Advice Needed On Fishless Cycling

[nugget6476]

This is my first post so bear with me if I do something wrong.

Tank Details

My Tank is a 130L (35 Gallon) Tank, 90cm high, 36cm wide, 42cm high, Aqua One 150w Heater, Aqua One Hangon Filter (dont know the size 400 or 500 maybe), Aqua One Light and an air stone. I have a natural looking fine gravel, 4 plants growing in there, with one probably going to die as I accidently broke it from its roots (oops). I am going to go out to our river and find some nice pieces of wood for the aquarium at some stage as well as more plants. No added Bacteria from other tanks, unless store plants had some on them.

Cycling Question & Log So Far

I purchased my first ever tropical aquarium setup on the 4th of Aug and I decided after lots of reading and research to give fishless cycling a go. This is my log from the first week of trying to do it on my own.

Aug 4th

Set the tank up and let run for 1 and a half days

Aug 6th

Added 7.5ml of ammonia to the the dechorinated water, tested and it read 2 or 3ppm after 1 hour, the temp was only on 22 degrees C. I then added another 7.5mls to get to 5ppm but this may of been a bit excessive looking back. The PH was 7.2 ( no added Ammonia since this date)

Aug 7th

Ammonia 5ppm (maybe more) PH 7.2 Temp Turned up to 24 degrees C

Aug 8th

Ammonia 5ppm (maybe more) PH 7.2 Nitrite Possibly 0.1mg/L probably 0 Temp Turned up to 26 degrees C

Aug 9th

Ammonia 5ppm PH not tested Temp 26

Aug 10th

Ammonia 5ppm PH not tested Temp 26

Aug 11th

Ammonia 5ppm PH 7.0 ish Nitrite first real reading,defenitly a colour change to a reddy colour at least 1.0mg/L Temp 26 Nitrates 0

Aug 12th

Ammonia 5ppm PH 6.8ish (maybe lower, worried that it was stalling) Nitrites more than 2.0mg/L alot redder Temp 26

Decided to do a 50% water change as the drop in PH and the constant Ammonia level might of meant it had stalled or something

Tested 3 hours later, Ammonia 0.5 or 1ppm PH 7.2 Nitrite 1.0mg/L

Now Im waiting until tomorow to see what happens next, I have no idea if im doing the right things for the Fishless Cycle, I could be doing it wrong for all i know im only going on the very little knowlege I have, I know i need to get the Ammonia and Nitrite hitting 0 in a 12 hour period consistantly before adding fish, just getting there is the problem. I joined this site to see if anyone has any advice for me or can help me do this right, It would suck to start all over again. Hopefully some people have been through similar situations to me and know how to get it right.

Any help would be greatly apprciated

Kallan

 

[tamtam]

You seem to be on a good start. The water change was a good move to up the PH. Usually Ph needs to go to the low 6s to stall but doing it now is a good move. I doubt you stalled, the cycle is just a long and frustrating process some time. A week with no serious drop in ammo isn't a huge deal.


Now that your ammonia dropped with the water change you need to dose it back up. I'd take care and only go to 3-4 this time. If your ammo reading is off the chart it's hard to know what exactly if anything is going on. Just keep testing that Ph to make sure it doesn't crash. Once you really start to see nitrites than your ammo will drop. The first conversion from ammo to nitrite is a lot quicker than from nitrite to nitrates.

Remember the average cycle can take 6-8 weeks so yor about a week it. Things seem to sound pretty good though. Just keep that PH where it needs to be, that ammonia up to supply the bacteria and keep an eye for those nitrites. They should start rising in the next week by the sounds of it.

 

[librarygirl]

You're only about a week in; it can take about 2 weeks to see a drop in ammonia. Showing nitrites already is a good sign though (assuming your tap water has 0 nitrite).

If you can bump up the temp to 86 F (30 C) that would help a bit but if not that's fine. Make sure the tank has good water movement either from water splashing down from the filter or an air stone.

It's possible you overdosed ammonia a bit. What's the % of ammonium hydroxide (it should say on the bottle)? Here's an ammonia calculator that will tell you how many ml to add to get to the target of 4 ppms of ammonia: Calculator

You did well by doing a water change when the PH started dropping; if it drops too much (in the mid-low 6's) it can cause a stall. You might want to test your tap PH: test it out of the tap and then let it sit out in a glass for 24 hours occasionally stirring it up. After 24 hours test PH again and see what it is; this will be your true PH and what your tank's PH should be (for example my PH out of the tap is 8.4 but once it gasses out it goes down to 7.2 which is what my tank's PH is). If Ph keeps dropping you might want to add something natural to buffer it like crushed coral or argonite but let's see what your PH test comes out to and how the tank's PH holds.

Right now it's pretty much a waiting game; keep ammonia to about 4. When it starts dropping to <2, redose it back up to 4. Keep an eye on PH and nitrite.

Also what test kit are you using?

 

[nugget6476]

Thanks tamtam and Library Girl,

Yea I will top up the ammonia slowly to 3 or 4ppm and now just keep testing everything and waiting for it to drop I guess. The calculator says 4mls for my tank to get is to 3ppm. I only have it on 26 degrees because of the plants, I dont know how high I can go unless I cook them. The only ammonia I could find is clouded ammonia that says 20 g/L Ammonia (as NH3), it dosnt froth up and dosnt seem to have anything added to it so I assumed its ok. The test kits are Aqua One Quick drop Nitrite and Nitrate, AquaMaster Freshwater PH Test Kit, and Aquasonc Ammonia Test Kit, being from Australia you might not have those there.

 

[nugget6476]

Hi Everyone,


This is a follow on from my first post about my cycle, I would like to know anyones thoughts or advice of what is happening and how close im getting to becoming cycled =) the temp is at a constant 26 degrees celius.

Aug 13th - 8am

Ammonia - 0.5ppm
Nitrite - 2.0mg/l (which is the highest reading)
PH - 6.9ish
Nitrate - not tested

Dosed with 4mls of Ammonia as well as 1 teaspoon of PH up

Aug 13th - 3pm


Ammonia - 2ppm
Nitrite - not tested
PH - 7.4ish
Nitrate - not tested


Aug 14th - 8:30am

Ammonia - 1ppm
Nitrite - alot higher than 2.0mg/l
PH - 7.2
Nitrate - some slight colour maybe

Dosed with 5mls of Ammonia

Aug 15th - 8am

Ammonia - 1 or 2 ppm
Nitrite - Higher than 2.0mg/l (nearly purple)
PH - 7.2
Nitrate - some sight colour maybe

Dosed with 4mls of Ammonia

Aug 16th - 7:30am

Ammonia - 0.5 or 1ppm
Nitrite - still over 2.0 and purplish
PH - 7.2
Nitrate 0

Dosed with 3mls of Ammonia

Aug 17th - 5pm

Ammonia - 0ppm
Nitrite - still over 2.0, pinky purple
PH - 7.2
Nitrate - 0

Dosed with 6mls of Ammonia, checked again at 7:30pm and was under 2ppm so dosed with another 3mls

Aug 18th - 9:30am

Ammonia - 0 or maybe 0.5ppm
Nitrite - 1 or 2ppm not as high as before
PH - 7.2
Nitrate - 0

Dosed with 7.5mls of Ammonia


So am I still on the right track?, my PH seems to be holding well for now, and my Ammonia is droping down each day. I am concerned im not getting and Nitrate readings though, could the 5 plants in the tank be removing the Nitrates? thats my only guess why im not getting any reading by now, I hope they are doing that for me. If my Ammonia and Nitrite decide to start going to 0 each day and still no Nitrates can I assume its Cycled and just do the big water change and add my fish?, Any help or advice is welcome =), i hope my Log can help others with their cycles.

Thanks

 

[tamtam]

you're cycle hasn't been happening very long, it's been about 2 weeks?

I'd say you just aren't seeing nitrates yet and should probably start to see them in perhaps another week or 2. You typically don't see those until further into your cycle after your ammonia drops.

Remember a typical cycle lasts 6-8 weeks. Give or take depending on specifics of the cycle but I'm sure you will see nitrates at some point in the future as things progress.

 

[librarygirl]

Loos good actually. Ammonia is starting to be fully converted within 24 hours of dosing (just a note: only dose ammonia once per day even if you test more often and it's already 0) and your nitrites are rising. I wouldn't worry about nitrate yet; once the nitrite bacteria become more established it should be converted to nitrate. But check the directions on your nitrate test. I'm not familiar with the ones you have but I know for the one we use (API Master) the bottles need to be shaken vigorously and the tube needs to be shaken for a full minute to get accurate results, so just double-check the instructions and maybe shake the bottles before you use them anyway to mix the agents in the bottles.

 

[nugget6476]

Hey everyone,

Here is an update on my Fishless Cycling, Temp still at 26 degrees

Aug 19th

Ammonia - 0ppm
Nitrite - 1mg/L
PH - 7.0
Nitrate - 0

Dosed with 10mls of Ammonia

Aug 20th - 8am

Ammonia - 0ppm
Nitrite - 0.5mg/L
PH - 6.8
Nitrate - 0

Dosed with 10mls of Ammonia & half teaspoon of PH up

Checked at 7pm and Ammonia was 0ppm, added another 10mls Ammonia

Aug 21st - 7:30am

Ammonia - 0.5ppm
Nitrite - 1 or 0.5mg/L
PH - 6.7 or 6.8
Nitrate - 0

Did a 50% water Change

Aug 21st - 5pm

Ammonia - 0ppm
Nitrite - 1 or 2mg/L
PH - 7.1
Nitrate - 0

Dosed with 12mls of Ammonia

Aug 22nd - 9:am

Ammonia - 0ppm
Nitrite - 1mg/l
PH - 6.7 or 6.8 ( I added in my piece of wood a few days beforehand I think for the drop in PH)
Nitrate - 0

Dosed with 12mls of Ammonia and 1 tspn of PH up

Aug 23rd - 9am

Ammonia - 0ppm
Nitrite - 1 or 2mg/L
PH - 7.4
Nitrate - 0

Dosed with 12mls of Ammonia

Aug 24th - 7:30am

Ammonia - 0ppm
Nitrite - 2mg/L
PH - 7.2
Nitrate - 0

Dosed with 12mls of Ammonia

Aug 25th - 8:30am

Ammonia - 0ppm
Nitrite - 0.5mg/L
PH - 7.0
Nitrate - 0

Dosed with 12mls of Ammonia, quarter tspn PH up

Aug 26th - 1pm

Ammonia - 0ppm
Nitrite - 0 or 0.1mg/L
PH - 7.2
Nitrate - 0

Dosed with 12mls of Ammonia


So from what I see my tank is able to destroy the Ammonia very well (which im guessing is the most important thing), and the nitrites are now coming under control, I think either the test kit for Nitrates is faulty or the plants are absorbing them or something, and Nitrates ive read are not that big an issue anyway.....would I be fine to add in some fish that im after in 3 days time?...... I dont know if im meant to start a new post but I have an idea of what types of fish I want to put in my tank and if anyone is interested in giving me advice on that I will post that question after this.

Thanks

 

[librarygirl]

Seems to be close to cycled if not already. I'd keep dosing and checking for at least a few days to be sure nitrites don't spike up again. If you want to mention what fish you're interested in we can help with stocking ideas. ALso no need to use PH up or anything with fish in the tank. Cycling can cause PH drops; usually a large water change would bring the levels back up but without fish it's OK to add some PH chemicals, once you get fish they shouldn't be needed though.

 

[nugget6476]

Thanks Libarygirl =)

It's awsome that I can finally start doing the fun part =)

So for this is what I have have imagined for my tank, I have been using AqAdvisor, but I would love a second opinion before I committ to it.

Cardinal Tetra - 10
Borneo Sucker - 1 or 2
Peppered Cory - 4
Honey Gourami - 2 or 4
Guppy - 4 or 6
Cherry or Glass shrimp 6 or 10
and one other school of Tetra, maybe 10 Glowlight Tetra or 6 Rummynose or something?

Will the Peppered Cory be ok on 3 to 5ml gravel? I know I keep reading they prefer sand and its not good for their barbels on gravel, but if you have any advice on that it would be great. If I cant use them what could I replace them with. I have read Borneo Suckers can get a bit aggressive or terrotorial as they get older, is that true and would it be safe to put themin my tank?. I am also open to suggestions for that second school of Tetra of what would go well with the rest.

I hope their are not any conflicting fish there the AqAdvisor says its all ok but yea I dont know how much I can trust that, I would love to have all those fish though.

Thanks

 

[nugget6476]

Oh also, It their a specific order I should put them in? How many can I put in at once?

 

[nugget6476]

Why did my Nitrites go up again today =(

Aug 27th - 8:30am

Ammonia - 0ppm
Nitrite - 1 or 2mg/L
PH - 6.8/6.9
Nitrate - 0

Should I skip the Ammonia today and just do the big full water change so that it will hopefully be ready?

 

[nugget6476]

Aug 27th - 10am

Large 80-90% water change

Aug 27th - 11am

Ammonia - 0ppm
Nitrite - 0.1mg/L
PH - 7.2/7.4
Nitrate - not tested

Dosed with 4mls Ammonia

Aug 28th - 7am

Ammonia - 0ppm
Nitrite - 0mg/L
PH - 6.8/6.9
Nitrate - not tested

Dosed with 4mls

If the Fish shop has what I am looking for today I am going to buy one set of fish and hope for the best, if not I will order them online and in which case will mean the tank cycles for another few days or week while I wait for them to arrive. I'm hoping things will go fine.

 

[nugget6476]

Aug 28th - 7pm
Another Update,

I purchased 4 Peppered Corydoras and 2 honey Gourami for my tank yesterday, put them in at around 7pm, they all seem quite happy and very active and busy =) no signs of stress at all.


Aug 29th - 7am

Ammonia - 0ppm
Nitrite - 0mg/L
PH - 6.8/6.9
Nitrate - not tested

The fish are still alive and happy =), i will now look at ordering the other fish for my tank =)

Im still thinking of

10 Cardinal Tetra
2 Borneo Sucker
maybe another 2 Honey Gourami
5 or 6 male Guppies
and another school of Tetra, maybe 10 Glowlights or 10 Rummynose or maybe Silvertips or something

Does that sound pretty good?

Thanks