Added established media: Tank still not cycling

[firteen888]

Hey all,

After a month of my tank not cycling, my friend gave me an established sponge from his tank. Can you guys take a look at my filter setup and let me know if I'm doing something wrong? The sponge has been in for about 18 hours now and my ammonia STILL hasn't budged (and no nitrites/nitrates). And now my tank has filthy water, is this normal? Am I doing something wrong?? I thought adding established media to the filter would cause an almost instant cycle?

I labelled where I have everything in my filter, including a floss media that came with it, ceramic media, and the established sponge.

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Thanks as usual!

 

[jetajockey]

it still takes time for the bacteria to colonize and start doing its job, What's your ammonia level at?

I've only attempted to do the established media route once with a fishless cycle, and I ended up having to drop the ammonia level down below 1 through water changes before I saw any results.

 

[firteen888]

My ammonia level is at 4ppm. Should I do a large PWC?

 

[jetajockey]

I would. Larger concentrations of ammonia can actually slow down or even stall the bacteria. 4ppm isn't really too high of a # for that, but it seems like it makes things easier when the ammonia level is lower. If you are fishless cycling, you can just add more ammonia anyway if it starts processing it like it should.

 

[firteen888]

Ok, I'll do a 50% pwc

- is it normal for the established sponge to make the tank water so dirty? That's not bad is it?

- how long should my cycle take now?

- does everything in the filter look correct? Anything I should change?

Thanks

 

[jetajockey]

yes its normal, a gunky filter is good lol. it'll settle out eventually.

I can't say how long it'll take, it'd be a total guess.

It looks ok to me, I've done that method before and it can be hit and miss, but generally it works. I just move established sponge filters around now.

 

[firteen888]

Hit or miss, really? I thought it was a guaranteed way to cycle a tank

 

[jetajockey]

Don't get me wrong, it's a good method, its just not a guaranteed one. There are all kinds of factors in play so with all the variables its hard to determine an exact outcome.

 

[James_in_MN]

I labelled where I have everything in my filter, including a floss media that came with it, ceramic media, and the established sponge.

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Thanks as usual!

I'm surprised you were able to cram that much into an Aqueon Quietflow. I can't imagine trying to take any of that media out to rinse it off every so often.

I just switched from Aqueon Quietflows to AquaClears in both my 20g and 10g tanks, and recommend you do the same. Before you even complete your cycle and start adding fish is a great time to do it too.

The walls of the filter media of a Quietflow are pretty thin, and don't hold a candle to the filter media of an AquaClear. They also imbedded carbon directly in the center of the media, which is only necessary to remove medicines from a tank and will remove any liquid fertilizer you add.

The fact that you crammed ceramic rings into that so-called bio holster tells me that you don't trust the biological filtration of that filter, as I didn't. I used Fluval Chi foam pads placed between the bio holster and the outflow of the tank.

You don't have to switch filters if you don't want to, but I'll bet that when you compare the hassle you'll probably have rinsing off your filter media to the large basket size of the AquaClear, or when you compare the thin walls of the Quietflow filter media to that of the AquaClear, you'll end up switching down the road.

 

[firteen888]

Hey James. I have heard good things about the aqua clear, but right now I'm gonna stick with what I have. I figure I'll let this tank cycle (if it ever does) and let my media gain the BB it needs and prob down the line switch to the aqua clear (using most of my current media, as not to lose the BB). Based on some recommendations, I DID remove the carbon from my mechanical media, so I don't have to worry about that.

 

[firteen888]

As mentioned above, after putting the established sponge in my tank, the water became filthy dirty. As of last night it was still kind of dirty although the filter cleaned it pretty well. As of this morning, my tank was CRYSTAL CLEAR! Clearer than it's been since setting it up. I tested and my readings still haven't changed (ammonia still the same, no nitrites/nitrates). Is this a good or bad sign that this happened? I was under the impression that the cloudy water was the bacteria, but now it's gone and my readings are the same. Can anyone explain this?

Thanks,

 

[eco23]

As mentioned above, after putting the established sponge in my tank, the water became filthy dirty. As of last night it was still kind of dirty although the filter cleaned it pretty well. As of this morning, my tank was CRYSTAL CLEAR! Clearer than it's been since setting it up. I tested and my readings still haven't changed (ammonia still the same, no nitrites/nitrates). Is this a good or bad sign that this happened? I was under the impression that the cloudy water was the bacteria, but now it's gone and my readings are the same. Can anyone explain this?

Thanks,

The bacteria are surface adherers, so during the bacterial bloom they are basically looking for a surface to cling to. If the water was milky and has now cleared up...that should mean they've settled down and are beginning to colonize. All good news

 

[firteen888]

The bacteria are surface adherers, so during the bacterial bloom they are basically looking for a surface to cling to. If the water was milky and has now cleared up...that should mean they've settled down and are beginning to colonize. All good news

 

[eco23]

Personally I'd suggest bumping the ammo level back up to 4ppm. The purpose of a fishless cycle is to establish a bio-filter capable of handling a full stock of fish. If you cycle it at 1ppm you'll likely have mini-cycles and see ammonia spikes when you add fish.

 

[firteen888]

Personally I'd suggest bumping the ammo level back up to 4ppm. The purpose of a fishless cycle is to establish a bio-filter capable of handling a full stock of fish. If you cycle it at 1ppm you'll likely have mini-cycles and see ammonia spikes when you add fish.

I appreciate the advice, and I'm sure you're right....but here's the problem I have (and I think most people have) with this. I think the majority of us newbies would agree that it's pretty darn hard to read the API test kit for ammonia. The difference in greens is so minimal, and the color of the test tube can change completely depending on how you hold it. Now the problem is, I believe the reason my cycling hasn't been working is because I've been overdosing on the ammonia. Even though it looks like it COULD be at 4ppm, at other angles it could easily be a 6 or 7ppm, I just can't tell. So while I'm waiting patiently for my tank to cycle, it's not working bc I've prob been overdosing.

With that said, on this latest dousing, rather than aiming for 4ppm and going over, I aimed for btw 2-3ppm. I prob hit about 2.5ppm, and that's where it's been for the past few days. I figured I would leave it at this and wait for it to drop, (rather than overdose and get stalled) then try and douse it back up to 3ppm or so.

The problem with aiming for 4ppm is that's it's just too hard to determine if you put an accurate amount in without going over. I think this is a problem that many people have without realizing it.I hope this makes sense, lol.

 

[eco23]

I appreciate the advice, and I'm sure you're right....but here's the problem I have (and I think most people have) with this. I think the majority of us newbies would agree that it's pretty darn hard to read the API test kit for ammonia. The difference in greens is so minimal, and the color of the test tube can change completely depending on how you hold it. Now the problem is, I believe the reason my cycling hasn't been working is because I've been overdosing on the ammonia. Even though it looks like it COULD be at 4ppm, at other angles it could easily be a 6 or 7ppm, I just can't tell. So while I'm waiting patiently for my tank to cycle, it's not working bc I've prob been overdosing.

With that said, on this latest dousing, rather than aiming for 4ppm and going over, I aimed for btw 2-3ppm. I prob hit about 2.5ppm, and that's where it's been for the past few days. I figured I would leave it at this and wait for it to drop, (rather than overdose and get stalled) then try and douse it back up to 3ppm or so.

The problem with aiming for 4ppm is that's it's just too hard to determine if you put an accurate amount in without going over. I think this is a problem that many people have without realizing it.I hope this makes sense, lol.

That's fine. The number doesn't need to be exact but shooting for 1ppm would be asking for trouble. Unless the ammo level is ridiculously high it won't cause any stall (or lack of starting) to the cycle. It is simply more difficult to watch the small changes in levels when it is super high.

If you see other threads where people do fish-in cycles, the ammonia level can climb very high and very fast when you have fish. You want to ensure the biofilter is capable of handling high levels of ammonia, otherwise it defeats the purpose of fishless cycling and you'll run into issues when you start stocking.

 

[firteen888]

I'm def shooting for higher than 1ppm. Is 3ppm acceptable?

 

[eco23]

I'm def shooting for higher than 1ppm. Is 3ppm acceptable?

Yep that'd be fine. 4 would be better though, lol. I understand the difficulty reading the test levels though.