of my black skirt tetras with the heat and salt treatment, now waiting the extra 5 days to make sure he's clean before putting him back in my main aquarium.

 

[Zagz]

As Rich said raise the temp, do it slowly a degree every 12 hours. In an emergency you can raise it a bit faster, sometimes the risk of raising the temp is less than the ich. I once lost some clown loaches because I didn't want to raise the temps too fast. Good luck.

 

[dskidmore]

I type really slow with these stupid wrist braces on. Your post was unanswered when I started. :?

 

[bman]

Many Many Many Thanks!

Lots of good info, posted very quickly.

I may just have to stay in this forum. (LOL)

One last Q:

Will my silicone sealant go back to clear eventually?
Stupid Quick Cure, figures the LPS wouldn't tell me about just raising the water temp, instead of selling me some medicine. The same goes with the pH Adjuster.

I will have to think about the salt idea. If you are correct in your suggestions, 1 tbsp per gallon equals 20 tbsp! That's like 1-1/2cups!
Sounds like a lot of salt?

I was under the impression that using hot tap water was not a good thing to do, due to sediment or whatever from the hot water heater?

 

[rich311k]

I have used hot tap water for years with no problem. I am am not sure about the silicone. Did you reseal your tank?

 

[Lonewolfblue]

That is way too much salt. Look at the instructions on the aquarium salt you get. What is preferred is 1 TBSP per 10G water. And do the same with water changes. Just don't add directly to the tank, dissolve it in a large cup and pour it into the tank.

 

[bman]

Sorry. Guess I need to clarify the silicone thing. The Quick Cure's main ingredient is Malachite Green. Apparently, it stains the clear silicone sealant that the tank was made with a dark shade of blue.

 

[Lonewolfblue]

I'm not sure if the color is permanent or not. I've never used the stuff. Another suggestion, if you have any more fish problems, ask in this forum first, you will get excellent advice. Some lfs's are honest, but most just want to sell products. Get your advice here first, then go to the lfs.

 

[DeFeKt]

just like to say a couple of things.
Adding cold water simulates rainfall/winter climates, so as long as your not doing 100% water changes, which you wouldn't do anyway, they'll be ok.
Also, Raising the temp in your tank is easy, put the heater to the temp you want it and it will do the rest. The temp will raise slowly as the heater works harder. It won't shock your fish because it's being raised slowly as was said before.

As for the silicon, I think it's stained from now on in..no biggy

Matt.

 

[DeFeKt]

oh and remember warmer water hold less oxygen, so you may need more air being pumped through.

 

[bman]

In regards to the salt thing, I was just going to use Kosher salt, instead of buying "aquarium salt", as I hear they are the same thing.

So now, 1 tbsp per 10 gal. Were looking at 2 tbsp. Now that sounds, well, Kosher! (Sorry, had to use the stupid pun there, it fit so well!)

 

[Lonewolfblue]

In my 26G, I used 3 TBSP's.

For you, I'd do 2 1/2TBSP's and maintain 86-87 degrees temp for 2 weeks after the last sign of ick has left. And 1 tbsp per 10G for water changes. If you change 5G, then a half tablespoon.

 

[Hoovercat]

I'm thinking the quick cure had Malachite green or Methtlene blue and stained his silicone. The color will fade over time but I can't recall if it ever goes away completely.

 

[dskidmore]

For general stress relief, I use that lower salt dose, but I used the higher salt dose for treating Ick. Some websites even recomend up to 6-8 teaspoons per gallon for some fish species.

Aquarium, sea, and kosher salt aren't all exactly the same thing, but close enough. They are all non-iodized and contain alot of chloride ions.

 

[dskidmore]

Also, Raising the temp in your tank is easy, put the heater to the temp you want it and it will do the rest. The temp will raise slowly as the heater works harder. It won't shock your fish because it's being raised slowly as was said before.

That depends on how powerful your heater is and how strong the current in the tank. If the indicator light is staying steady on while you're trying to raise the temperature slowly, then you might be able to say that. If the light blinks off before the hour is up, on a one degegree change, then the thermostat is kicking in, and the heater is capapble of heating your water too fast.