Cloudy water, high ammonia despite daily water changes

[WeMightBeCrazy]

((You can skip the first paragraph if you don't feel like reading))

Let me start off by saying hello everyone, while I'm not new to fish, I am new to properly taking care of them. I was raised by a father who broke just about every aquarium rule there is. Mixing unfriendly fish, freezing cold water, feeding three times a day, cleaning by putting fish in a bucket of untreated tap water and scrubbing tank/decorations with dish soap... yeah. It was bad. So I literally had NO idea there was all this special stuff you had to do. Fast forward to a month ago when we accidentally won three goldfish at the carnival. I thought they'd be good first pets for my two year old so we kept them. Assuming at least one would die (carnival fish after all) and being limited on space I got a small tank for all three. I was not prepared, had no idea about cycling, etc. Que the problems.


I have a 5 gallon tank with three goldfish. Yes I know that's VERY overstocked. Can't do anything about it right now. I will be getting a bigger tank as soon as we can. In the meantime I want to know what I can do to help my fish. I do have a filter, air stone, and have treated the water. The tank was not cycled. The ammonia is testing SUPER high, the water is cloudy, and the fish have just begun bottom sitting and gulping at the surface. I have been doing DAILY water changes of about 50%. It's not helping.

Here are my questions. Will a filter designed for a bigger tank help? Do I need a second air stone? Is my cloudy water due to bacteria trying to eliminate the ammonia or just dirty? Should I stop the water changes and let the bacteria grow and do their thing? Or should I increase water changes since the fish seem to be suffering? Should I get some Safe Start? Help! Lol I've been reading SO MUCH all the info seems contradictory.

 

[Magnum 350]

Are you using municipal water that is treated with chloromine if you are you have to treat this water before your water changes. Public water treated with choromine will have ammonia.

 

[WeMightBeCrazy]

Are you using municipal water that is treated with chloromine if you are you have to treat this water before your water changes. Public water treated with choromine will have ammonia.

Thank you for your reply! I have municipal water, yes, but I do treat the new water before each change. The only thing I have not done yet is test the water for ammonia after treating before adding it. I plan to do that today out of curiosity.

 

[WeMightBeCrazy]

Thank you for your reply! I have municipal water, yes, but I do treat the new water before each change. The only thing I have not done yet is test the water for ammonia after treating before adding it. I plan to do that today out of curiosity.

Had some treated water waiting for today's change. Tested it and its fine.

 

[Pat N]

The tank needs to balance out,3 small goldfish in 5 gal. isn't that bad,as you have a filter and airstone. As they get larger they will need a larger tank.Stop taking out water and let it balance. Don't over feed. If you feel you have to take out water only take out 10%,and don't clean the gravel yet.

 

[Fresh2o]

The tank needs to balance out,3 small goldfish in 5 gal. isn't that bad,as you have a filter and airstone. As they get larger they will need a larger tank.Stop taking out water and let it balance. Don't over feed. If you feel you have to take out water only take out 10%,and don't clean the gravel yet.

How is limiting water changes going to balance things out? The fish are constantly producing ammonia which is already high to begin with. At this point, water changes are the only thing that will reduce the levels as the filter is still too immature to effectively process that much ammonia.
50% water changes are not harmful.


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[WeMightBeCrazy]

This is exactly my problem. Every bit of advice is contradictory. Stop changing water to allow bacteria to grow and tank to cycle... but that will take too long and kill the fish due to the high ammonia levels...so do the water changes... but that will keep the tank from cycling and continue the problem.

So has anyone corrected a high ammonia problem in a new, uncycled tank? How? My current plan of action is keep doing the water changes (it seems to revitalize the fish), get a stronger filter, and add some SafeStart bacteria. Is this a good or a bad plan?

 

[plantnoob]

Yes, lot of contradictory opinions. Here's another one.

Your plan to consistently change water on a regular basis is sound. The bacteria you want grows on solid surfaces - substrate, tank walls, filter media. There is little floating around in the water. That's the reason water changes are allowed but new filter media is not in an established aquarium. So keep the filter media you already have. Do not get rid of it, it should have the most amount of bacteria at the moment. You are welcome to supplement it with additional filtration, but your current problem is biological filtration, not debris.

Mixed reviews on bacteria from the store. Contention is that the bacteria in bottles is mostly the anaerobic kind, not what you want in your aquarium. Your best bet is to get bacteria laden water from an established tank, preferably squeezed out of a sponge filter or something like that. You can beg and plead (or even pay) your LFS for some. Maybe one of your friends has some.

Whatever you do, don't stop the water changes.

Hope this helps.


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[plantnoob]

One other thing is to measure nitrites. In my experience, fish are mush less tolerant to nitrites than ammonia. And you'll soon see a spike in nitrites. When that happens, a higher than normal dose of Seachem Prime (see recommended dosage in pack) can help to some extent. It helped me when I once accidentally introduced a mini cycle in my tank. I usually don't recommend spending money on fancy chemicals, but this is somewhat of a Hail Mary.


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[WeMightBeCrazy]

Yes, lot of contradictory opinions. Here's another one.

Your plan to consistently change water on a regular basis is sound. The bacteria you want grows on solid surfaces - substrate, tank walls, filter media. There is little floating around in the water. That's the reason water changes are allowed but new filter media is not in an established aquarium. So keep the filter media you already have. Do not get rid of it, it should have the most amount of bacteria at the moment. You are welcome to supplement it with additional filtration, but your current problem is biological filtration, not debris.

Mixed reviews on bacteria from the store. Contention is that the bacteria in bottles is mostly the anaerobic kind, not what you want in your aquarium. Your best bet is to get bacteria laden water from an established tank, preferably squeezed out of a sponge filter or something like that. You can beg and plead (or even pay) your LFS for some. Maybe one of your friends has some.

Whatever you do, don't stop the water changes.

Hope this helps.


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Thank you! I forgot to add that I won't be replacing the filter, just adding a stronger one. I will leave the current filter in place. I appreciate the suggestion, I will have to look into that as well. I don't currently have anything to test nitrates but I will pick something up today. I am hesitant about the bacteria still but I know I need to do something other than the water changes because I've been doing them and it hasn't helped.

 

[plantnoob]

Nitrates are fine, it's nitrites that we need to worry about.


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[WeMightBeCrazy]

Sorry, that's what I meant. My phone doesn't seem to like that word lol.

 

[WeMightBeCrazy]

Well... my fish are dying. One has lost half its scales and all its fins and has started floating. The others are still bottom sitting and their fins are dissolving. I don't know what else to do.

 

[plantnoob]

Hey, sorry to hear that. I'd say you're doing everything you can. The fact that you're here proves it. But even on an established tank, 3 goldfish is a bit too much for 5 gal. Ammonia is hard on their gills and the fishes may end up dying even if the tank gets cycled. Nitrites are worse. You can ask the store if they'd take it back (for free of course). Otherwise, not much to do. Keep with the water changes and hope they survive the cycle. Obviously you've learnt a lot now. Start fresh with a fishless cycling process and find appropriate residents for your tank.


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[WeMightBeCrazy]

Thanks. I think I figured out the problem. I checked my filter again today and it was VERY clogged with dissolving food pellets. Like a ton of them all clumped up. I asked my other family members about it and apparently my two year old accidentally dumped a bunch of food in one morning a few days ago. I checked around the plants and found two more clumps of dissolving food. Ugh. I've cleaned out the debris, changed all the water, vaccuumed the gravel and added some bacteria. I have a friend bringing some from her own established tank as well. Two of the fish seem much better already but I'm afraid it's probably too late for the third. Its upsetting but at the same time it will be better for the other two if they survive. Thank you all for the help. I'll update in a few days.

 

[miseryindex]

Random related question. I'm in a similar situation with a 30g tank. If I do daily water changes do I still use the same additives in the same quantity after each time? Like aquarium salt and the water treatment for the chlorine?