Great news, and then reality hit!

[kjwcpm]

Ok guys, I'm baffled now.

Went away on vacation. While I was away, the cycle completed. Had a few nitrates (<5 ppm), and zero ammonia and nitrites. Did a recheck of 4 ppm ammonia - cycled in 24 hours. Did a 90% PWC and all according to the guide looked good.

So stocked lightly with 6 zebra danios and 10 ghost shrimp. The shrimp have done ok, but 3 of the 6 danios are dead, and a 4th is looking weak. Ammonia and nitrites still read 0 (just checked again).

Ideas on what's up here?

 

[Bubble_B0y]

change in pH?

change in temperature?

 

[Bubble_B0y]

did you do a fishy cycle? or a fishLESS cycle?

a 90% water change wasn't necessary. Why did you do a water change after you completed cycling?

 

[eco23]

Since your levels are good and the tank is cycled, it's not related to any toxin spikes. How did you acclimate the fish? Is there any signs of illness on the fish? Any odd behavior?

 

[eco23]

a 90% water change wasn't necessary. Why did you do a water change after you completed cycling?

A massive pwc to reduce nitrAtes as low as possible before stocking after a fishless cycle is part of the process.

 

[kjwcpm]

Bubble_B0y:

A fishless cycle. Ph and temp may be issues. See my next reply to eco. And the PWC was based on eco's guide, for the reasons cited.

 

[kjwcpm]

eco - I'm thinking the acclimation may have been the problem. Again, newbie here so I'm trying to learn but seem prone to mistakes. I started with them in a bucket with the water from the LFS. I added about 15% of the LFS volume amount from my tank into the bucket every 15 minutes for an hour. After an hour I had 50% LFS water and 50% tank water. At that point, I transferred the fish to the tank.

No signs of disease or odd behavior, shy the sickness shown in fish #4 (who just expired).

The remaining two danios appear healthy, as do all of the ghost shrimp.

I'm assuming I watch the remaining fish carefully, and let things settle? Despite the fact danios like to school, I leave it at 2 for now right?

Once things seem balanced, what's the next step? Do I try to readd 4 danios to make a decent school? Or do I try a different fish instead?

BTW, current parameters are:

Ph: 7.4
Ammonia: 0
NO2: 0
NO3: 0 (or close to it)

Water appears clear, bubbles pop quickly on the surface, no bad odors from the tank. Shrimp are very active. Remaining two danios are swimming around well.

FYI - I also replaced the incandescent lights that came with the tank with CF's. The tank is very lightly planted with wisteria and java moss that seem healthy.

Thanks again for all the help!

 

[eco23]

The acclimation didn't seem bad. I personally prefer drip acclimating, but I'm just abundantly cautious.

I think the chances are that they were just weak from the store. It's not uncommon to lose fish when you first stock them. They've usually been shipped in boxes across the country, not being fed, poorly acclimated and thrown into a tank at the lfs, many times stocked full with incompatible fish. By the time they get to your home, they can be stressed, starving, and simply weak. It's sad, but it's very common. Shrimp are sensitive to water parameters and Danios are considered "hardy", so it's safe to say their home is perfectly safe according to that and also your readings.

Personally I'd try adding more fish from a different store if one is nearby. Your tank is cycled, and the bio-filter is in the strongest shape it will ever be in, so don't be afraid to add more fish unless there seems to be signs of illness in the tank. It's just one of the facts with first adding fish that you're bound to have a few bad apples. Sorry . It all gets better from here.

 

[kjwcpm]

The acclimation didn't seem bad. I personally prefer drip acclimating, but I'm just abundantly cautious.

I think the chances are that they were just weak from the store. It's not uncommon to lose fish when you first stock them. They've usually been shipped in boxes across the country, not being fed, poorly acclimated and thrown into a tank at the lfs, many times stocked full with incompatible fish. By the time they get to your home, they can be stressed, starving, and simply weak. It's sad, but it's very common. Shrimp are sensitive to water parameters and Danios are considered "hardy", so it's safe to say their home is perfectly safe according to that and also your readings.

Personally I'd try adding more fish from a different store if one is nearby. Your tank is cycled, and the bio-filter is in the strongest shape it will ever be in, so don't be afraid to add more fish unless there seems to be signs of illness in the tank. It's just one of the facts with first adding fish that you're bound to have a few bad apples. Sorry . It all gets better from here.

Thanks again eco! When looking at additional fish to stock, what types should I consider? More of the same zebra danios, or can I look at some of the others I've considered?

For example, a few have mentioned neon tetras. But I've also heard that neons do better in a more established tank - say around 6 months to a year old. I've also heard they really should have something bigger than a 10g tank because they are so active.

White cloud mountain minnows have been suggested. They're ok, but I guess they seem a little plain to me, especially if they're in with zebra danios as well.

I do like the look of bright colors. Glofish attract my attention, and I'd be ok with rasboras as well. Just looking for 10g approrpriate fish that can help avoid monotony.

 

[eco23]

Stocking definitely isn't my area of expertise...but a 10 gallon definitely limits your options a bit. Different types of Danios will shoal (not all types of Danios), but I have Glofish, Leopard and Zebra Danios together in my 46, and they all hang out together. My only concern is that even though 10 gallons is listed as their minimum, it's far from ideal for them. I've had Danios in my 10 gallon QT and they seemed cramped to me. Since you already have them, I'd up their number to the minimum schooling #, and you can mix and match which you like.

I've had nothing but horrible luck with Neons. I believe they're very overbred and weak in many cases. A lot of experienced hobbyists have given up on them, and I'm about to as well. Personally I wish I'd gone with something like Harlequin Rasboras, Cherry Barbs or Cardinal Tetras when I stocked my last tank.

Remember too that what you first stock tends to be what you're gonna have for the long run. For example, I initially bought 9 Neons. Over time 6 of them have died for unknown reasons, and since I can't just leave 3 alone I have to continue adding more even though it's a type of fish I really don't want to keep anymore. I like the fish...I just don't like the experiences I've had with them.

Pygmy Corys would be an awesome choice for a 10 gallon, IMO. There's a site called Aqadvisor.com which can give you some guidelines about what'll work, but it's mostly just for fun so don't take it's advice too seriously.

 

[TheCrazyFishLady]

Six zebra danios and ten ghost shrimp is not a light stock for a ten gallon. That's a lot of animals going into a small tank. I'm surprised there wasn't a spike. You may want to consider taking back the remaining two zebra danios, as they would be suited more to a larger tank than ten gallons. They are very active fish that need the extra swimming room. There are lots of other options for fish, many requiring a little extra time of searching for. I would not consider a ten gallon "limiting" you exactly. It's just that most pet stores, especially the chain ones, will carry more fish that are suited for the 20-55 gallon range, rather than a ten.

 

[kjwcpm]

Stocking definitely isn't my area of expertise...but a 10 gallon definitely limits your options a bit. Different types of Danios will shoal (not all types of Danios), but I have Glofish, Leopard and Zebra Danios together in my 46, and they all hang out together. My only concern is that even though 10 gallons is listed as their minimum, it's far from ideal for them. I've had Danios in my 10 gallon QT and they seemed cramped to me. Since you already have them, I'd up their number to the minimum schooling #, and you can mix and match which you like.

I've had nothing but horrible luck with Neons. I believe they're very overbred and weak in many cases. A lot of experienced hobbyists have given up on them, and I'm about to as well. Personally I wish I'd gone with something like Harlequin Rasboras, Cherry Barbs or Cardinal Tetras when I stocked my last tank.

Remember too that what you first stock tends to be what you're gonna have for the long run. For example, I initially bought 9 Neons. Over time 6 of them have died for unknown reasons, and since I can't just leave 3 alone I have to continue adding more even though it's a type of fish I really don't want to keep anymore. I like the fish...I just don't like the experiences I've had with them.

Pygmy Corys would be an awesome choice for a 10 gallon, IMO. There's a site called Aqadvisor.com which can give you some guidelines about what'll work, but it's mostly just for fun so don't take it's advice too seriously.

You may not consider yourself a stocking expert, but your advice is very helpful.

Maybe at this point I'll go with the Glofish to complete the danio school, then add raspboras, barbs or the pygmy corys. Only concern I have on the corys is I have a standard gravel substrate. Won't that surface be a bit to rough on the corys?

 

[eco23]

You may not consider yourself a stocking expert, but your advice is very helpful.

Maybe at this point I'll go with the Glofish to complete the danio school, then add raspboras, barbs or the pygmy corys. Only concern I have on the corys is I have a standard gravel substrate. Won't that surface be a bit to rough on the corys?

Crazyfishlady has a point that if returning the other 2 Danios is an option for you...it's not a bad one. My Danios take up a lot of room in my 46 gallon, and they do seem cramped when I've had them in my 10 gallon QT. I wouldn't keep them in there myself. Personally it's just hard for me to advise a committed hobbyist with a healthy tank to return fish they already have to an uncertain future (unless they're ridiculously incompatible). 10 is far from ideal and I wouldn't suggest Danios, but it's not the end of the world IMO...you never know where they'll end up otherwise.

Corys will be fine. The gravel aspect is overrated unless you have sharp substrate. I along with tons of other people have kept them with regular aquarium gravel and never had a problem.

As for adding more, I think if you kept the Danios and added Pygmy Corys...you're already stocked. There's not a lot of other options unless you want to run out and pick up a 20 gallon, and move everything over

 

[TheCrazyFishLady]

Crazyfishlady has a point that if returning the other 2 Danios is an option for you...it's not a bad one. My Danios take up a lot of room in my 46 gallon, and they do seem cramped when I've had them in my 10 gallon QT. I wouldn't keep them in there myself. Personally it's just hard for me to advise a committed hobbyist with a healthy tank to return fish they already have to an uncertain future (unless they're ridiculously incompatible). 10 is far from ideal and I wouldn't suggest Danios, but it's not the end of the world IMO...you never know where they'll end up otherwise.

Corys will be fine. The gravel aspect is overrated unless you have sharp substrate. I along with tons of other people have kept them with regular aquarium gravel and never had a problem.

As for adding more, I think if you kept the Danios and added Pygmy Corys...you're already stocked. There's not a lot of other options unless you want to run out and pick up a 20 gallon, and move everything over

I do agree with you there. Obviously, the OP has put in a good amount of effort and research, I was just throwing that out there. The danios might just be a bad stock, and it could be in his/her best interest to return the remaining two and consider new fish all together.

A ten would suffice, maybe even be incentive to upgrade in the future? If you are new, I'm sure you haven't met the money-burning friend called MTS. haha

 

[kjwcpm]

I do agree with you there. Obviously, the OP has put in a good amount of effort and research, I was just throwing that out there. The danios might just be a bad stock, and it could be in his/her best interest to return the remaining two and consider new fish all together.

A ten would suffice, maybe even be incentive to upgrade in the future? If you are new, I'm sure you haven't met the money-burning friend called MTS. haha

Thanks for the info. I think to keep the stocking topic from diverting form the original concern on this thread, I'll start a new one to focus on the stocking issue.