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Old 03-25-2012, 07:56 AM   #1
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Goldfish Zen . Wanting utopia for them.

Calling on the Fancy obsessed............ I have recently set up my first large tank. For me large is a 55 gallon long. My three fancies new zen paradise. I have been fish keeping for about four years now. I really have been flying by the seat of my pants for the most part. My saving grace I think with my goldfish has been that I keep up on water changes. Well I am fish grown up now....and want to try and do it all by the books. I even converted to the API liquid test kit last week. With that said I have read all the fish less cycling articles but.................I know my personality and am still going to need some talking through with it all. I am hoping for advice and suggestions.
I set the tank up on March 20 th.
Lets talk filters here first..........Currently The new 55gallon tank is set up to fish less cycle with an Emperor 400 (says for up to 90 gallons). My current 29gallon has a penguin 200. When the 55 is ready I plan on adding the penguin 200 to it as well. Will this be adequate filtration for this new set up? I just don't want it to be ok. I want it to do the job well. The new tank will probably be stocked with a total of four fancies is all. My only concern is producing too much current for them in the tank.
What I have added so far................................
The substrate is large sized gravel mostly marble sized since I know goldies are choking prone. I know many goldfish keepers prefer bare bottom but I personally don't care for the look of it. My tank is a main focal point in my living room. I also added a large air stone in the corner and a bubble wand in the center of the tank. Would you suggest more or less? My concern is not to create too stimulating of an environment between the two filters and the air stones.
OK now for the overly discussed beaten to death topic of cycling................
As I said I am doing a fish less cycle. It took me three days of dosing ammonia to get it 4ppm. I was afraid of putting in too much so I did it a few cap full s at a time over a two day period accompanied with a pinch or two of ground up flakes. By Wednesday night the 21 st I was at 4 ppm. Have I read and understand correctly that now I am at the point where I just sit and wait for the ammonia to start dropping? I figures that on the 28th I would start testing for nitrites. Am I on the right track so far? (Please humor me I need the encouragement)
Well thats it for now........Thank you in advance..............
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Old 03-25-2012, 01:57 PM   #2
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Thats wonderful news that your setting up a new home!!! Ok, between the 200 & 400, you'll be running about 600gph which fits the criteria for 10x the tank size. I actually run two 400gph filters (emperor & aqueon) on each of my big tanks plus 2 powerheads each & 2 sets of bubble wands each. Current isnt an issue or a problem even with sand bottoms. I do have filter foam (sponges) over the intakes of the filters & powerheads because I have run into an issue with my one fish getting stuck to intake once & now its a safety precaution. I do have the tanks filled to their max as well to dampen the outflow as well. Your filters are sufficent but if you want to add another, bigger HOB (instead of the 200 & keep your present tank up & running), this will be up to you.

Ok, fishless cycling- what type of ammonia are you using? Ill link the ammonia calculator (you need to know the % amm) so you will be able to accurately dose ammonia in the future. A pinch of ground flakes here & there is fine but dont make a habit of adding them because they can turn moldy & nasty. For now, just sit back & wait for your amm to start dropping. Make sure you are monitoring your ph as well for any changes. When your amm hits 2ppm, time to add enough to bring it back up to 4ppm. If you have any questions, dont hesitate to ask!

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Old 03-25-2012, 06:01 PM   #3
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Hi!
So you have an established tank?
Just so you know you can move all existing filters and the fish straight over to the new tank. It will be instantly cycled then.
If you plan on doing a fishless still add some of the filter media from your established tank to speed up the cycle.
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Old 03-25-2012, 09:23 PM   #4
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Hi Jlk and Mumma
@Jlk Ok showing my naiveness here... is HOB hang on the back filter? and what is a powerhead? I am seriously thinking of just getting another 400. Its not in my budget but nothing I have gotten so far is lol! I am using just plain dollar tree ammonia. There are no soaps or additives in it I am pretty sure its pure. Was too wiped out from work to do much for the new tank tonight as far as testing. Just treated my Biggie and changed his water.
@Mumma Yes I do have an established tank. I moved over most of the silk plants and a few decorations. I have been treating a fin rot issue on my large Black moor So my filter pads have been out for a week or so. It was during this time I had the opportunity to upgrade. I am in no rush and from what I have read patience is the key with fish less cycling. I am just so eternally grateful that I can turn to AA for advice. jlk has sort of become my goldfish GURU.
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Old 03-25-2012, 09:45 PM   #5
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Yep, hob is a hang on back filter! The dollar store is fine but I have encountered on other fishless threads that it seems a bit more dilute than some other brands. No big deal- just keep track of the amount you are dosing so you know how much is needed to reach 4ppm from 0.

Hmm..im not exactly sure how to explain a powerhead. They are not necessary as long as you have a few bubble wands or airstones for some extra aeration. They basically are a little motorized device that sucks in water & blows it out with force. Also called wavemakers though wm's are designed a bit differently- they are basically little enclosed fans that blow out water instead of air. Mine are directed so they blow against the glass at an angle to disperse across the tank. Bit excessive but I had them already so I use them. Dont know if this answers everything, but I hope it helps!
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Old 03-26-2012, 08:36 AM   #6
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Good Morning,
Thanks for the clarity again. I tested my water this morning. Ammonia is still holding at 4ppm Nitrites are still at 0. Todays question or concern is that As you suggested I tested the PH I am showing a High Range reading at 8.2 the regular PH test was off the chart. Is this normal or should I be taking a new step today?
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Old 03-26-2012, 09:05 AM   #7
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Do you know what your taps ph is? If not, put some tap in cup or bowl preferably with an airstone or bubbler & let it sit out overnight before testing. If you dont have an extra one, just give the water a good stir every so often to help it gas off. Let us know what this reads so we have a baseline for your ph. Theres nothing to worry about your ph right now & theres nothing that needs to be done other than keeping an eye on it.
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Old 03-26-2012, 03:00 PM   #8
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What fun setting up house can be..............I investigated the powerhead today. I found them at petco. Needless to say I picked one up. I was surprised how inexpensive they were. I think I paid 19.99 for a petco brand. I got the one for 40 to 60 gallons. Very easy to set up. I also picked up a new bubble wand the one I had was sort of puny this one is much more dramatic. Window shopped some goldfish and live plants. I was sort of enticed by the live bamboo. I have never had luck with live plants in my tank they always begin to decay within a few weeks. I decided to move over my river stones from my old tank to the new one was unsure if I wanted them or not but im sure the move will help the cycling process. Ohhh and I set aside a bowl of tap water to test in the morning no air stone to use but I have been stirring it on and off all day.
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Old 03-27-2012, 04:27 PM   #9
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Interesting Untreated tap water results
1.PH High Range 8.2
2.Ammonia somewhere between 0.25 and 0.50 color fell in-between.
3.Nitrite 0
4.Nitrate 0
I was surprised that my tap had such a high PH as well as the presence of ammonia. Is this out of the ordinary? So basically even when I do a PWC I am still putting some ammonia back into the tank.
On a lighter note I think I am beginning to see the first traces of Nitrite in the new tank. Color is on the verge of changing to 0.25 reading. Tomorrow will be one week since I dosed it up to 4ppm ammonia. Not seeing the ammonia begin to drop any just yet.
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Old 03-27-2012, 07:16 PM   #10
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Yes, your tap is fine. A ph of 8.2 is no big deal (mine is @ 8) & most fancy breeders prefer a higher ph. The amm in your tap will be devoured by your bb & prime will keep from causing any harm until its gone. I'm probably missing something but writing this from a new cell I haven't quite figured out yet (just got it) & my computer crashed yesterday beyond repair....
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